[mysticstryk]

I would give the edge to HE400S for vocals, but only so slightly. Fidelio X2, in my opinion, is the better headphone. I enjoy HE400S too, very good for the price, but X2 is better, no doubt about it. Then again I prefer X2 to pricier headphones such as Audeze EL-8, Oppo PM-2/3, Senn HD650/700. It just has the perfect sound signature for me.

I thought you were enjoying the 400s more than the x2 based on your initial impressions? What changed your opinion? I have my x2 burning in right now that I got during the amazon sale, but I was contemplating returning them for 400s or hd650.

 

[obsidyen]

I thought you were enjoying the 400s more than the x2 based on your initial impressions? What changed your opinion? I have my x2 burning in right now that I got during the amazon sale, but I was contemplating returning them for 400s or hd650.

It's good, I enjoy them when I use them. It's just I enjoy Fidelio X2 more.

Perhaps you'd enjoy HE400S more, but the moment I start listening to me with Fidelio X2, I think "Now that's how music should sound." They're both good, but for my tastes, X2 is great.
 
Now I certainly prefer X2 over HE400S and HD650 but I know people who prefer HD650 over X2. We all have different tastes. In my opinion though, X2 is better than the other two and wouldn't return it if I were you.

 

[john57]

Originally Posted by jkteddy77 /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
The HE-400i was too warm and lush for me
.
The 400i was far too closed and forward in terms of mids and soundstage. I want basically neutral, to maybe a slight bump in mids, with high treble extension (wish it had 560 treble). 
Bass still seemed clear and heavy enough for me in the 400i, and I'm assuming the HE-400S only betters that. Don't really miss the bass of the HE-400, but I did appreciate it. Not really a basshead, but it's always a welcome addition for me. I listen to strictly genres of more modern rock and metal genres, and some bass is needed for most of those genres.
I want a dark headphone with energy, and nothing I've heard does that better than the HE-400 so far from all cans I've heard.
The HE-400i never wowed me like the HE-400 did every time I put them on.
 
I truly think the HE-560 is the perfect signature for me by the sound of it (a neutral headphone, with the influences of a V-shaped signature with its sub-bass and treble extension) but my bank account says no to me. Used 560's are going down, so maybe one day. HE-400S for me now, can't wait to hear them.
 
Hifiman says they're coming from china + 3-5 days processing once they get my He-400i... so they'll arrive like next month I fear... 

 

I got all three headphones the 400i, 400S and then the original 400, just came in. The 400i even with a new cable that expanded the soundstage is still more closed than I like to hear with on location recordings of acoustical instruments. I would agree that the 400i is lushy warm and kind of dark and closed for my tastes. The 400i bass made it hard for me to pick out the details in the bass with heavy classical music. The 400S is much better for my needs. The 400 which I just got is very good. The 400 headband fit me just fine. I could later on get the snap-on headphone cushion for more comfort if needed. The HE400 weight at 440 grams is not too heavy for my head. The Audeze line like the LCD-X is too heavy for my needs at 100 grams more than the 400. The headband on the 400S I can not even feel it. The 400 has a bit more sharper bass slam than the 400S but both are very good. The 400 does need more power and the single ended connection on my OPPO HA-1 amp is struggling. The 400 just shines on my IFI audio Retro 50 amp. I will try next a balanced cable for the 400 and see if the OPPO will then have enough power to drive the 400. Not a issue with the 400S. The "straw that broke the camel back" on the 400i was dialog in movies. While the 400i is good for singing it is not as good as the 400 and the 400S for clarity for dialog in movies and on the web. The bass just is not as focused or a bit muddy for my needs. I will be returning the 400i.   

 

[mysticstryk]

It's good, I enjoy them when I use them. It's just I enjoy Fidelio X2 more. Perhaps you'd enjoy HE400S more, but the moment I start listening to me with Fidelio X2, I think "Now that's how music should sound." They're both good, but for my tastes, X2 is great.

Now I certainly prefer X2 over HE400S and HD650 but I know people who prefer HD650 over X2. We all have different tastes. In my opinion though, X2 is better than the other two and wouldn't return it if I were you.

Would you be so kind as too do a more detailed comparison? Maybe including the hd650 as well?

Stuff like:
Bass
Mids
Treble
Soundstage

I'm going to be powering them from a magni/modi uber stack.

It would be much appreciated! Gotta make my decision without having both with me.

 

[lofthanza]

I would give the edge to HE400S for vocals, but only so slightly. Fidelio X2, in my opinion, is the better headphone. I enjoy HE400S too, very good for the price, but X2 is better, no doubt about it. Then again I prefer X2 to pricier headphones such as Audeze EL-8, Oppo PM-2/3, Senn HD650/700 and even LCD-2. It just has the perfect sound signature for me. Glorious bass, engaging and fun sound signature, extended highs, superb soundstage... Yes there's some grain in highs and slightly recessed mids but no headphone is perfect. This level of greatness at $299 price is more than satisfactory.

