[bagwell359]

When I am at a live musical event with unamplified instruments/voices, I never think "I would like more bass here or less treble there", etc. (though bad room acoustics can introduce annoying selective resonances). The sound comes very natural and complete. Quality recordings are usually very well balanced as any corrections needed are applied during mixing/mastering. Engineers are not thoughtless and very often do their job exhaustively, taking into account any possible unbalances of their systems. Appreciating and enjoying all this preceding work is easier with accurate and balanced transducers. Neutrality is not just a "medium" flavor, it is the means that gives the highest possibility to have the most natural and pleasing listening experience. It may not win short term in the listening room of a shop, but it will be the most impressive and successful "balance" in the long term, especially if the musical tastes of the listener vary. Also, a listener can be educated how to have the best listening experience and an unfatiguing one. Live, unamplified music can do that too. Preferences of course vary but not as widely as we like to think among experienced or "educated" listeners. (A quick examble: almost all users of the HD-6## or HD-800S would like it to have more sub-bass weight to become better balanced, not at the expense of loosing other virtues, of course, but as naturally as possible.) I believe that a neutral headphone/listening, neutral before or after EQing, can serve most "audiophiles" better and offer the most pleasant sessions.
This is what serious manufacturers are generally trying to achieve with their most advanced headphones, but sometimes winning more sales demands a more "impressive" or "fun" first listening.

Very good piece.

 

[spruce]

Whatever very initial first impressions are worth I picked up the NDH30 after being intrigued by some of these posts. I was somewhat surprised by how light they are and these have really nice (light/sturdy) build quality and thoughtful ergonomic design. The timbre is natural, very much like my Shure 1840. Off the bat, I prefer the treble on the NDH30 versus the 1840 and I also seem to be hearing more nuanced imaging and separation with these than I get on the 1840--perhaps a more layered production of sound for example. I was listening to both with my Mojo 2 and when I plugged the NDH30 into my Ifi iSignature it seemed to breath more life into them in some very enjoyable ways, like plugging the 6XX into a tube amp for example.

I think the best thing I can probably say is I have no intention of returning these at the moment, and if I do, I'll update my post. If you're looking for something with this type of linear sound profile I would recommend giving them a try. They definitely sound very enjoyable and musical for casual listening in my opinion and I think they'll be a great addition to my other headphones.

 

[plyr]

Is something wrong with Apple Music? I'm testing Spotify and everything sounds different.

 

[jamesjames]

I too picked up the NDH 30 and I've been very impressed. I've had a chance to compare them with my other phones and here are some very brief initial impressions - for what they're worth. The other phones are: MySphere 3.2, Audio Technica ADX5000, AKG K812, Sennheiser HD800, Beyerdyamic T1 (1st). I'll add further comments if anything changes. I've been listening to some well recorded string quartets and some smaller orchestral music.

First, and generally, the NDH 30 is very fine I think, but not as appealing to me as any of my other phones. I find I agree very closely with the assessments made in the SOS review - linear and natural and satisfying - the bass is surprisingly present and clear - it presents an impressively layered image. The area where I find the NDH 30 less engaging is in its creation of a three-dimensional performance space apparently in front of me. All of my other phones are more convincing in this regard - although all with slightly different takes on 'natural'.

Surprisingly, I find the NDH 30 has more in common with the MySphere than my other phones. I find the MySphere similarly avoids any suggestion of high-frequency accentuation or splash. The MySphere, however, is more open and airy (although it must be said the MySphere is the airiest and most open phone I've heard). As with my other phones, it also strikes me as more refined, more delicate. Listening to the MySphere caused me to wonder whether the unembellished, 'immediate' presentation of the NDH 30 can sometimes work against depth imaging.

The AKG, Sennheiser and Beyerdynamic create appreciably deeper performance spaces, with added brilliance in terms of their presentation. Whether this brilliance is more natural is something, I think, that would divide listeners. I find some of this quality is helpful in creating the illusion of a live performance - and so can help with realism - but others may take a different view. The Audio Technica is, to my mind, the most impressive of my phones in terms of high-frequency delicacy and adds a dimension that I miss with the NDH 30.

The Beyerdynamic - which I've always loved - has probably the 'lightest' character of the phones I own but nevertheless - to my ear - presents a more convincing image of acoustic instruments. Once again, I can well imagine others taking a different view.

