Let's Cut to the Chase- S:Flo2

[Berserker]

I have the Clip+, and I think it sounds very good. To me it has nothing to do with the price. I actually got it for a Christmas gift. I read up on different players, and it seemed the Clip+ was getting all the attention. My son asked me what I wanted for Christmas, so I said, how about the Clip+. No, I don't have the S:Flo², but as a mod at MP4Nation I see mixed reviews all the time. Most agree the sound is good, but the bugs are what they don't care for too much. That's what I see most in negativity about the player, the bugs,  battery life (6 to 10 hours reported, depending on files) and difficulty of upgrading firmware. I guess if it has all that hardware, one would think it would drain the battery fairly fast. That's the trade off. Personally, I could put up with the bugs if it sounds that good. After all, sound is the bottom line. I'm new to the audio world. I was all about the video. But since I got the Clip+ that I could listen to all day at work, the tide is turning. Makes my day go faster, and sounds good. Who knows, perhaps I'll look into getting the S:Flo².

 

[Zink]

Wow, when the poll is 17/18 it really is getting indecisive. I like my Clip for it's size and durability/price but have never heard the sflo2.

 

[Berserker]

Quote:

Wow, when the poll is 17/18 it really is getting indecisive. I like my Clip for it's size and durability/price but have never heard the sflo2.

S:Flo², aka the Teclast T51: http://mp4nation.net/catalog/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_36_58

 

[lisztian420]

Well, I also like the Clip+. The reason for comparing Clip and Sflo2 is because I also amp out the signal on the clip. I was told and agreed that the HPO of the clip is very clean and neutral, and therefore quite suitable for amping.
 
Clearly LO has some advantages to HPO. I am not comparing fairly, but that is not what I was trying to do. I am fine givin the S:flo2 some advantages because Clip does not have LO. As for the sound difference between the two, at the end, is very clear. I use the same old T3 with both. But, I could swear the SFlo2 sounds better to my ears. The amps are the same, but the sounds are different. I think it maybe be the DACs? Or the sole deterimine factor is the amp???
 
Honestly, I don't understand all the technically jargon and how things work. It's not my field of expertise. But after playing music for 20+ years I really do trust my hearing. Again,.. I am comparing the S:FLO2 with the CLIP+ with LO to HO, and S:flo2 wins.

 

[shigzeo]

The Clip's headphone out is great, but not particularly 'wide' or ping clean. I'd take the LO from the S:Flo to an amp over the clip anyday. The T3 is actually a great, great amp (not only for the price), so I am a fan. I'd imagine that if the Clip had a wider, iPod-like stereo image, the HPO to an amp might be a worthy comparison when level-matched. It's not though, and clearly the LO on the S:Flo is clearer with the same amp and cable. That I agree on. But then, it's huge. I prefer to go ampless unless I am really prepared to audiophile it up whilst out and about. At home, I am pretty much always with amp. 

 

[lisztian420]

True, my pocket buldges like crazy thanx to the S:flo2 and T3. Well it coule bd worse with a bigger amp.

 

[Young Spade]

Quote:

True, my pocket buldges like crazy thanx to the S:flo2 and T3. Well it coule bd worse with a bigger amp.

T51 ALO Rx (+ IEMs) here. Sucks man lol

 

[ianmedium]

Hmm, Can't help you I am afraid but I will say this!
 
I know I have a low post count and I do not profess to know much about anything but I have noticed an historical fact about forums.
 
Forums historically are great places for immediate hyperbole, they champion the latest and greatest thing out amost right out of the box.
 
One reads reviews of products, with glowing terminoligy, the latest and greatest, a giant killer in sound . People hand on heart profess that what they are listening to is the greatest breakthrough in music replay since the cylinder record player..
 
Two or three months down the road however if one plows through those same threads, when the hyperbole calms down and there is another latest and greatest thing on the block to amuse and garner attention the product that was once so highly praised is now less so! The bass almost mysteriously  becomes woolly, the mids dissapear and the once crystaline highs become coarse and grainy. You know there is a new kid on the block and it improves on the old one is so many spectacular ways...At least until the next new kid on the block appears...Do you get my thought drift!
 
