[sling5s]

I'm curious if you heard it, or have gone on the word of mouth. Having both amps, I'm sure you'll be happy with the upgrade. Congrats.

All on word of mouth. I like the LC but I like open wide soundstage which the LC lacks. 

 

[doctorjazz]

I'm curious if you heard it, or have gone on the word of mouth. Having both amps, I'm sure you'll be happy with the upgrade. Congrats.

All on word of mouth. I like the LC but I like open wide soundstage which the LC lacks. 

I'm sure you'll find the ZOTL does it for youthen if that's what you wanted. It's a big step up from the LC (and I like the LC).

 

[saidentary]

  Another LC owner switching over to the Microzotl 2.0. 

Just placed an order for Microzotl 2.0 Deluxe (tempted to go stock but decided to upgrade the power supply) from Urban HiFi. I was hoping for free shipping but I guess they don't offer it. 

I don't know what the Liquid Carbon sounds like because I've never heard it, but people (like doctorjazz) have said good things about it.  So the following prediction is based solely on my experience with the MZ2, and not how it compares with the Liquid Carbon, which I can't speak to.  (Note also that I still have the stock power supply, not the upgrade, which everyone has said is better.) 
 
Prediction: Once you hear how phenomenal the MZ2 sounds, you won't care that you had to pay for the shipping. 

 

[sling5s]

  I don't know what the Liquid Carbon sounds like because I've never heard it, but people (like doctorjazz) have said good things about it.  So the following prediction is based solely on my experience with the MZ2, and not how it compares with the Liquid Carbon, which I can't speak to.  (Note also that I still have the stock power supply, not the upgrade, which everyone has said is better.) 
 
Prediction: Once you hear how phenomenal the MZ2 sounds, you won't care that you had to pay for the shipping. 

 
I hope so. The LC is a very forward and intimate sounding amp. 
And I got the ungraded power supply because I wanted to be "done" if you know what I mean. 
Everyone seems to say the stock tubes are good enough to be left alone but seemed to strongly recommend upgrading the power supply.
The smoothing of the treble and tightening of the bass can make all the difference sometimes.

 

[zachawry]

Basically, the LC sounds more "saturated" and "dense", while the MZ2 sounds more clear, airy, transparent.

I imagine some people would prefer the LC, but I just love the purity of the MZ2 sound.

 

[aqsw]

Just came over from the Elise thread to read the stink up on our amps. I must say it was very unprofessional from the mojo man.

Congrats on the Massdrop. I'm sure it will help the Zotl in the marketing scheme. After that, the wonderful product will do the rest.

Regards

 

[MojoAudio]

Just came over from the Elise thread to read the stink up on our amps. I must say it was very unprofessional from the mojo man.

Congrats on the Massdrop. I'm sure it will help the Zotl in the marketing scheme. After that, the wonderful product will do the rest.

Regards

 
I have no affiliation with LTA, the manufacturers of the microZOTL2.
 
I was attempting to teach people on this thread that you can not compare the highest performance economy products with actual high-performance products.
 
Note that what I originally compared the Elise to was an amp similar in engineering schema not even made by LTA or upgradeable by one of my company's power supplies that sells for something like 3X the price of the Elise.
 
I was also not stating in any way that a stock mZ2 that sells for $1,100 was as good or better than the Elise, only different.
 
The point I was attempting to make was that because the mZ2 has an external power supply, people are able to easily upgrade it to a level far beyond what a the stock mZ2 is capable of delivering.
 
This would be true of ANY component with an external power supply and not just the mZ2, and this would be true of any other high-performance power supply, and not just the ones my company manufactures.
 
I'm sincerely apologize to everyone on this thread if my postings were misunderstood.

 

[sling5s]

I placed an order urban hifi but it seems it's also on Massdrop. Are the upgraded tubes and upgraded power supply (LTA, LPS) on Massdrop version significantly better? It seems you get more for less on Massdrop's Microzotl 2.

 

[willsw]

  I placed an order urban hifi but it seems it's also on Massdrop. Are the upgraded tubes and upgraded power supply (LTA, LPS) on Massdrop version significantly better? It seems you get more for less on Massdrop's Microzotl 2.

