[ecohifi]

Yes, I can confirm it has an XMOS chip for USB, but the s/pdif is still streaks ahead of the USB, the USB on the M51 lets it down, thats why an AP2 or OR4/5 will take it to the next step!

 

[Somnambulist]

Yes, that's what I thought - hence the desire for a USB to s/pdif, although as I was musing, taking advantage of that I2S connection would in theory be even better, it's just I can't seem to find a USB to I2S converter that's not super expensive. W4S and indeed NAD have their music server devices which do have the I2S outputs but I'm not paying $2500 USD for a streamer when my set up is computer > DAC > speakers.
 
There's an HK site/store that sell a Squeezebox Touch modded with an I2S output, but I'd need to read more about how direct the output in, as from what I've read the idea behind I2S is it's a minimal signal path between board and DAC, reducing any muck that can creep in.
 
At this rate I'll probably just go for USB to s/pdif, although ideally I'd like one with AES/EBU due to it being the best input on the NAD (from what I can see). I know the Stello U3 has that but it doesn't seem to be held in as high regard as the AP, which is pretty expensive and even more so w/PP mod. The OR can do I2S and AES but it's very expensive. Gah.

 

[arnaud]

I believe the latest Audio-Gd Digital Interface can provide I2S output optionally, you need to pay something like 3 cents for the board and plug it in yourself or something like that.

 

[Somnambulist]

Thanks. It looks like it's using an RJ45 connection though, the NAD does I2S over HDMI. Not sure if there's a way to make that work currently. Stupid various I2S standards!

 

[Telstar]

Quote:

Yes, that's what I thought - hence the desire for a USB to s/pdif, although as I was musing, taking advantage of that I2S connection would in theory be even better, it's just I can't seem to find a USB to I2S converter that's not super expensive.

Google for:
-xmos reference board
-waveIO
 
both under 150$.

 

[dwk]

Quote:

Yes, that's what I thought - hence the desire for a USB to s/pdif, although as I was musing, taking advantage of that I2S connection would in theory be even better, it's just I can't seem to find a USB to I2S converter that's not super expensive. W4S and indeed NAD have their music server devices which do have the I2S outputs but I'm not paying $2500 USD for a streamer when my set up is computer > DAC > speakers.
 
 

 
I'm still in the camp that is dubious that the M51 actually supports I2S-on-hdmi, but Channel Islands has an upcoming USB device that is multi-purpose. It has a built-in Wolfson DAC, spdif out, plus I2S out on either the HDMI connector or via the old Audio Alchemy mini-din. $695 from what was posted over on AudioCircle, and should be available in the reasonably near future.  I'd guess that a diy solution for the hdmi connector might be a bit of a challenge since I think it uses LVDS - not impossible to diy, but not for the newbie.  
 
What's the deal with the NAD M50 anyway? I can't find the product listing on the NAD site at all - searching for 'm50' doesnt' even return the M51 page despite it being mentioned. Is it an actual product, or is it vaporware? (not that I'm in the market for it, but was curious as to how they present the feature set.)

 

[RichardSantiago]

Sonambulist
 
We've not tried the M51 with and i2s but can't see how it would work unless they've done something particularly clever - HDMI and i2s look the same but are wired differently, would be very interested if anybody has experience of the M51 with i2s (don't have an i2s source component to play with our demo M51)

 

[Somnambulist]

'Audiophile' music servers make me sad. The M50 is like $2499, with the matching M52 digital valut (i.e. a mirrored RAID array in a nice case) $1499 or something. The full triple Masters stack therefore is well past $5k. Same for W4S's one and a few others I've seen. I think making your own dedicated NAS for music, run by a computer hooked up to a good usb converter into a DAC is less attractive visually but WAY more affordable (even with an Off Ramp or something).
 
Quote:

 
I'm still in the camp that is dubious that the M51 actually supports I2S-on-hdmi, but Channel Islands has an upcoming USB device that is multi-purpose. It has a built-in Wolfson DAC, spdif out, plus I2S out on either the HDMI connector or via the old Audio Alchemy mini-din. $695 from what was posted over on AudioCircle, and should be available in the reasonably near future.  I'd guess that a diy solution for the hdmi connector might be a bit of a challenge since I think it uses LVDS - not impossible to diy, but not for the newbie.  
 
What's the deal with the NAD M50 anyway? I can't find the product listing on the NAD site at all - searching for 'm50' doesnt' even return the M51 page despite it being mentioned. Is it an actual product, or is it vaporware? (not that I'm in the market for it, but was curious as to how they present the feature set.)

