[Scott549]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunlun /img/forum/go_quote.gif The S4's bass gets quite a bit better with a full burn-in period. If you want a fun earphone for lively listening, it's great at its price. No worries about umph and the treble becomes nice with burn-in. The S4 is also very light and comfortable (the klipsch eartips are oval, so orient them correctly and you're set). They're both FOTM here, so I guess you won't go really wrong either way, just different preferences. If you buy the S4 from the Klipsch website (recommended), they you get a 30 day full refund if you're not satisfied and then the usual 2-year warranty (keep the receipt!) for all authorized Klipsch dealers. Something to keep in mind for sure.

I don't buy the burn-in theory at all. I got mine used; not sure how many hours they had on them, but the bass was boomy and still is. I think the bass will be exactly the same after 100 hours as it is out of the box. Your own adjustment to the sound signature can be very significant, however.

 

[Fandangoya]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunlun /img/forum/go_quote.gif It's a good plan. Just give the S4's 120 hrs burn in before you really listen and get them from klipsch.com. Then, listen for two weeks and decide if you like them. It take a few days to work through all the snap decisions back and forth on these sort of things. If not, nothing's lost! And you can still get the RE0 if you like (look into a warranty there, someone on the boards had a cable issue with his pair).

Thanks....how did you burn your's in? Just music or pink noise or something similar?

Also, can I burn them in using my laptop with no sound card? Or will it not drive them enought to fully burn in?

 

[lc483]

I got the S4i a couple weeks ago for my iPhone 3GS, and I very much like it, although there are a few annoyances. Also, I have not tried the RE0, so I cannot offer my comparisons.

For the S4i, I can say that the tips made HUGE differences for me. The oval single tips offered great bass, while the double flange tip offered less bass but better clarity. So, about the folks saying there is too much bass on the S4i, I'm not 100% they have tried multiple tips on them. I also just purchased the large double flanged tips and I'll see how those go, but it would have been nice if they included them.

If you get the regular S4, this won't concern you, but my annoyances are that the S4i come with a pouch rather than the tin (personal preference), and the mic quality appears to be decent, but you have to hold it up to your mouth to provide the most clarity.. Also I would prefer a thicker cable.

 

[Fandangoya]

Just put in my order for S4s. I have an iPhone, so I could have gotten the S4i, but the mic/controls aren't worth extra for me.

I'll be sure to try all the tips....are you using the ones that come with the S4s or some third party? I know a lot of people are fond of the Comply tips.

 

[Kunlun]

I've actually burned two pairs of S4s in (one for dad--I actually carefully razored open the package for his, burned them in and oh, he won't notice if I give them a listen myself...then carefully glued it back up--he was none the wiser!). I liked them enough that I got a pair myself. The change from hour 1 to hour 150 is noticeable.

I've used a range of music on an ipod played at a few steps above normal listening volume. I just picked music that had a full range of sound, some more treble-focused, some more bass-focused. I think a laptop would be fine.


Ahem, I don't want to rehash the burn-in thing for anyone, but if you look on the S4 appreciation thread, two guys each got two pairs of S4s. They each burned in a pair and left a pair new, then they compared and found there was a clear difference in SQ.
Ah, here's the (subjective) proof.

And here's the objective proof of burn in's effect for a moving coil (dynamic) driver, done here on full-size speakers.

Not that actual subjective AND objective proof will actually convince anyone!!!

 

[StereoIntegrity]

im on my 30th hour of burn in for my RE0 and the bass more and more is picking up nicely... RE0 have clear everything and i have yet to come across any sibilance at all...

 

[Scott549]

So it just happens that the longer you play music through the S4's, the more the bass "settles down," and the longer you play music through the RE0, the more the bass "picks up." All of these earphones just happen to change in the way you want them to change. I've never heard anyone say the sound gets worse. That's because it's your brain that is changing -- they sound better because you acclimate to the sound. Burn-in is a complete myth. You are fooling yourselves.

 

[Kunlun]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott549 /img/forum/go_quote.gif So it just happens that the longer you play music through the S4's, the more the bass "settles down," and the longer you play music through the RE0, the more the bass "picks up." All of these earphones just happen to change in the way you want them to change. I've never heard anyone say the sound gets worse. That's because it's your brain that is changing -- they sound better because you acclimate to the sound. Burn-in is a complete myth. You are fooling yourselves.

Click on the links I posted.

One of them is a lab test showing objective, measurable changes in SQ over time.

Why do you hate science?

Actually, even the other, subjective test I linked to disproves your theory that it's solely an acclimation effect. Some of it may be acclimation for most of us, but the two links I posted show that there's more to it than that.

Just click the links, open your mind, admit you were wrong and move on. It's easy.

