[josephpino07]

Hi everyone,
 
I'm new to this forum. I have just bought the following set up:
 
source: Marantz cd5003
Headphone amplifier: Lehmann Audio Rhinelander
Headphones: AKG K702
 
I have also bought some good quality rca cables to connect the cdp to the amp
 
I must say straight away that I am hugely disappointed by the amplifier. It's either that the Lehmann is bad or the headphone output on my cd player is really good, because they sound exactly the same. No difference whatsoever. I've tried to convince myself of some differences, but I just couldn't. Now, here's my question: How is it possible that the output of a cd player that's worth about 300 bucks (the whole cd player) provides the exact same sound quality as a dedicated headphone amplifier that's worth 450 bucks? Should I sell it? Damn it, this thing just didn't live up to my expectations and I am now considering selling it. But perhaps the current set up is wrong...
 
Thanks for your answers

 

[AuralRelations]

I haven't heard the Lehmann but I know from experience that the K702s are VERY picky about amps. I have a $500 Little Country III that could drive them with a bit of authority but something felt lacking, possibly dynamics. I purchased a vintage Pioneer SX-850 for $100 and used my K702s on it last night.
 
What a difference! Everything sounded effortless because the amp is so powerful. I can't turn it past 8 o'clock as I would go deaf. If you're not satisfied with the setup, try it with different headphones and see if you have better results. I would just return it and see if I can buy an amp that better suits the K702 because they are amazing headphones for the price. I believe there's are a few threads about which amps pair the best with the K702 if you do some digging.

 

[josephpino07]

Thanks for your reply,
 
Well, I have very little to complain about sound itself. The quality of the reproduction is quite good and it's got power in abundance for my ears...it's just that I kind of feel like I've wasted my money since the headphone amplifier integrated on my cd player is just as good as the Lehmann as well as being much, much cheaper. Could it be that the Lehmann still has to break in? Anyhow I think I'll keep it for the moment for two reasons: the first is that it's supposed to be an excellent amplifier according to everyone on the net, and since I have never auditioned any other amplifier, I'm afraid I might end up with something worse. The second is that I'd like to buy a Grado rs1 or rs2 in the future to complement my AKG'S and I know Grado/Lehmann is a stunning combination....I'm just disappointment because I heard all this big fuss about headphone amplifiers and at the end of the day a 450 dollar one is not better than the output socket of a 300 dollar cd player....wow, I'm confused

 

[AuralRelations]

Ha maybe it just speaks to the quality of the Marantz! I have a pair of RS2i and they're not very picky about amps. I do like them with tubes for a warm sound. The K702s are just a bit too hard/harsh in the upper registers for some times of music.

 

[scottiebabie]

another reason for your dissappointment could be a burn-in deficiency. i know my used (100hrs or so) K702 sounded lean bright & grainy with a shrill tilt on vocals ie.liek shiaaaat! with some serious HD cookin, its still bright(er) but definitely lean & grainy no longer applies. good2great tight extended bass with superb clarity & treble. only fly in the oitment i can find is the treble can be a tad unrefined but its still early days yet.
 
or it could just be that the reinlander amp isnt a good match with the K702. as frequently noted, K701/2 can be more than a handful with synergistic amp pairings.

 

[AuralRelations]

I second the burn-in. These take so long to burn in it's not even funny. AKG should seriously consider burning them in at the factory before shipping them out. I think I'm reaching the 200 hr mark and that's still just the tip of iceberg. 

 

[josephpino07]

how about equipment? My Rhinelander has played for approximately 40 hours or so so far. Will I see tangible differences after I let it break in for 100/150 hours?
 
Thanks again.

 

[Arksun]

The headphone out from some of those old Marantz CD players really are surprisingly good. I remember plugging in my first HD600 straight into my parents old Marantz CD player back in the day and was surprised just how powerful and weighty the sound was, I had to turn the CD players internal volume right down low otherwise it was too loud.
 
At least the advantage of your headphone amp is that it can be plugged into any source

 

[Deep Funk]

What do you expect when you make such a set up? Marantz CD-player + studio(/consumer) oriented amplifier + studio oriented headphones = ...?
 
If you gamble with new gear you either like the sound, the way the music is presented or not. Add that some CD-players can have good (or better than expected) headphone outs (Philips/Marantz/Sony etcetera...). Even if you do not like the amplifier the resale value on Head-Fi can still cover for a good new or vintage integrated or even a 'more pleasant' sounding headphone amplifier. 
 
At least you now have a set up of reference to build upon. If you want to get 'wowed'; this hobby is a bit tricky...

 

[josephpino07]

I know I should audition gear before buying it, but where I live (Sicily, italy) it's almost impossible to find a place where you can audition headphone amplifiers, therefore I had to trust all the reviews I found on the Internet. I think I'll just keep what I have, hoping that break in will improve the situation a bit...Cheers guys!

 

[Deep Funk]

You now have a good reference set up. Use it in your advantage...

 

[pro555]

It sounds normal to me. Marantz is targeting consumer market, if their CD players don't sound good enough or reach somewhat standard, how could they sell millions of copies? "Hi-Fi" company is different, they want you paying most money no mater worth it or not.

 

[josephpino07]

No, I'm not saying the cd player is bad, I'm just saying that the integrated headphone out of the cd player provides the same audio quality as the headphone amp I bought for 450 dollars. I'm actually praising Maratnz.

 

[blacknile]

I also own a separates set-up and I happen to have a Marantz CD6000 OSE CD player (an ancestor of yours). My Beyerdynamic DT880 600ohm sound great out of the headphone jack of the Marantz. They sound 90% as good as out of my Little Dot MKIII OTL tube amp. If you are interested in the music rather than in stacking up equipment, that 10% really does not justify the purchase (myself, I'm considering selling the Little Dot).
 
IMHO:
 
Headphone amps are overrated. Most of the people that keep recommending headphone amps over here do it because they have never owned decent separates components (no offense or elitism intended - many times people simply have no room or time for good hi-fi components).
 
The typical baseline system on these forums is represented by people who use an ipod or an apple laptop as a source and purchase  expensive, insensitive, hard to drive headphones to go with the ipod. With such a starting set-up (and no good cd-player/separates speaker amp to compare with) I believe headphone amps can make a big difference, hence the glowing reviews and the ensuing market for headphone amps.
 
If you already own a good separates systems, most headphone amps will be less useful than what the reviews have led you to believe.

 

[Deep Funk]

Quote:

No, I'm not saying the cd player is bad, I'm just saying that the integrated headphone out of the cd player provides the same audio quality as the headphone amp I bought for 450 dollars. I'm actually praising Maratnz.

When I was new on Head-Fi I used the headphone out of my Philips a lot. It still is a good headphone out but I prefer either a good integrated or a capable headphone amplifier because those devices can make a difference.