 
I replied to your email, but thought I'd reply here as well. The "Massdrop version" is actually an introduction of a new product, the MZ2-S, which is very similar to the MicroZOTL2 but is not an interchangeable version due to the circuitry being different. We did a Massdrop exclusive release at a discount because we usually have introductory sales for our products, and were excited to work on something with Massdrop. After today (it's very early Tuesday where I am), you will not be able to find an MZ2-S for under the retail of $1845. As soon as we ship the Massdrop units, sales for the new amp will be available on the LTA website. 
 
The MZ2-S uses 12SN7 tubes instead of 6SN7 tubes. The sound signature is essentially identical (if one were to have the same company make a tube of the same quality, the 6SN7 version would sound the same as the 12SN7), but the greater availability of certain NOS 12SN7s allows us to use high-quality NOS tubes without raising the price significantly. We also chose to use NOS 6201 tubes, a variation of the 12AT7, due to positive feedback regarding that tube by customers. We envisioned the MZ2-S as a "pre-rolled" amp that is ideal for people who are interested in NOS tubes and rolling tubes but don't know where to start and don't necessarily want to invest money in that uncertain and slippery slope. Thinking about it as a real endgame amp at its price-point, we also decided to upgrade the power supply where we could without needing a new chassis.
 
The advantages of the MZ2-S is that we've done the research and the listening tests and chosen NOS tubes that we think work very well in the amp, and it comes with the upgraded power supply. The possible disadvantage is that it only comes in one color, it will only be available with the closed-circuit jack (non-locking, disconnects the other outputs when headphones are plugged in), there are fewer varieties of 12SN7s than 6SN7s if you do want to get creative, and, relatedly, you won't be able to use your possibly already existing collection of great 6SN7 tubes with it. We are also only offering the MZ2-S in the $1845 version, there is no option for the standard power supply as there is for the $1100 model of the MicroZOTL2. 
 
We believe there is an appeal to both the MicroZOTL2 and the MZ2-S. We still think the current-production Tung-sols sound great in the amp. We don't offer more options for the MZ2-S as it would have to be priced higher, as the four great guys who make all of our products wouldn't be able to streamline its production, and we wanted to offer it as reasonably-priced as possible.
 
I hope that clears up any confusion regarding the "Massdrop version" and the MicroZOTL2 and the MZ2-S The MZ2-S might need its own thread, but I don't decide those things, and maybe it can coexist here happily. 

 

[staxfreak]

We also chose to use NOS 6201 tubes, a variation of the 12AT7, due to positive feedback regarding that tube by customers.

6201 is equivalent to 12AT7 = same in MicroZOTL2 - what's new?
http://tungsol.com/tungsol/html/12at7-tung-sol.html

 

[willsw]

6201 is equivalent to 12AT7 = same in MicroZOTL2 - what's new?
http://tungsol.com/tungsol/html/12at7-tung-sol.html

Yes, it is equivalent, and actually the GE tubes we're using are labeled with both numbers. The difference, as far as I know, is relevant when referring to older tubes, as the 6201 was originally a mill-spec version of the 12AT7, and therefore the production wasn't necessarily identical, though the tubes are functionally.

 

[Rameish]

willsw, i've always loved the original MicroZolt - ever since i heard one (a red version) more than 10 years ago. We lovingly called it the toaster . I've pulled the trigger on the Massdrop version MZ 2S. One question about the power supply - i live in Singapore 230 volts  50hz. Shouldn't be an issue yes? A simple flick of the voltage selector, but what about the 50hz?Thanking you in advance for taking the time to reply. Cheers

 

[sling5s]

   
I replied to your email, but thought I'd reply here as well. The "Massdrop version" is actually an introduction of a new product, the MZ2-S, which is very similar to the MicroZOTL2 but is not an interchangeable version due to the circuitry being different. We did a Massdrop exclusive release at a discount because we usually have introductory sales for our products, and were excited to work on something with Massdrop. After today (it's very early Tuesday where I am), you will not be able to find an MZ2-S for under the retail of $1845. As soon as we ship the Massdrop units, sales for the new amp will be available on the LTA website. 
 
