[DavidA]

   
There is no math in that calculation. There could not be any other way to determine other than yourself doing the A/B comparison.
 
His 20% might be your 5% or your 40%. His 20% might be my 2%. The number (or a percentage estimate) itself is pretty useless in its own right.
 
Even the question you ask of whether he thinks a novice might notice is subjective and a response does not actually indicate whether a novice will actually notice.

I didn't say there was math in the calculation, its why I asked for a better description on if even a novice would notice the difference due to his usual highly descriptive changes in describing differences with tubes changes in the Elise and Ember thread.  The question was not for you to answer since you don't have any idea where I'm coming from.  I have a idea where @decentlevi bases his scales so I was just asking for confirmation of it.

 

[TWerk]

You seem angry at me for exposing the fact that whether HE THINKS (his perception) a novice (an unknown person's perception - i.e. novice is a VERY broad category that is not easily definable) may be able to hear differences (what difference are you referring to? Bass? Soundstage?) between the 3 variations is a poor question to ask with too much subjectivity.
 
What is a novice? I might be considered a novice to some people since I only casually listen to headphones, or my mom might be considered novice, although I'm pretty certain I would be much more perceptive to headphone differences than her since I have listened to many different headphones for two years and she has not. When he answers to the affirmative that he thinks a novice could hear the difference, is he talking about me as a novice or her? Or someone in between our experience? See the problem?
 
Furthermore, can someone who is very experienced and sensitive to differences in headphones speak best about whether a novice might be able to hear differences in the first place? Or would the novices themselves be better to give the answer to that question?
 
Although, if you ask 10 different "novices", you may get 10 different answers. Who's the "correct" novice to ask? If the majority of them seem to agree, we may finally be getting somewhere at that point. 
 
But i guess I just have no idea where you're coming from and simply don't understand "his scales" enough like you do to determine that his answer to your question doesn't give useful information.

 

[DavidA]

not angry, just a little upset with myself for being dragged into this conversation, should have just send him a PM to avoid all of this

 

[TWerk]

I'm not trying to drag you into any unwanted conversation, my friend. 
 
I'm just trying to show that questions such as these these are subjective questions that ultimately lead to subjective answers.
 
The majority of threads on here are like this, people expressing their opinions and it's all speculative until you try the gear yourself.
 
Anyway, I hope you find the answers you are looking for.

 

[Zbell]

  First off, great review of the Ebony and the other 2.
 
@DecentLevi, was the Liquid Carbon run in balanced mode for the comparisons? (ie: were the headphones re-terminated to balance for the comparisons?)
 
When you say 20% differences this is really a lot in my opinion, so even a novice would easily notice the differences in the 3 different wood types?

 
I think the general consensus most have, after reading through a lot of the TH-X00 threads, is that all 3 variations have slightly different sound characteristics and frequency responses.  They are the same design and driver though, so from an objective view they will all sound strikingly similar.  However when a/b comparing or after listening to them a lot, there are definitely some unique properties each has due to the differences in the wood cups.  This includes peaks and valleys in the frequency response and resonances which would affect the character of the sound slightly.  I'm certainly no expert however and I'm still waiting on my Purplehearts to arrive.  These are just my impressions from reading what others have written.  

 

[DecentLevi]

Thanks for comparison!
It seems everyone that hear Ebony mention it being a smoother or liquid. I guess I'll be very happy with the Ebony, looks like everything I want Mahogany to fix is there.

That's exactly right!
 

Thanks for the review @DecentLevi. So in your opinion, the Purpleheart had less overall bass and impact than the Mahogany? Seems to be the opposite of what a few other reviewers and even Massdrop thought (on the PH description page they said it had more bass than the M). 

The way I heard it, with extensive comparisons / critical listening with 3 different amps, was that the Purpleheart had around 1db less bass than the original Mahogany, leaving the original as the king of bass quantity - both of which are darker than neutral making Ebony quite spot on in that region. The volume levels were the exact same on all comparisons, seeing how they all have the same impedance and the volume was not changed between A/B'ing. Perhaps the intention was for the PH to have more bass, but at least the pair I tried was leaner than the original. I also though the PH had a tad better impact, and the Ebony even better.
 

  First off, great review of the Ebony and the other 2.
 
@DecentLevi, was the Liquid Carbon run in balanced mode for the comparisons? (ie: were the headphones re-terminated to balance for the comparisons?)
 
When you say 20% differences this is really a lot in my opinion, so even a novice would easily notice the differences in the 3 different wood types?

My LC amp was in SE mode for these comparisons, since that was the only connection option to those headphones. I do suppose it would be relatively easy for anyone with skills to convert any of the TH-X00 models to balanced should you desire, and I can even refer you to my modding extraordinaire friend @Packdemon who can recable these for anyone that would like to contact him. RE the amp comparisons, I had also done extensive comparisons between the LC on balanced and the Elise SE with the same headphones and source chain, and believe it or not the Elise still sounded at least 2x better to me in many regards.
 
