[Fearless1]

Quote:

 
 
so you are saying, if we have space and want to save money, we should just get a vintage receiver? and at which price point do you think a headphone amp can match a $350 vintage receiver?

 
This was less then 40 dollars from a local flea-market(guy there has a vintage audio stand every week) and sounds better then all of my SS amps

 

[aamefford]

So are you running HP out or speaker taps? I don't recall if the old receivers had a separate dedicated HP section or just ran speaker out up to th HP jack.

 

[Fearless1]

HP out on the Lafayette. Have yet to try it tapped.

 

[reddragon]

Quote:

 
I think that part of the beauty in using a vintage amp for headphones is that they can be had for much less. Certainly way below the $350 mark and still compete with much more expensive dedicated hp amps. WJE is more knowledgeable about desirable models though and you might want to pm him on that one if you're serious about the possibility. 

 
 
thats great, i will know what to do when i want to get a headphone amp! also i like the idea of being a little easier on the wallet 

 

[wolfetan44]

Quote:

 
 
thats great, i will know what to do when i want to get a headphone amp! also i like the idea of being a little easier on the wallet 

If only there was something like this for electrostatic amps....

 

[reddragon]

If only there was something like this for electrostatic amps....

 
lol well maybe steer clear of electrostatic until you are not broke?

 

[dudebrah]

Quote:

If you dock, no. If you connect to line in, yes.

 
 
Quote:

 
 
you said e7 does not have the lo bypass option, so if you are connecting e7 to e9, isnt it double amping?

 
So why would e7 > 3.5mm cable > e9 line in be a good idea? Is double amping bad?
 
Sincerely,
Noob

 

[wolfetan44]

Quote:

 
lol well maybe steer clear of electrostatic until you are not broke?

Or, just get an electrostatic

 

[beyondthepale35]

Pretty much between these and some HD600s. Worried about the soundstage on the MDs but after reading this thread (a herculean task) they seem to be quite open sounding. Just always wanted to try a planar magnetic and the HE-400s are just slightly out of budget. Coming from previously having owned K701s, FA-002ws and HE-300s, would these be a major upgrade?

 

[elwappo99]

Quote:

Pretty much between these and some HD600s. Worried about the soundstage on the MDs but after reading this thread (a herculean task) they seem to be quite open sounding. Just always wanted to try a planar magnetic and the HE-400s are just slightly out of budget. Coming from previously having owned K701s, FA-002ws and HE-300s, would these be a major upgrade?

 
It's tough to say. I think these definitely an upgrade over the FA-002, and HE-300s. I'm not sure about "major" when it comes the K701. It would come down to some subjectivity, but in my opinion there will be some very noticeable improvements. Only one I can think of that may not compare as well is soundstage. The Mad Dogs sound pretty open, but the K701 are just an incredibly open sound. However, if it comes down to it, I would definitely pick a pair of these over HD600s. 

 

[reddragon]

Quote:

 
 
 
So why would e7 > 3.5mm cable > e9 line in be a good idea? Is double amping bad?
 
Sincerely,
Noob

 
 
well my own personal opinion tells me its bad. others can tell you more about it, i just think the clarity is lost

 

[beyondthepale35]

It's tough to say. I think these definitely an upgrade over the FA-002, and HE-300s. I'm not sure about "major" when it comes the K701. It would come down to some subjectivity, but in my opinion there will be some very noticeable improvements. Only one I can think of that may not compare as well is soundstage. The Mad Dogs sound pretty open, but the K701 are just an incredibly open sound. However, if it comes down to it, I would definitely pick a pair of these over HD600s. 

Thats all I needed to hear. I definitely dont need as huge a soundstage as the 701s; while impressive, definitely took my mind off the music and i spent more time trying to pick out instruments than relax. I got the HE-300s and 002s at the same time, sold em both. Neither really did anything for me, felt like a downgrade from the 701s. Now if I can just figure out why my CKKIII is hissing...

 

[wje]

Not to divert the discussion on the Mad Dogs, but I wanted to clarify some earlier comments regarding vintage receivers or amplifiers.  Normally, at the stage of where most of this equipment is - approximately the 30 year old range, it is quite likely that the receiver or amplifier could potentially need to have the capacitors replaced.  Unless someone has the patience to take on such a task, they can have a shop provide them with an estimate for such actions to be taken.  With the age of the capacitors being as they are, one is basically living day-to-day with their vintage gear as it's hard to tell how much longer the caps will last.  It could be 10 years, or could be 10 days.  When I applied a comment regarding $350.00, it was a ballpark figure for quite a few of the vintage Sansui receivers being sold on eBay at the current time.  Most people realize how good the old gear is, and tend to bid the prices up.  A nice vintage receiver that has been re-capped could easily go for $600, or more.  The Marantz, Sansui and Pioneer receivers are some of those most in demand, so if you have your sights on one, be prepared to open your wallet if you are dead set on buying one.  Or, one can take time, be patient and check local yard sales, flea markets or even Craigslist for a bargain to appear.  From my experience, the do appear, and I've gotten some excellent bargains.  I've had 3 Sansui receivers at a time in my collection.  At the end of the day, I just figured that I couldn't have such an item that would depend on a fair amount of care and feeding.  I just couldn't have an item knowing that any day, a dial indicator could go out, or something else could go awry.  At one point, I also had a number of dial bulbs (10 or so) that were purchased from a vendor as "new - old" stock.  I do know at the time I made that purchase about 7 years ago, the supplies were starting to dry up a bit.  They really are great receivers, but one has to ensure they have patience in order to deal with any issues that might come up - as well as potentially facing dwindling supplies of replacement parts.  Granted, there are now some vendors on ebay and other sites offering new, replacement bulbs that are constructed of an LED module and designed to work with specific voltage ranges. This gives me hope ... but, time being in short supply for me, I've determined I can't have any of the items around for the time being.