I have been involved in HIFI for nearly thirty years as a consumer and audio buff (I know an old fart amongs most of you!) and I have seen this phenomenon move from Magazines through to the more immediate resource of the forum format where it really has taken off!
 
I have listened to so many "wonder" products that seem to be the latest and greatest only to see a few months (used to be years in magazine times but the net speeds the proccess up!) later them trashed beyond belief!
 
Again though if you look historically, many of the things that are trashed later on are held as the best and fondly remembered for their sonic qualites!
 
Sadly, in this day and age of internet only purchases there is so little choice out there to find in bricks and mortar stores to actually do what every audiophile knows is essential to do..Listen first! What may seem cack to me can sound wonderful so someone else!
 
What I have learned over the years is that for ultimate music pleasure ultimate detail and resolution does not automatically make for an enjoyable listening experience!
 
I will give you an instance. I have spent the past 8 weeks in the recording studio listening to one of my clients music, from recording to mastering. I now sit here listening to the pre production master, ripped lossles onto Itunes and listening through both my AKG701's(which were used in the studio as well) and Stax SR001mk2's on my itouch and through Garys PA2V2 with the AKG's.
 
This sound comes so close to the sound I heard in the studio but with the added benefit of being slightly smoother and slightly less analytical. We needed to analyze every last detail in the studio to make sure the quality was high. However that can be very tiring on the ears so the secret to good production and mastering is to keep as much detail as possible but also to make the experience a pleasure to listen to..This recording I am happy to say achieves that (IMHO!)
 
Now, the products I use have recieved some of the glowing praise and also some of the stick throwing. All I know is that in spite of all that I have read about these products on this forum and elswhere they perform the task perfectly and reveal what I heard in the studio without the fatigue and with envolvement and pleasure.
 
The 701's are now not the latest and greatest, the HD800's have that crown (being absloutely honest they are wonderful but in truth not over a thousand $$ more wonderful!) The 701's are for me some of the best headphones I have listened to (The stax better them though for abslutely enjoyment of the music!!) and the itouch and ipod a perfectly competent player for portable use with the ease of format!
 
I know this may seem off-topic but I feel it is not. This player your considering is getting heaps of praise at the moment..Just cool your youthful heals a bit and go listen to other players, if you can't do that plow through old as well as new reviews to give a balanced perspective. A lot of people on  forums justify crappy purchases by praising the item up to the hilt so  that others buy them so they don't feel so bad in purchasing them themselves!
 
One last thing to add. Read the reviewer not the review! You will learn much about the quality and accuracy of the review of the item if you go through the reviewers posts!

 

[fatcat28037]

^ WOW! very well put.

 

[iPhone4G]

The only player that beats S:flo2 is HM-801, S:flo2 beat iMod,Sansa,Sony, etc. in terms of sound quality.
I dont like sony cause its not support external memory, then dont support many lossless audio codecs like S:flo2,IMO
Of course S:flo2 beats all sansa, IMO
I dont know about iRiver, and Cowon, I think S:flo2 still win.

 

[lisztian420]

True, I think there are two sides to a coin when it comes to the FOTM hype.
 
On one side, people really praise their new toys blah blah blah, you know what I am sayin.
 
The other, people have great expectation and SOMETIMES  their logic come back to them and they can see their not so new toy objectively.
 
As for the S:flo2 player, it's been out for 5+ months now. It's not a perfect player. The UI suxxx! The Battery life is really poor, worse than the clip+. But the SQ is very nice. luckily, the entry price for this player is only about $110 and it's resale value should be quite decent here on this forum.
 