While I no longer own Focal Utopia, Hifiman HE1000SE or Stax SR-009S phones, I have owned them. In one way or another they seemed to me less convincing in presenting a natural performance space. While obviously a personal opinion, I'm confident I could live much more happily with the NDH 30 than any of these phones.

Edited slightly above, to better explain the comparison with the MySphere.

Further edit (9 May 2023): I can now add a personal point or two regarding comparison with the HD800S. My impression (for what it's worth) is that the HD800 series (including the HD800S) has been 'refined' from time to time without public statements from Sennheiser. I happen to think the current HD800S is the best of the series to date - with a little more refinement than the early HD800S (at least the one I owned) and better texture and timbre than the HD800 (early or late). I think it shares with the NDH 30 (and the MySphere) particularly low levels of resonance - much lower than most phones. And I speculate this contributes quite a bit to the clear, natural sound these phones deliver. In addition, the HD800S and the Neumann employ frequency selective absorbers to further reduce resonance. And I think there's a distinct family resemblance. Excellent imaging and separation without undue high frequency energy. The difference I think is that the HD800S images better, with better timbre for acoustic instruments. I don't hear better low frequency extension with the Neumann. I do hear more delicacy with the HD800S. I think you will like the Neumann if you like the HD800S, and vice versa - although I think the HD800S is the better performer (and one of the best available at any price).

Final edit (10 May 2023): To my ears, the only other competitive model I know is the Sony MDR MA900. It's not current, and I mention it only because it's one of the few I think can match the Neumann. In fact, like the others mentioned above, I would prefer it on grounds of better imaging in particular. But that's an area I think where others might take a different view. The Sony can still be had for a few hundred dollars second hand - so a good deal if you like them. There's a thread on this site if you're interested.

 

[erics75]

I too picked up the NDH 30 and I've been very impressed. I've had a chance to compare them with my other phones and here are some very brief initial impressions - for what they're worth. The other phones are: MySphere 3.2, Audio Technica ADX5000, AKG K812, Sennheiser HD800, Beyerdyamic T1 (1st). I'll add further comments if anything changes. I've been listening to some well recorded string quartets and some smaller orchestral music.

First, and generally, the NDH 30 is very fine I think, but not as appealing to me as any of my other phones. I find I agree very closely with the assessments made in the SOS review - linear and natural and satisfying - the bass is surprisingly present and clear - it presents an impressively layered image. The area where I find the NDH 30 less engaging is in its creation of a three-dimensional performance space apparently in front of me. All of my other phones are more convincing in this regard - although all with slightly different takes on 'natural'.

Surprisingly, I find the NDH 30 has more in common with the MySphere than my other phones. I find the MySphere similarly avoids any suggestion of high-frequency accentuation or splash. The MySphere, however, is more open and airy (although it must be said the MySphere is airiest and most open phone I've heard). As with my other phones, it also strikes me as more refined, more delicate. The very direct character of the NDH 30 can tend, I think, to seem a little unremitting and unrefined on occasion.

The AKG, Sennheiser and Beyerdynamic create appreciably deeper performance spaces, with added brilliance in terms of their presentation. Whether this brilliance is more natural is something, I think, that would divide listeners. I find some of this quality is helpful in creating the illusion of a live performance - and so can help with realism - but others may take a different view. The Audio Technica is, to my mind, the most impressive of my phones in terms of high-frequency delicacy and adds a dimension that miss with the NDH 30.

The Beyerdynamic - which I've always loved - has probably the 'lightest' character of the phones I own but nevertheless - to my ear - presents a more convincing image of acoustic instruments. Once again, I can well imagine others taking a different view.

While I no longer own Focal Utopia, Hifiman HE1000SE or Stax SR-009S phones, I have owned them. In one way or another they seemed to me less convincing in presenting a natural performance space. While obviously a personal opinion, I'm confident I could live much more happily with the NDH 30 than any of these phones.

Thank you for the impressions! If you were to ignore soundstage, how would the 30 stack up to your other headphones from a tone, timbre, resolution, and separation standpoint? I'd be be especially interested in how it and the hd800 compare as that's the one i'm most familiar with. i'm also dying to try the adx5000, so jealous of that one. nice lineup!