 

[Chops]

Quote:

Thats all I needed to hear. I definitely dont need as huge a soundstage as the 701s; while impressive, definitely took my mind off the music and i spent more time trying to pick out instruments than relax. I got the HE-300s and 002s at the same time, sold em both. Neither really did anything for me, felt like a downgrade from the 701s. Now if I can just figure out why my CKKIII is hissing...

 
I had the 701's, and I would take the MD's over them any day of the week. The 701's were too lean, too crisp and too wide sounding. They weren't all that comfortable with that bumpy head band of theirs, and they were rather fatiguing. I think I only had mine for about 4 months before I gave up on them. I just couldn't get used to their sound or that painful head band.
 
 
Quote:

Not to divert the discussion on the Mad Dogs, but I wanted to clarify some earlier comments regarding vintage receivers or amplifiers.  Normally, at the stage of where most of this equipment is - approximately the 30 year old range, it is quite likely that the receiver or amplifier could potentially need to have the capacitors replaced.  Unless someone has the patience to take on such a task, they can have a shop provide them with an estimate for such actions to be taken.  With the age of the capacitors being as they are, one is basically living day-to-day with their vintage gear as it's hard to tell how much longer the caps will last.  It could be 10 years, or could be 10 days.  When I applied a comment regarding $350.00, it was a ballpark figure for quite a few of the vintage Sansui receivers being sold on eBay at the current time.  Most people realize how good the old gear is, and tend to bid the prices up.  A nice vintage receiver that has been re-capped could easily go for $600, or more.  The Marantz, Sansui and Pioneer receivers are some of those most in demand, so if you have your sights on one, be prepared to open your wallet if you are dead set on buying one.  Or, one can take time, be patient and check local yard sales, flea markets or even Craigslist for a bargain to appear.  From my experience, the do appear, and I've gotten some excellent bargains.  I've had 3 Sansui receivers at a time in my collection.  At the end of the day, I just figured that I couldn't have such an item that would depend on a fair amount of care and feeding.  I just couldn't have an item knowing that any day, a dial indicator could go out, or something else could go awry.  At one point, I also had a number of dial bulbs (10 or so) that were purchased from a vendor as "new - old" stock.  I do know at the time I made that purchase about 7 years ago, the supplies were starting to dry up a bit.  They really are great receivers, but one has to ensure they have patience in order to deal with any issues that might come up - as well as potentially facing dwindling supplies of replacement parts.  Granted, there are now some vendors on ebay and other sites offering new, replacement bulbs that are constructed of an LED module and designed to work with specific voltage ranges. This gives me hope ... but, time being in short supply for me, I've determined I can't have any of the items around for the time being.

 
I think you're worrying too much about those issues. Brand new gear with touchy, static sensitive IC's and dainty surface mount components run just as much risk of failure if not more than 30 year old gear. Yes, caps might need replacing in vintage gear, but the rest of the components should be just fine. Resistors and diodes rarely run out of spec, so they shouldn't be much of a worry. Bulbs are also a non-issue as there's still plenty of OEM style replacements available as well as the LED replacements that you mentioned. The only other thing that should be checked/adjusted is the bias voltages. And if you really want to, replace the headphone jack resistors with some boutique ones.
 
Most recapping jobs can be done between $150 - $250 which usually includes the bias adjustment and general cleaning and de-oxing. People easily spend more than that in just tube rolling a couple tubes in an amp.
 
The main point is that vintage receivers once up to spec can typically outperform dedicated headphone amps costing $1k+ or more, and will most likely have a lot more power and current available to the headphones.
 
 
 
One other thing, I believe most all of the pre-80's vintage receivers used the speaker amplifiers to power the headphone output, just with a couple resistors in place to pad down the power to a respectable level, generally about 150 ohm resistors. That means my Sansui G-7000 with its 85 watts of power is getting roughly 3 watts to the headphone output! Yes, plenty of balls indeed for any ortho.

 

[ballard3]

Quote:

Thats all I needed to hear. I definitely dont need as huge a soundstage as the 701s; while impressive, definitely took my mind off the music and i spent more time trying to pick out instruments than relax. I got the HE-300s and 002s at the same time, sold em both. Neither really did anything for me, felt like a downgrade from the 701s. Now if I can just figure out why my CKKIII is hissing...

My other headphones are open but  I have to admit that soundstage is one of the things
I appreciate about MD. The other ones are its cohesion and fluidity. 
A very balanced headphone. And comfort is wonderful.