[belgiangenius]

 

Bryston

BDA-3 (-)

In terms of the usual array of claims made for audiophile DACs, the Bryston BDA-3 is pretty basic.  While Bryston talk up the sound quality, there’s little to call attention to in terms of the technology or engineering behind it.

 
A low noise power supply?  Check.
 
Discrete, class-A, output stages?  Check.
 
User-selectable up-sampling?  Check.
 
Fancy clocks?  Che … wait … what?  No … none of that here, it seems.
 
Other than a wider than typical array of inputs, and the upsampling toggle, this is a pretty simple device, using a pair of AKM 4490s in mono-mode.  This is a chip I generally find quite agreeable sonically, even if I feel it’s a bit out of place in a device at this price level – at least with with no other “special” treatments going on.  After all, this chip now also features in Schiit’s $150 Modi 2 Uber.
 
Okay, there’s only one of them in Modi 2 Uber …
 
Maybe Schiit should offer monobloc DACS … you could buy about 20 of them for the price of the Bryston!  Add a super-low-noise PSU (maybe the iFI 1uV wall-wart) and that would drive up the cost to the point where you could only buy 16 of them …
 
I digress …
 
Now, I’ll be the first to admit that the implementation of a DAC is at least as important as the choice of converter IC, and the results are really what matters regardless of other concerns, so we best get to that.
 
And, in short, I don’t feel this is in the same league as Yggdrasil at all.  Sure it’s competent enough, with good detail, it’s quite dynamic, for the most part it’s transparent – though I did get a sense of a little bloom, or maybe blurring in the lower registers.  At the opposite end of the spectrum there wasn’t a particularly vivid sense of air and brass seemed to lose a bit of its edge.  Tone was generally good otherwise.  PRaT was fine.  But it lacked the ability to convey emotion and draw me into the music. 
 
Presentation was very clean and not really analytical at all, and yet was less dry than would normally be the case for me to make those two statements, but again, it was lacking involvement for me.  There was no sense of excitement, drama, passion, or any emotion at all listening to this thing and, at best, I could describe it as being vanilla.  It’s not that it is bad by any means … it just isn’t that interesting to listen to. 
 
This didn’t change with, or without, up-sampling engaged – though things got a bit smoother with up-sampling enabled.
 
The BDA-3 needs something else to make it interesting for me.  I’m not sure what.  A soul maybe.  Or maybe something more reasonable … perhaps the ability to select from the DAC chip’s built in filter types.  As it is, I don’t recall a filter setting called “forgettable” in the data-sheet.  And I don’t know if that would help anyway.
 
So my impression here is that you have a perfectly competent, but not especially engaging or interesting, DAC, that, compared to the competition, is very hard to justify the $3,495 price tag for.
 
Gungnir would crucify this from a musicality and involvement perspective, and I mean the standard D/S version.  Yggdrasil would make it carry the cross, dig the whole to erect it in, and then hand it the hammer and nails and make it bang them through its PCBs itself.
 
Perhaps this comes alive with DSD … I didn’t test that – I was done with my interest in DSD by that point.  Or maybe it’s ability to take an HDMI feed from an SACD player is its saving grace.  Didn’t try that either (I lack the necessary SACD player or discs).  Otherwise, this just completely misses the mark for me.

Funny.  Just based on pictures of the inside of this DAC, I fully expect your analysis to be accurate, Torq. (i.e., a fairly empty box)
 
Bryston is no doubt a big advertiser in Stereophile.  The latest version of Stereophile goes on a tirade about how absolutely friggin awesome this DAC is.  I believe the reviewer even called it the best DAC he's ever heard.  

 
 
Some reviewers give points for functionality when they review.  Personally, I couldn't care if a DAC anticipates the next big format, supports it before it exists, and offers 27 inputs to accommodate it.
 
If it doesn't sound the best, I ain't interested.

 

[Tobes]

  Funny.  Just based on pictures of the inside of this DAC, I fully expect your analysis to be accurate, Torq. (i.e., a fairly empty box)
 
Bryston is no doubt a big advertiser in Stereophile.  The latest version of Stereophile goes on a tirade about how absolutely friggin awesome this DAC is.  I believe the reviewer even called it the best DAC he's ever heard.  

 
 
Some reviewers give points for functionality when they review.  Personally, I couldn't care if a DAC anticipates the next big format, supports it before it exists, and offers 27 inputs to accommodate it.
 
If it doesn't sound the best, I ain't interested.

I've got no comment to make on the sound but I think it's harsh to call the Bryston a "fairly empty box". What do you expect to see?
Suspect you'd be pretty disappointed with the Chord Dave then?

 

[belgiangenius]

No doubt, IMO, the Chord Dave is an ugly person of a DAC. Even if it cost $2295 like the Yggy, I would take the Yggy.

 

[Tobes]

Never mind the looks, the Dave costs $17.5K in Aus - development aside, very hard to approach this number based on apparent component parts.
Dave's price appears to based on it's sonic competitiveness with other uber priced DACs.
I suppose this has some justification but is completely opposite to a company like Schiit, who appear to price based on build cost and a 'safe' profit margin.

 

[Torq]

Unfortunately, for me, the Bryston didn't get close to measuring up to it's asking price.
 
I'm not sure why it's priced as high as it is ... beyond idle speculation that they think it'll sell either on their name or because it's expensive, regardless of what's inside the chassis, but unless they're getting stung for HDMI compliance (not much of an issue for a $200 HT unit, since those sell vastly more units).  And HDMI support is the only reason I can think of to even consider the Bryston, and that's tenuous at best 
 
In my opinion there are so many much better, significantly (even massively) cheaper, options that it's beyond funny.
 