The problem I have with planar magnetic headphones is that they feel closed-in. LCD headphones make me feel I'm in a vacuum seal, and while HE400S doesn't do that, it feels more like a closed headphone. I guess I just prefer the dynamic openness and dynamic headphones in general. I didn't know that about me before, but it seems I really enjoy an open, wide soundstage, a natural sound that feels like coming from speakers and not headphones. This is also why I really like Earsonics Velvet which has a massive soundstage for an IEM, even wider than many full size headphones. I'm going to stick to dynamic headphones from now on. Planars are not for me.

thank u sir for ur feedback!

 

[jincuteguy]

  This is also why I really like Earsonics Velvet which has a massive soundstage for an IEM, even wider than many full size headphones. 

 
Are you "sure" that the Earsonics Velvet IEM has a massive soundstage for an IEM and wider to many full size headphone? I always thought no matter which IEM , high end expensive or not, the soundstage of an IEM is no match for a full size headphone.
What about the Aurisonics ASG-2.5 compare to the Velvet in terms of soundstage? thx.

 

[jkteddy77]

 
 
The problem I have with planar magnetic headphones is that they feel closed-in. LCD headphones make me feel I'm in a vacuum seal, and while HE400S doesn't do that, it feels more like a closed headphone.

 
I find this odd, because the first planar I tried was the He-400, an that headphone sounded even wider than my DT990 did. Sound just circles your head.
It really depends on the planar. The HE-400i was like that though, sounded like a closed-back to me... large reason I returned it.\
I haven't tried any other planars than hifiman. I'm getting my the HE-400S in about a week, so maybe I can put my input in too.
 
If you've never heard the original HE-400, that may be the signature and soundstage you want. It does have worse build quality, but if you want a larger V-shape, the HE-400 will be right up your alley. Nothing has sounded wider and more naturally placed to me. Many times in Skype calls, I've mistaken the people I'm talking to as actually being in the room with me, and I scare myself xD
I still regret selling my HE-400, and might grab another if the HE-400S doesn't impress me. You just have to live with the comfort and poorly made springsteel headband...

 

[jkteddy77]

  I got all three headphones the 400i, 400S and then the original 400, just came in. The 400i even with a new cable that expanded the soundstage is still more closed than I like to hear with on location recordings of acoustical instruments. I would agree that the 400i is lushy warm and kind of dark and closed for my tastes. The 400i bass made it hard for me to pick out the details in the bass with heavy classical music. The 400S is much better for my needs. The 400 which I just got is very good. The 400 headband fit me just fine. I could later on get the snap-on headphone cushion for more comfort if needed. The HE400 weight at 440 grams is not too heavy for my head. The Audeze line like the LCD-X is too heavy for my needs at 100 grams more than the 400. The headband on the 400S I can not even feel it. The 400 has a bit more sharper bass slam than the 400S but both are very good. The 400 does need more power and the single ended connection on my OPPO HA-1 amp is struggling. The 400 just shines on my IFI audio Retro 50 amp. I will try next a balanced cable for the 400 and see if the OPPO will then have enough power to drive the 400. Not a issue with the 400S. The "straw that broke the camel back" on the 400i was dialog in movies. While the 400i is good for singing it is not as good as the 400 and the 400S for clarity for dialog in movies and on the web. The bass just is not as focused or a bit muddy for my needs. I will be returning the 400i.   

I've never had them A/B/C like that, but have owned the HE-400 and just returned my HE-400i as well.
I have very similar complaints as you, the HE-400i was just way too lush, it sounded exaggerated. I like exaggerated sound in the sense of color (a V-shape fan myself), but the HE-400i just felt like all of the instruments were blended together and they constantly fought over each other for the front. I think this is was largely due to that tiny soundstage. drove me nuts.
 
I now miss my HE-400, and my new HE-400S is on the way. 
I understand the 400 had large extended bass, recessed mids, and some high, sometimes sharp, treble extension.
The 400i seemed to have some decent bass extension, possibly being less rumbly, more of a quick bass (that still got cloudy if the mids butted in). It had some inflated mids and gently rolled off treble, but still had its sparkles.
No need to explain those two unless you heard it differently.
 
I'd love to know, which do you prefer sound quality and signature wise between the 400 and 400S? A/B, how different is the HE-400S in soundstage and tones (bass, mids, treble) from the 400's V-shape and the 400i's forward lush signature.. How would you describe it?
Do you find the HE-400S sounds closer to the signature of the 400 or the 400i?

 

[jkteddy77]

Please tell me Hifiman return policy. Is refund print paper a must? Do I have to pay for shipping back? I am in 30 days period seemingly and want to get my money back asap. Do they accept refund in 30 days no matter what the reason is like Amazon? Thanks in advance.