 

[jamesjames]

Actually, I find that hard to answer. I'm coming around to the view that timbre in particular is affected by the apparent dimensionality of the sound. Perhaps a concrete example would help. One of the string quartets I listened to in order to compare the phones was the very famous string quartet by Ravel. The second movement involves violins and a cello playing pizzicato. Listening to this across the range of phones I was reminded once again that the apparent timbre of the instruments was a product of the snap and then decay of the note into an apparently three-dimensional space. The AKG K812 - which I think is quite magical in this regard - created an extraordinary illusion of the instruments and their timbre - which the NDH 30 couldn't match. That said, it may well be that frequency charts of the two phones would be very similar. I'm inclined to think that - at this very high level of quality - differences in timbre are directly related to the nature of the image that's being created. FWIW, I think the HD800 and the T1 are a little less sophisticated than my other phones in presenting this performance space - although still excellent I think. So I feel the Neumann is probably closer to these phones than the others - but it seems to me we are dealing with a high degree of subjectivity here - so not convinced this is terribly reliable. At this level, it's hard to avoid the conclusion that you need to hear phones side by side - and decide which package just sounds 'right'.

 

[headstef]

As more and more users are coming to test this headphones now, It might be useful once again to remind that they sound as they should only with the cable on the right.
If the headphone is put in reverse on the head (L to R) the sound is altered considerably because of the off-centered and inclined drivers. (It happened here before and also to one or two youtube "reviewers", clearly seen to wear them backwards. For the same reason the headband must be on the top of the head.
The wrong way results to significant loss of higher mids and higher treble or "air", as described in detail and measured in this post (#229):

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/neumann-ndh-30.963439/page-16#post-17236966

I think Neumann should have used more visible L-R indication letters on these cans.
(I apologize to those following this thread from its start for the repetition).

 

[indigogo]

I too picked up the NDH 30 and I've been very impressed. I've had a chance to compare them with my other phones and here are some very brief initial impressions - for what they're worth. The other phones are: MySphere 3.2, Audio Technica ADX5000, AKG K812, Sennheiser HD800, Beyerdyamic T1 (1st). I'll add further comments if anything changes. I've been listening to some well recorded string quartets and some smaller orchestral music.

First, and generally, the NDH 30 is very fine I think, but not as appealing to me as any of my other phones. I find I agree very closely with the assessments made in the SOS review - linear and natural and satisfying - the bass is surprisingly present and clear - it presents an impressively layered image. The area where I find the NDH 30 less engaging is in its creation of a three-dimensional performance space apparently in front of me. All of my other phones are more convincing in this regard - although all with slightly different takes on 'natural'.

Surprisingly, I find the NDH 30 has more in common with the MySphere than my other phones. I find the MySphere similarly avoids any suggestion of high-frequency accentuation or splash. The MySphere, however, is more open and airy (although it must be said the MySphere is the airiest and most open phone I've heard). As with my other phones, it also strikes me as more refined, more delicate. The very direct character of the NDH 30 can tend, I think, to seem a little unremitting and unrefined on occasion.

The AKG, Sennheiser and Beyerdynamic create appreciably deeper performance spaces, with added brilliance in terms of their presentation. Whether this brilliance is more natural is something, I think, that would divide listeners. I find some of this quality is helpful in creating the illusion of a live performance - and so can help with realism - but others may take a different view. The Audio Technica is, to my mind, the most impressive of my phones in terms of high-frequency delicacy and adds a dimension that I miss with the NDH 30.

The Beyerdynamic - which I've always loved - has probably the 'lightest' character of the phones I own but nevertheless - to my ear - presents a more convincing image of acoustic instruments. Once again, I can well imagine others taking a different view.

While I no longer own Focal Utopia, Hifiman HE1000SE or Stax SR-009S phones, I have owned them. In one way or another they seemed to me less convincing in presenting a natural performance space. While obviously a personal opinion, I'm confident I could live much more happily with the NDH 30 than any of these phones.

Excuse me, can I ask you what are well-recorded string quartets and small orchestral music for you? If it's not difficult for you, give a name or a link to the source.
Even these two well-recorded quartets cannot frighten and load more than 30% of the potential of these three excellent phones (NDH 30, ADX5000, AKG K812) There is no significant difference in sound on such examples. This is not the kind of music and recording on which you can test such high-level headphones.
As a rule, such music are recorded on a stereo pair with standard placements and standard sound processing. There can be no talk of any multi-layered sound, bass features or three-dimensional space, refinement and delicacy of sound.
You describe the ADX5000 as a headphone that adds delicacy to the high frequencies and the dimension that is lacking in the NDH 30 compared to the ADX5000. Note - ADX5000 ADDS to the original audio recording what is not in it...
I think you need to spend more time with NDH 30 listening to more complex and technically complex and mixed music. In order to understand what really are the differences between these three phones.
The ADX5000 and AKG K812 are excellent headphones, I've spent a lot of time listening and working with them. And I always have them on hand in my neighboring studio. BUT they are excellent not for the money for which they are sold.
NDH 30 are new headphones with a new design and a fundamentally different approach to sound playback. This approach is called the exact but musical reproduction of the sound recording as it is in the original. And this approach is now gaining momentum and will soon be in trend.
In order to truly understand and feel this, you will need to spend more time with them.