 

   
There is no math in that calculation. There could not be any other way to determine other than yourself doing the A/B comparison.
 
His 20% might be your 5% or your 40%. His 20% might be my 2%. The number (or a percentage estimate) itself is pretty useless in its own right.
 
Even the question you ask of whether he thinks a novice might notice is subjective and a response does not actually indicate whether a novice will actually notice.

 
Absolutely even a novice should hear major differences between the Mahogany and the Ebony anyway, because these are almost opposites in terms of dark vs. moderately U-shaped. The 20% I was referring to were smaller differneces like dynamics and highs, but for the bass I'd say it's at least 60% different between the Mahagony and Ebony.
 
Of course my percents are not based off math or scientific formulas, hence my wording about "perceived differences". Just a best guess estimate, that I figured would paint a bit clearer of a picture than just saying something like a "nuance" verses a "moderate" or a "medium" amount. Just trying to be accurate and objective.
 
And certaintly my comparisons are not absolute universal truth either because results may vary based on source chain, burn-in of various components, music, individual headphone variations, hearing, and even mood / preference.

 

[DecentLevi]

However generally, my impressions have shown to hold some weight vs. the consensus so shouldn't be hugely far off from how most people would hear these headphones.
 
Well I've already returned my demo units, and after a while we should be seeing impressions from the next reviewer.

 

[DavidA]

@DecentLevi, thanks for the info on the balanced vs SE with the LC, so from what you are saying the differences between the wood types is quite noticeable and what an individual will like is really dependent on what the sound signature that individual likes or hears from each which makes sense to me since the different wood types used by those modding Grado headphones also noticed a lot of differences in sound due to the wood type.

 

[DecentLevi]

Yes the differences between the former and the newest TH-X00's are almost night/day. Also I think there are more internal differences than wood type, probably something to do with dampening, filters, etc. If you're a basshead go for the Mahogany, if almost but not quite a basshead go for PH, and if you like a 'fun' sound signature yet closer to neutral with a lot of sparkle, go with Ebony.
 
Or maybe Ebony & Mahogany Live in Perfect Harmony  (not if you're sober 

)
 

 

[Eudis]

Yes the differences between the former and the newest TH-X00's are almost night/day. Also I think there are more internal differences than wood type, probably something to do with dampening, filters, etc. If you're a basshead go for the Mahogany, if almost but not quite a basshead go for PH, and if you like a 'fun' sound signature yet closer to neutral with a lot of sparkle, go with Ebony.

Or maybe Ebony & Mahogany Live in Perfect Harmony  (not if you're sober :wink_face: )

 

How about showing us the internals of the ebony. I'm sure its just a cup change.

Edit: I saw that you returned the sample.

 

[fjrabon]

  Yes the differences between the former and the newest TH-X00's are almost night/day. Also I think there are more internal differences than wood type, probably something to do with dampening, filters, etc. If you're a basshead go for the Mahogany, if almost but not quite a basshead go for PH, and if you like a 'fun' sound signature yet closer to neutral with a lot of sparkle, go with Ebony.
 
Or maybe Ebony & Mahogany Live in Perfect Harmony  (not if you're sober 

)
 

I mean the people from Massdrop have said that the only thing they've done is change cups, and I don't think there's any reason to doubt that when so many people open these cups up and could prove them liars if it turned out they made other adjustments.  

 

[DecentLevi]

I see, I was just going by assumption that it sounds like the differences are more than just a different type of wood, being that I haven't opened the pairs I had. That's amazing this is the only difference however

 

[DavidA]

  I mean the people from Massdrop have said that the only thing they've done is change cups, and I don't think there's any reason to doubt that when so many people open these cups up and could prove them liars if it turned out they made other adjustments.  

I guess it will all be verified when they start shipping the PH and Ebony and people start to open them up to mod them.

 

[jamor]

Thanks for the review @DecentLevi. So in your opinion, the Purpleheart had less overall bass and impact than the Mahogany? Seems to be the opposite of what a few other reviewers and even Massdrop thought (on the PH description page they said it had more bass than the M). I was also wondering if you considered your fuidic/liquid descriptor the same as Jude's lushness descriptor?

 
There was another reviewer "Z Reviews" who also mentioned that the Mahogany was more of a basshead phone than the Ebony he listened to.

 

[Zbell]

   
There was another reviewer "Z Reviews" who also mentioned that the Mahogany was more of a basshead phone than the Ebony he listened to.

 
Yeah, I've read that the Ebony is more balanced and less of a basshead can, but I was referring to the Purpleheart, which has been advertised by MD and others as having the most bass of the 3.