I have dealt with them lots.
I did in fact need to print out my receipt and sometimes other documentation to ship with them.
I would ask them if you could just forward them a copy to them and if that could suffice if you cannot print.
I'm not sure about the refund policy completely. They have never denied me, but every instance can be different. If it is within 30 says, I would let them know you are interested in a refund. The sooner you email the better, it can take them a couple days to respond. They've closed almost all of my cases in under a week however. Very nice customer service workers as well.

 

[obsidyen]

   
Are you "sure" that the Earsonics Velvet IEM has a massive soundstage for an IEM and wider to many full size headphone? I always thought no matter which IEM , high end expensive or not, the soundstage of an IEM is no match for a full size headphone.
What about the Aurisonics ASG-2.5 compare to the Velvet in terms of soundstage? thx.

Yes, I am. Earsonics Velvet has such a presentation that you feel like you're in a venue listening to live music. Very good soundstage. Certainly bigger than HE400S' soundstage. Unfortunately I have not heard Aurisonics ASG 2.5 so I cannot compare. IE800 is also another IEM that has a very big soundstage (sort of like a mini HD800) but I didn't like the sibilant treble and lean sound signature that it had.

 

[john57]

  I've never had them A/B/C like that, but have owned the HE-400 and just returned my HE-400i as well.
I have very similar complaints as you, the HE-400i was just way too lush, it sounded exaggerated. I like exaggerated sound in the sense of color (a V-shape fan myself), but the HE-400i just felt like all of the instruments were blended together and they constantly fought over each other for the front. I think this is was largely due to that tiny soundstage. drove me nuts.
 
I now miss my HE-400, and my new HE-400S is on the way. 
I understand the 400 had large extended bass, recessed mids, and some high, sometimes sharp, treble extension.
The 400i seemed to have some decent bass extension, possibly being less rumbly, more of a quick bass (that still got cloudy if the mids butted in). It had some inflated mids and gently rolled off treble, but still had its sparkles.
No need to explain those two unless you heard it differently.
 
I'd love to know, which do you prefer sound quality and signature wise between the 400 and 400S? A/B, how different is the HE-400S in soundstage and tones (bass, mids, treble) from the 400's V-shape and the 400i's forward lush signature.. How would you describe it?
Do you find the HE-400S sounds closer to the signature of the 400 or the 400i?

All the three models I have tried 400, 400i and 400S are quite different. The 400S is somewhat in some ways more like the 400 than the 400i. I would also say that I also heard the 560 which is more rich not lushy sounding as compared to the 400i.  At first I like the 400i but as time goes by it drove me nuts.  The 400S on the other hand grew on me. The 400S has a brighter airy tone as compared to the 400i. Already have a balanced cable for the 400S and it works just great. The soundstage became more what I am used to in unamplified concerts. Already pack up my 400i to send back. I am keeping the 400 and the 400S since both have strengths that I like.  

 

[richard51]

i like my he 400 like a demon love hell for a few weeks now (after 2 years of ownership more than my basic stax in fact )..... try the sorbothane mod.... and discover the flaw that plagued all headphones and how to remedy them all....

for a few bucks, reversible mod, and the most easy mod ....that transform completely my he 400, there are  now not v-shaped but u-shaped with less recessed mids, and a soundstage very detailed...
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/744839/damping-mechanical-resonance-distortion-of-stax-phones-with-sorbothane-lambdas-srxiii-pro-sr003-sr00-the-sigma-and-various-non-stax

 

[obsidyen]

  All the three models I have tried 400, 400i and 400S are quite different. The 400S is somewhat in some ways more like the 400 than the 400i. I would also say that I also heard the 560 which is more rich not lushy sounding as compared to the 400i.  At first I like the 400i but as time goes by it drove me nuts.  The 400S on the other hand grew on me. The 400S has a brighter airy tone as compared to the 400i. Already have a balanced cable for the 400S and it works just great. The soundstage became more what I am used to in unamplified concerts. Already pack up my 400i to send back. I am keeping the 400 and the 400S since both have strengths that I like.  

What kind of balanced cable are you using if I may ask? Brand, model etc?..
 
At first HE400S sounded balanced compared to Fidelio X2, but I must say HE400S has quite respectable bass on its own. There's certainly a bass boost, but it's the good kind of boost. I don't know how it compares to HE400's bass though as I have never heard that headphone.

 

[john57]

I am using the cable made by ela-audio on Ebay. Like this one.
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/221647328564?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
 
Yes the HD700 uses the same cable as the OPPO headphones which in turn is the same for the HE400S. I just went for the cheaper one in which you can choose color, length and termination. Mine is sliver gray like the photo. No reason for me to get silver wire version over copper since the HE400S has good treble.

 

[jincuteguy]

So I see you guys been comparing the X2 and He-400s.  Doesn't the planar magnetic always sound better? Like if they're both the same price, wouldn't ppl just buy the HE-400s one? Im just confused cause I always thought planar magnetic is better than dynamic .