And that's all I have to say about that: )

 

[violinvirtuoso]

I can't speak from personal experience (I haven't received mine yet) but there are numerous reviews that expound the same basic ideas. The S:Flo 2 is one of the best DAPs. The differences that make it sound better are subtle with medium to lower end headphones, but more and more obvious with higher end (and less efficient) headphones. When the internal amp is as good as if not better than the iBasso T4, you know it is a pretty darn good sounding DAP. That is for the Headphone Out. The real clincher is the easily accessible Line Out. A simple interconnect will get you LO SQ. Although you should take it with a pinch of salt (or perhaps a handful), there are numerous people saying the S:Flo 2 sounds better than the Zune, all iPods, all Cowon products, AMP3, iMod, iMod and PV-Cap, iRiver H120, etc.
 
http://www.headfonia.com/?p=2783
If you haven't already read this article, I highly recommend reading it. It compares the Teclast T51 (S:Flo 2), HiFiMan HM-801, Red Wine Audio iMod, the Sony X1060, and the obvious reference point: an iPod Classic. BTW, if you read through the article it says that the T51 lacks bass. A few people have posted similar impressions (though many people say the opposite). If you want more quality bass, adjust the EQ. A few people think this is due to the fact that many people are accustomed to the iPod's bass centric sound.
 
By the way, what the heck is with the poll? When I first saw this thread, it was at 11 - 11. It has consistently stayed around equal. And yet, if you read through the posts, there are very few people that don't like the S:Flo's SQ. In fact, there is only 1 person (AFAIK, off the top of my head, no offense to anyone I missed) that doesn't like the S:Flo: mobbaddict. No offense meant to mobbaddict. We all hear things differently, and your headphones are highly efficient negating most of the benefits (see above). But still, only one person posts their impressions of average SQ and 18 people vote this way. Please don't vote if you can't back up your opinion.
 
Again, I have not heard the player; it is still in the process of being shipped to me. Everything that is said about the S:Flo 2's SQ is from what I have read (only stuff that many people agree on) and is basically a recap/repost/summary.

 

[david1978jp]

Review the reviewers, it's the first thing you should do.
Some reviewers claimed spening hundreds thousands in their home audio system. When came to portable audio, "The Certain Device" is the only one those reviewers own and love - If those guys are so money rich, they should have already bought every good DAP (after all, portable players are much cheaper than home audio which cost them $100,000 or $200,000 ). But, NO, No, those people have never owned other dap.
Review the reviewers, (check their histories), if something smells funny...

 

[mobbaddict]

Quote:

By the way, what the heck is with the poll? When I first saw this thread, it was at 11 - 11. It has consistently stayed around equal. And yet, if you read through the posts, there are very few people that don't like the S:Flo's SQ. In fact, there is only 1 person (AFAIK, off the top of my head, no offense to anyone I missed) that doesn't like the S:Flo: mobbaddict. No offense meant to mobbaddict. We all hear things differently, and your headphones are highly efficient negating most of the benefits (see above). But still, only one person posts their impressions of average SQ and 18 people vote this way. Please don't vote if you can't back up your opinion.

I don't dislike the s:flo at all, i just said it doesn't do anything better than a regular DAP (Sansa Clip for instance). Soundstage and detail are extremely similar.
And you missed shigzeo's comment (someone who can be trusted)
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/493409/let-s-cut-to-the-chase-s-flo2/30#post_6666836
 
And i agree that the line out is great. It's not really better than the headphone out soundwise but it has a lot of voltage: just as much as my CDP when paired with my Stax rig.

 

[flaming_june]

It'd be impossible to scientifically and statistically find out which is better.  All we have to rely on are comments with unknown subjectiveness.  However we can all see why Sflow2 pulls ahead.
 
Just relying on Shigzeo's post, we can see why you'd be a sflow2.  Ipod + T3 is almost 3 times more expensive than then 16g sflow2.
Quote:

I don't dislike the s:flo at all, i just said it doesn't do anything better than a regular DAP (Sansa Clip for instance). Soundstage and detail are extremely similar.
And you missed shigzeo's comment (someone who can be trusted)
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/493409/let-s-cut-to-the-chase-s-flo2/30#post_6666836
 
And i agree that the line out is great. It's not really better than the headphone out soundwise but it has a lot of voltage: just as much as my CDP when paired with my Stax rig.