By the way, on these two recordings, NDH 30 plays high frequencies so cleanly and delicately and just as voluminously and three-dimensionally - that more than that would already be unnatural and indecent)))

Takacs Quartet - Hough, Dutilleux, Ravel_String Quartets (2023) [24-96]
Talich Quartet - Debussy, Ravel- String Quartets (2012) [24-96]

 

[headstef]

To be fair, my investor's - musical equipment is a passion and a hobby, as are many of you here. He had a lot of very expensive equipment including several top planars and electrostats at the most indecently expensive cost.
When the NDH 30 appeared, we took the time to compare it with these planars and electrostats and came to the mutual conclusion that it is urgent to sell all these planars and electrostats before their prices have fallen significantly.

The test involved two total fanatical audiophiles and myself. One of them is a very high level musician. The main conclusions were:

1. NDH 30 - give the most accurate and musical sound that touches the senses and deep soul strings)
2. NDH 30 - reproduce any musical genre and style at the highest level. There is no need to have multiple headphones for different music genres.
3. None of the headphones on this planet can give such an accurate, open and at the same time such a deeply sensual sound.
4. The price for top planars and electrostats is artificially increased by about 3 to 5 times compared to the sound they give.
5. After listening to the NDH 30 once with a truly high-quality source, there is no longer any desire and sense to listen to other headphones. At least this is relevant for those who like to listen to music and not drool on "modern and advanced technologies")))

Not enough to say that these two crazy and devoted audiophiles were shocked and of course extreme surprised. I was ready for such a sharp turn - so I was fine, don't worry) I had to urgently give them sedatives and tell them that everything will be fine and so that they can control themselves)))

There is a lot more to write - but it's pointless for those who are blinded by advertising and technical details and not by sound and music))) And most importantly - they don't want to face the truth)))

I think that if those two colleagues of yours are really "total fanatical... crazy and devoted audiophiles" as you say, with one of them a very high level musician, they should come here to write their own impressions and comparisons. Why haven't they?

 

[indigogo]

I think that if those two colleagues of yours are really "total fanatical... crazy and devoted audiophiles" as you say, with one of them a very high level musician, they should come here to write their own impressions and comparisons. Why haven't they?

To be honest, they think I'm crazy because I'm writing here and they think I'm just wasting my time. For this reason, they are unlikely to appear here)))

 

[jamesjames]

Excuse me, can I ask you what are well-recorded string quartets and small orchestral music for you? If it's not difficult for you, give a name or a link to the source.
Even these two well-recorded quartets cannot frighten and load more than 30% of the potential of these three excellent phones (NDH 30, ADX5000, AKG K812) There is no significant difference in sound on such examples. This is not the kind of music and recording on which you can test such high-level headphones.
As a rule, such music are recorded on a stereo pair with standard placements and standard sound processing. There can be no talk of any multi-layered sound, bass features or three-dimensional space, refinement and delicacy of sound.
You describe the ADX5000 as a headphone that adds delicacy to the high frequencies and the dimension that is lacking in the NDH 30 compared to the ADX5000. Note - ADX5000 ADDS to the original audio recording what is not in it...
I think you need to spend more time with NDH 30 listening to more complex and technically complex and mixed music. In order to understand what really are the differences between these three phones.
The ADX5000 and AKG K812 are excellent headphones, I've spent a lot of time listening and working with them. And I always have them on hand in my neighboring studio. BUT they are excellent not for the money for which they are sold.
NDH 30 are new headphones with a new design and a fundamentally different approach to sound playback. This approach is called the exact but musical reproduction of the sound recording as it is in the original. And this approach is now gaining momentum and will soon be in trend.
In order to truly understand and feel this, you will need to spend more time with them.