The MZ2-S uses 12SN7 tubes instead of 6SN7 tubes. The sound signature is essentially identical (if one were to have the same company make a tube of the same quality, the 6SN7 version would sound the same as the 12SN7), but the greater availability of certain NOS 12SN7s allows us to use high-quality NOS tubes without raising the price significantly. We also chose to use NOS 6201 tubes, a variation of the 12AT7, due to positive feedback regarding that tube by customers. We envisioned the MZ2-S as a "pre-rolled" amp that is ideal for people who are interested in NOS tubes and rolling tubes but don't know where to start and don't necessarily want to invest money in that uncertain and slippery slope. Thinking about it as a real endgame amp at its price-point, we also decided to upgrade the power supply where we could without needing a new chassis.
 
The advantages of the MZ2-S is that we've done the research and the listening tests and chosen NOS tubes that we think work very well in the amp, and it comes with the upgraded power supply. The possible disadvantage is that it only comes in one color, it will only be available with the closed-circuit jack (non-locking, disconnects the other outputs when headphones are plugged in), there are fewer varieties of 12SN7s than 6SN7s if you do want to get creative, and, relatedly, you won't be able to use your possibly already existing collection of great 6SN7 tubes with it. We are also only offering the MZ2-S in the $1845 version, there is no option for the standard power supply as there is for the $1100 model of the MicroZOTL2. 
 
We believe there is an appeal to both the MicroZOTL2 and the MZ2-S. We still think the current-production Tung-sols sound great in the amp. We don't offer more options for the MZ2-S as it would have to be priced higher, as the four great guys who make all of our products wouldn't be able to streamline its production, and we wanted to offer it as reasonably-priced as possible.
 
I hope that clears up any confusion regarding the "Massdrop version" and the MicroZOTL2 and the MZ2-S The MZ2-S might need its own thread, but I don't decide those things, and maybe it can coexist here happily. 

Thank you for explaining the differences. I know it will perform better but I would still like to know more in terms of the "sound" advantages. What will I "hear" that is different and improved? 

 

[sling5s]

   
I think Mark's move of the transparency from the front to the top was a significant improvement in visual association. 50hz is no problem, and we'll send you a pre-flicked power supply. 
 
 
 
Compared to the current-production Tung-sols, the NOS tubes give treble that is a bit more refined and slightly less bright, and more heft is felt in the bass. Overall we found that after listening for a while there was just a bit more fullness to the sound, and the upgraded power supply contributes to clarity and the ever-blackening background (what is blacker than black?). You can read about others' impressions after using NOS 6SN7s, as it will be a similar effect. 

Thank you. Is the amp "Chassis" also different? Is the iodized aluminum faceplate only in the M2-S?
Sorry for so many questions.
 
Edit:Nevermind, just looked at some pictures and it looks the same. 

 

[MojoAudio]

After sleeping on it I realized that rather than justifying some of the posts I made yesterday I should be apologizing to people I may have offended.
 
People that know me recognize me as some type of "idiot savant" with amazing technical skills and far less people skills.
 
I always have the best of intentions, but that doesn't justify my inappropriate behavior.
 
Likely everything I put in those posts was technically right, but posting technical information in that way on this forum was not the right thing to do.
 
This forum is certainly not the place for an engineer to debate technology with hobbyists, and I'm not even sure that there would be any place that would be appropriate.
 
So I would like to publically apologize to those companies and hobbyists I may have offended.
 
I would also like to state that I am deleting my subscription to this thread.
 
Before I go I want to clarify two things...
 
First of all, when I used the term "euphonic distortion" that is in no way an insult. Euphonic means "pleasurable" and euphonic distortion is when a component sounds great but is not empirically accurate. Another term for this would be "voicing."
 
Companies spend significant amounts of time and money to engineer and develop their signature sound, and in most cases, these are one form of euphonic distortion or another. It is neither good nor bad, only engineered to please a specific type of customer and to synergize with specific products of a certain sonic character.
 
Then there is the case of the relationship between LTA and me. There is none. As a matter of fact, some months ago I offended them with my lack of diplomacy, and I would guess right about now that they're wishing I would find another favorite headphone amp to upgrade.
 
For those of you that are enjoying whatever you're listening to, by all means continue to enjoy it. The joy of the music is the highest point of this hobby and the technology is nothing more than a necessary evil.
For those of you that are interested in that illusive next level stuff, you know where to find me