 

[Scott549]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunlun /img/forum/go_quote.gif Click on the links I posted. One of them is a lab test showing objective, measurable changes in SQ over time. Why do you hate science? Actually, even the other, subjective test I linked to disproves your theory that it's solely an acclimation effect. Some of it may be acclimation for most of us, but the two links I posted show that there's more to it than that. Just click the links, open your mind, admit you were wrong and move on. It's easy.

1. Your first link doesn't work.

2. The second link does not say there is a discernible difference in the perception of sound with a driver as small as those used in an IEM, does it?

3. If you are the scientific one, then what is your explanation as to why burn-in always makes the sound better? Shouldn't it make it better half the time and worse half the time?

4. On the subject of science again, why is there not a single double-blind study showing that people can tell the difference between brand new and burned-in IEMs?

 

[StereoIntegrity]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott549 /img/forum/go_quote.gif So it just happens that the longer you play music through the S4's, the more the bass "settles down," and the longer you play music through the RE0, the more the bass "picks up." All of these earphones just happen to change in the way you want them to change. I've never heard anyone say the sound gets worse. That's because it's your brain that is changing -- they sound better because you acclimate to the sound. Burn-in is a complete myth. You are fooling yourselves.

burn in seems to work on my cars subs so i wouldnt doubt that the RE0 is the same....speakers need burn in and this is also the opinion of the majority of car audio freaks

 

[rawrster]

The question of does burn in exist will never be solved. You either believe it or you dont. It's as simple as that.

 

[Scott549]

It could be solved with scientific tests. You can either perceive a difference or you can't.

 

[Kunlun]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott549 /img/forum/go_quote.gif 1. Your first link doesn't work. 2. The second link does not say there is a discernible difference in the perception of sound with a driver as small as those used in an IEM, does it? 3. If you are the scientific one, then what is your explanation as to why burn-in always makes the sound better? Shouldn't it make it better half the time and worse half the time? 4. On the subject of science again, why is there not a single double-blind study showing that people can tell the difference between brand new and burned-in IEMs?

1.here's the first link:
http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f103/k...ml#post6110402
This disproves your theory that burn-in is entirely an acclimation effect. If you want a larger study, then fund it yourself.

2. You're being disingenuous. There is a measureable difference in SQ for a moving coil driver over time. That means there is a physical basis for burn-in. Furthermore, burn-in is now an objectively verifiable effect for stand-alone speakers. Even you now admit that since you no longer claim it's a myth, only that somehow the objectively verifiable changes in SQ for a moving coil speaker over time will not be audible in iem-size speakers (my first link is a significant step in disproving even this). You've already been forced from your initial position.

3. If you had been a discerning reader, you'd notice that it's NOT always a positive change. Some people like how their dynamic iem initially sounds.

4. Put your money where you mouth is and we'll have just that. In the meantime, you have been forced to concede that there are objectively measureable changes in SQ for room size speakers which have the very same type of drivers as those in dynamic driver based iems.

 

[brendon]

There are some stories where burn-in caused the sound to degrade as well.

Look up Mylarone burnout for more details.

And why is burn-in so hard to believe ? How to you account for people to initially HATE their earphones and then suddenly LOVE their earphones ? A bit strange don't you think ?

If one or two people posted such things it can be easily discredited. However if you notice some IEMs like the Klispch mentioned above seem to need more burn-in than other IEMs like the RE0s or RE1s. (My RE1s seemed fine after just one night of burn-in)

So there is definitely some substance to the so called mass hysteria of burn-in believers as the amount of hours that people suggest for burn-in is different for each IEM.

 

[Scott549]

1.here's the first link:
http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f103/k...ml#post6110402
This disproves your theory that burn-in is entirely an acclimation effect. If you want a larger study, then fund it yourself.

The one you cited is not scientifically valid. Funding it myself is not a reasonable option.

2. You're being disingenuous. There is a measureable difference in SQ for a moving coil driver over time. That means there is a physical basis for burn-in. Furthermore, burn-in is now an objectively verifiable effect for stand-alone speakers. Even you now admit that since you no longer claim it's a myth, only that somehow the objectively verifiable changes in SQ for a moving coil speaker over time will not be audible in iem-size speakers (my first link is a significant step in disproving even this). You've already been forced from your initial position.

From what I have read, the measurable difference is so small that it is unlikely to produce a perceptible change.

3. If you had been a discerning reader, you'd notice that it's NOT always a positive change. Some people like how their dynamic iem initially sounds.

I guess I am not discerning enough, then, because I've probably read 200 posts here about how the sound has improved and I can't recall a single one to the effect that "These sounded pretty good right out of the box, but after about 40 hours of burn-in, the bass became bloated and some sibilance developed."

4. Put your money where you mouth is and we'll have just that. In the meantime, you have been forced to concede that there are objectively measureable changes in SQ for room size speakers which have the very same type of drivers as those in dynamic driver based iems.[/QUOTE]

I would love to do a scientific test but I do not have the capacity to do a double blind study.