By the way, on these two recordings, NDH 30 plays high frequencies so cleanly and delicately and just as voluminously and three-dimensionally - that more than that would already be unnatural and indecent)))

Takacs Quartet - Hough, Dutilleux, Ravel_String Quartets (2023) [24-96]
Talich Quartet - Debussy, Ravel- String Quartets (2012) [24-96]

Hello. Happy to provide details on the music.

Debussy, Ravel String Quartets - Jerusalem Quartet - Harmonia Mundi 2018
Purcell, Locke, Haydn Quartets - Kitgut Quartet - Harmonia Mundi 2020
Beethoven String Quartets - Hagen Quartet - Myrios 2013
Seraph (Tine Thing Heltheth, Trumpet - Ewazen, Wallin, Macmillan, et al) - Ensemble Allegria - LAWO - 2022
In Schubert's Company (Rysanov, Viola - Schubert, Akhunov, et al) - Riga Sinfonietta - Onyx - 2017

 

[NickedWicked]

How does this compare to the 800S? The Sennheiser is 2 times the price. Do I lose the low end that much? Does the Neumann really piss on 800S territory? I'm afraid to spend that much on a 800S and not place it on a throne...

I wouldn't say the HD800S is worth double, but it is still a special headphone after all these years. I posted here like 2 months ago since I was jokingly questioning whether the NDH 30 would be a good competitor/replacement to the HD800S and surprisingly it is.

The NDH 30 isn't as extremely airy and open sounding as the HD800S yet maintains a lot of the same detail retrieval, it has the same microscopic sound just without being forced. Same goes for soundstage, where it performs very similar to the HD800S, perhaps more comparible to the Hifiman Arya, as it has similar height, depth and width, which scales with the source material, small room recording (small sound), grand hall recording (sounds very spacious) etc. Whereas the HD800S tends to force the soundstage, breaking some recordings in the process.

Bass is way more prevalent in the NDH 30, but it is IMO an acquired taste, the lean bass on the HD800S can also sound very nice and clean and from what I've heard it was done intentionally so the bass wouldn't bleed into the mids so we get these exceptionally clean sounding mids and top end on the HD800S. I can appreciate both, it just takes some time getting used to the different sound signatures.

All in all I think the NDH 30 is the better allrounder, but like I said the HD800S will remain an exceptional headphone that has it's own role that no brand is willing to fill / compete against as of yet.

 

[glpsace]

I keep getting confused by what is being discussed, especially when comparing to audiophile HP, like a user kindly presented a few posts back.

If we are discussing the NDH 30 as a studio monitor and the way it reproduces music as "intended" originally, personally I couldn't care less because I'm no professional and listen to enjoy music.

If we are discussing the NDH 30 as a HP suited for audiophile and hobby enjoyment listening, then I'm interested for sure.

It seems that these 2 realities seem to be confused and discriminatory chosen depending which will suit best on a particular answer or discussion.

 

[Hifiearspeakers]

I keep getting confused by what is being discussed, especially when comparing to audiophile HP, like a user kindly presented a few posts back.

If we are discussing the NDH 30 as a studio monitor and the way it reproduces music as "intended" originally, personally I couldn't care less because I'm no professional and listen to enjoy music.

If we are discussing the NDH 30 as a HP suited for audiophile and hobby enjoyment listening, then I'm interested for sure.

It seems that these 2 realities seem to be confused and discriminatory chosen depending which will suit best on a particular answer or discussion.

You’re confused because there are people in here who don’t have a clue what they’re talking about and keep spouting off opinions as if they’re facts.

 

[headstef]

I keep getting confused by what is being discussed, especially when comparing to audiophile HP, like a user kindly presented a few posts back.

If we are discussing the NDH 30 as a studio monitor and the way it reproduces music as "intended" originally, personally I couldn't care less because I'm no professional and listen to enjoy music.

If we are discussing the NDH 30 as a HP suited for audiophile and hobby enjoyment listening, then I'm interested for sure.

It seems that these 2 realities seem to be confused and discriminatory chosen depending which will suit best on a particular answer or discussion.

Since I have already expressed my views regarding to this a few posts above, I will only say that I cannot think of anything more truly audiophile than an accurate, well balanced, detailed, comfortable headphone. This is exactly what a reference, pro-headphone must be and also what an audiophile/consumer headphone must be. No discrepancy at all for me.
Of course, an "audiophile" oriented headphone can be completed or ornamented with all kinds of luxuries and fancy cables, anything that will raise its cost significantly (and proud of ownership) but very unlikely to alter its sound.