[Bullseye]

It's even now

 

[NewAKGGuy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kees /img/forum/go_quote.gif In my experience if you amp them really well they sound surprisingly similar.... Both are difficult to drive really well. I think that most differences discussed here could very well be different manifestations of what (insufficient) amping can do.

Exactly!

 

[Acix]

It's a bad joke to call the 650 natural.

 

[feifan]

I'm having a hard time wrapping my ears around the idea of "natural." What does it mean? Many are assuming it means "not artificial," but that's going around in circles. If we're saying that natural is a kind of pure sound or "the way we expect the music to sound" (or "the way the music was meant to sound") when there's no interference, then we open up a whole can of worms.

Still, I think this is an interesting question even if i can't even begin to answer it.

 

[Acix]

Natural, is when the characteristic sound of the headphones will not capture your attention more then the music. as flat, balance, and without coloration, or a minimum coloration. and there is much more, like instrument separation, sound stage, transparency, and music tonality.

 

[Andrew_WOT]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acix /img/forum/go_quote.gif It's a bad joke to call the 650 natural.

Well, to some it's a lesser sin then calling K701 natural. Have you spend substantial amount of time with both to declare HD650 a joke, sorry I failed to see HD650 in your profile?

 

[feifan]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acix /img/forum/go_quote.gif Natural, is when the characteristic sound of the headphones will not capture your attention more then the music. as flat, balance, and without coloration, or a minimum coloration. and there is much more, like instrument separation, sound stage, transparency, and music tonality.

That's what I'm saying -- a can of worms: "flat, balance, and without coloration, or a minimum coloration. and there is much more, like instrument separation, sound stage, transparency, and music tonality"

 

[Acix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew_WOT /img/forum/go_quote.gif Well, to some it's a lesser sin then calling K701 natural. Have you spend substantial amount of time with both to declare HD650 a joke, sorry I failed to see HD650 in your profile?

As I said...bad joke to call the 650 natural. The 600 are more fun to call them natural because they sounds more natural...to me. I don't like Senn since 2000. My last Senn that I'm enjoyed was the HD250ll model 1998. The only model after 2000 was the HD25ll that I needed for my DJ gigs.

 

[Acix]

Quote:

Originally Posted by feifan /img/forum/go_quote.gif That's what I'm saying -- a can of worms: "flat, balance, and without coloration, or a minimum coloration. and there is much more, like instrument separation, sound stage, transparency, and music tonality"

Will be more easy if you can try some vintage monitor hps like the K-141, K-240DF, DT-48S @ 25 ohms.

 

[estreeter]

Is it just me, or are we having the same thread reworded again and again on Head-F* ? I'm not an AKG-apologist (my next pair of phones will be AD900, no argument the best BFB I can get here in Oz) but this seems like another way of asking 'What is wrong with the 701/702 ?' ..... I come back to what I've said in earlier posts : these cans would have a lot less critics if they were priced at the same level as something like the Ms-Pro. I accept that some of you *do* have enough amp under them, and have owned them for long enough to know that they arent the cans for you, but many simply arent in a position to criticise either AKG or Sennheiser cans - repeating whatever someone else has said about a pair of phones without owning them for at least a month really makes no sense to me (and that includes 'professional' reviewers).

I wont be buying any of the aforementioned cans anytime soon, but I'm not about to repeat any negatives I've read about the 650s without actually owning a pair.

 

[rds]

yeah, cmon, the 650s have a lot of good qualities but sounding natural is not one of them. Listen to a voice on the 701s and it sounds real and present - I've had that feeling that the voice is in the room. I've never had that with the 650s. It's very clear you're listening to a voice being reproduced abeit in a very nice way.

 

[bhanja_trinanjan]

I was listening to some Chopin on the K701... and boy! Piano was NATURAL and REAL. Amazing attack, decay and spot on tonality with excellent resolution. It puts most other speakers/cans that I have heard to shame. I guess that the HD650 with its dark signature will never beat the AKG, especially at piano. The akg is too good, second to perhaps the sennheiser HD800.

 

[saintalfonzo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kees /img/forum/go_quote.gif In my experience if you amp them really well they sound surprisingly similar....

I'm not sure how you can make this statement, but we all have different ears... apparently VERY different.

 

[estreeter]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhanja_trinanjan /img/forum/go_quote.gif I guess that the HD650 with its dark signature will never beat the AKG, especially at piano. The akg is too good, second to perhaps the sennheiser HD800.

If that doesnt drag olblueyez into this thread with both guns blazing, nothing will !

 

[olblueyez]

Quote:

Originally Posted by estreeter /img/forum/go_quote.gif If that doesnt drag olblueyez into this thread with both guns blazing, nothing will !

Its kinda like a cop said to me in the hospital after getting drunk and flipping a car upside down. "There is nothing I can do to you that you haven't done to yourself". The deal is they both have short comings but the 650 has problems that are very easily over come with a little patience and trial and error. I don't believe the 701 will ever scale as well as the 650. Anyone saying voices and piano are more natural on the 701 has never heard the 650 surrounded by the proper equipment. Anyone who has would never make a statement like that. I was thinking today that its strange how most people fit into two categories, "I want neutral, accurate headphones" and "I want headphones I can enjoy". Seems like a lot of the neutral people think bright and thin = neutral and accurate. I can hear the silverware tapping the plates in front of Frank when he plays live at the Sands. I'm not missing any detail, I also have proper amounts of impact associated with each instrument unlike the 701's where a voice or horn has more weight than a kick drum.