 

[Somnambulist]

Hmm, their Data sheet for the M51 says the following:
 
 

[size=9.000000pt]HDMI provides an encrypted HD Audio connection in PCM’s native I2S format up to 24 bit 192kHz. [/size]

 
That's it. Could some people have taken it to mean "does i2S over HDMI" when it's not saying that specifically? Probably. Decent s/pdif converter it may well be then... unless I pay like double the M51's cost for a Perfectwa... ya that's not going to happen.
 
Quote:

Sonambulist
 
We've not tried the M51 with and i2s but can't see how it would work unless they've done something particularly clever - HDMI and i2s look the same but are wired differently, would be very interested if anybody has experience of the M51 with i2s (don't have an i2s source component to play with our demo M51)

 

[DaveBSC]

Quote:

'Audiophile' music servers make me sad. The M50 is like $2499, with the matching M52 digital valut (i.e. a mirrored RAID array in a nice case) $1499 or something. The full triple Masters stack therefore is well past $5k. Same for W4S's one and a few others I've seen. I think making your own dedicated NAS for music, run by a computer hooked up to a good usb converter into a DAC is less attractive visually but WAY more affordable (even with an Off Ramp or something).

 
I understand the appeal of an Olive or Aurender or Bladelius. You just load your files and go, there's no need to worry about shutting off unnecessary services or whether you're using the right type of output mode. The downside is that they cost 3X as much as a home built PC server, and (at least according to Computer Audiophile) don't sound as good.
 
A product like the Auraliti PK-90 USB meets the consumer in the middle. The hardware and software work is all done for you, but the value is still there, and you can control it without the need for a monitor as with the expensive one piece servers.

 

[orkney]

Great review of the M51 in July's S'phile, including detailed measurements by JA that seem to confirm the design brief.
 
o
 

 

[Somnambulist]

I can understand the appeal, especially for those who do the listening room thing more and want to just sit in a chair well away from their rack. I tend to listen at my desk w/active speakers either side, and as such am happy to control playback via the computer. I wouldn't mind something like computer > squeezebox touch (EDO mod + better PSU) w/a dedicated mirrored array running SB Server > USB to AES/EBU converter > DAC > speaker for myself. It's decoupled from the computer so bypasses the Mac's OS so no need for Amarra etc, can take iTunes playlists and so on.
 
Think that'd do it for me.
 
Quote:

 
I understand the appeal of an Olive or Aurender or Bladelius. You just load your files and go, there's no need to worry about shutting off unnecessary services or whether you're using the right type of output mode. The downside is that they cost 3X as much as a home built PC server, and (at least according to Computer Audiophile) don't sound as good.
 
A product like the Auraliti PK-90 USB meets the consumer in the middle. The hardware and software work is all done for you, but the value is still there, and you can control it without the need for a monitor as with the expensive one piece servers.

 

[dwk]

Quote:

I can understand the appeal, especially for those who do the listening room thing more and want to just sit in a chair well away from their rack. I tend to listen at my desk w/active speakers either side, and as such am happy to control playback via the computer. I wouldn't mind something like computer > squeezebox touch (EDO mod + better PSU) w/a dedicated mirrored array running SB Server > USB to AES/EBU converter > DAC > speaker for myself. It's decoupled from the computer so bypasses the Mac's OS so no need for Amarra etc, can take iTunes playlists and so on.
 
Think that'd do it for me.
 

I tried the 'audiophile desktop' style setup and didn't really like it. I found that with the computer there it was a constant distraction and I ended up dicking around on the computer rather than just listening.  I was hoping that the M51 would be supported by the SB Touch EDO mod, but as it stands it is not - apparently NAD uses an extended descriptor that isn't supported by Linux. So, I'm now deciding between SBTouch via spdif, SBTouch w/ usb->spdif converter, or pc via either usb or usb->spdif.  I'm currently leaning towards the latter since it provides the ability to eq which is beneficial to bring the bottom end of my Stax up a bit.
 Either way though, sitting on the couch with a tablet as the interface/remote is where I'm headed rather than sitting in front of the computer.  Guess we'll see how that works out

 

[Somnambulist]

Heh, as it goes my 'desktop' set up is more a midfield thing now. The Mac Mini and DAC are all in the TV rack and I can just pull the monitor over to my memory foam 'bean' bag if I want to use the computer but am still in an preferable listening position. Can use my iPhone or iPad to control everything via iTunes and there's a SBT remote app as well for the same job. Did this partly so I could relax more when listening, and partly as the Linkwitz speakers I'm building which will replace my Focal CMS's require a bit more listening distance.

 

[Somnambulist]

Well. AudioAffair dropped the price over the weekend to £1300 as part of a special celebratory weekend thing. Kinda bought an M51.