They're very credible in other spaces, amps specifically, but between this, and their $1200 based Raspberry Pi streamer, I think they've lost the plot in the digital realm.

 

[ToroFiestaSol]

I'm very curious on the new ESS 9038 chip, it should be a major upgrade coming from 9018.
Remember that 9018 was released 10 years ago (that's like 1 century in digital audio), and ESS had 10 employees back then. Now, ESS gained a lot of experience, money and resources, it growed up and now it has 120 employees, so, if this new 9038 chip is the result of all the experience, resources, and money collected this 10 years, it should be a game changer.
 
The good side of this is prices, just imagine a Gustard X20 with 9038 chips, it could be a game changer and priced under 1k.
 
EDIT: Also, there's a guy on computeraudiophile who said that Ayre QX-5 Twenty (first DAC with ESS 9038 chips) is even better than Chord Dave. Of course, take this with a grain of salt, but I don't know why, I believe him (yes, Ayre fan and don't like Chord hahaha).

 

[REXNFX]

  Unfortunately, for me, the Bryston didn't get close to measuring up to it's asking price.
 
I'm not sure why it's priced as high as it is ... beyond idle speculation that they think it'll sell either on their name or because it's expensive, regardless of what's inside the chassis, but unless they're getting stung for HDMI compliance (not much of an issue for a $200 HT unit, since those sell vastly more units).  And HDMI support is the only reason I can think of to even consider the Bryston, and that's tenuous at best 
 
In my opinion there are so many much better, significantly (even massively) cheaper, options that it's beyond funny.
 
They're very credible in other spaces, amps specifically, but between this, and their $1200 based Raspberry Pi streamer, I think they've lost the plot in the digital realm.

Yes most professional reviewers are only in it for the advertising dollars-shame on them! Now back to the interesting topic-any clues as to the mystery digital wonder source you mentioned? I did hear an Orpheus Labs player the other day that sounded in different league,...

 

[Torq]

  The good side of this is prices, just imagine a Gustard X20 with 9038 chips, it could be a game changer and priced under 1k.

 
I don't have to ... do I?
 

 
I've heard many DACs under the $1K price point that I'd rather listen to than the Gustard X20.
 
And then, from a practical perspective, even if the ESS 9038 performed twice as well, technically, as the the 9018, the differences should be inaudible (at least if the original claims for the 9018 are accurate).
 
Based on the feedback from X20 owners I've spoken too, or heard from (or read about), the best thing to do with an X20 is seemingly to stuff cardboard under the transformers and run random bits of  (allegedly copper-filled) string about it's PCB.  But you'll have to take their collective word for that, as I don't generally go in for that level of hardware debasement.

 

[Torq]

  Yes most professional reviewers are only in it for the advertising dollars-shame on them! Now back to the interesting topic-any clues as to the mystery digital wonder source you mentioned? I did hear an Orpheus Labs player the other day that sounded in different league,...

That is a sad reality.
 
It's getting embarrassing at this point.
 
I've not heard the Orpheus Labs stuff.  In fact I've never heard of Orpheus Labs before now.  So what I'm referring to isn't that.
 
I will say it's a hybrid implementation, part CoTS, part FPGA.  And it's less that it is revolutionary or a "wonder source" and more, simply, that it's the best digital reproduction I've heard so far.  And by "best", I mean most musically involving and emotive.  While the initial products are uncomfortably priced for most, the architecture will trickle down to much less expensive products.

 

[REXNFX]

 
That is a sad reality.
 
It's getting embarrassing at this point.
 
I've not heard the Orpheus Labs stuff.  In fact I've never heard of Orpheus Labs before now.  So what I'm referring to isn't that.
 
I will say it's a hybrid implementation, part CoTS, part FPGA.  And it's less that it is revolutionary or a "wonder source" and more, simply, that it's the best digital reproduction I've heard so far.  And by "best", I mean most musically involving and emotive.  While the initial products are uncomfortably priced for most, the architecture will trickle down to much less expensive products.

There are a few DAC makers out there using FPGA to upsample to DSD, then using a chip for the D to A, I'm guessing this new device is different?

 

[Torq]

  There are a few DAC makers out there using FPGA to upsample to DSD, then using a chip for the D to A, I'm guessing this new device is different?

Well, for one it doesn't do DSD at all, so yes.
 
And if that's all the FPGA were being used for, it would be an indication of choosing the wrong technology for the job!
 
Also, the notion of "up sampling" to DSD is a bit of a misnomer, since it's not a simple sample-rate conversion, nor is it necessarily an "up" sample.  This implies an upward shift in effective bit-rate/resolution, which is very much dependent on what level of "DSD" a source is being "up" sampled to and what PCM bit-rate/sample-depth it is being "up" sampled from.
 
And it's not that this new device is DOING anything especially new; in fact the same company has had a similar hybrid model for years now, but it's the results they're getting with it in their updated architecture that are impressive.

 

[ToroFiestaSol]

   
And it's not that this new device is DOING anything especially new; in fact the same company has had a similar hybrid model for years now, but it's the results they're getting with it in their updated architecture that are impressive.

 
Can you at least tell us which company is?

 

[Torq]

   
Can you at least tell us which company is?

Now where's the fun in that?
 

 

[wink]

   
Can you at least tell us which company is?

The Chronoclastic Infundibulum Consortium DAC/DSD Allamagoosa.
The device name is the "OFFOG"

 

[pippen99]

 
The Chronoclastic Infundibulum Consortium DAC/DSD Allamagoosa.
The device name is the "OFFOG"

 
Thank you.  One of my favorites; Eric Frank Russell RIP. No matter what fancy name you stick on it, It's still just a dog.