[BoyNamedSue]

I a/b-ed my modded Jade 2's with Stax 009 off a KGGG last night and impressed the Jade 2's can hold their own given how legendary the 009's are in their own right.

They both seem to have similar levels of detail and transperency, and both sound lush/euphonic given the tuning of my system.

The overall sound of the 009's seem more refined and neutral with more weight of bass notes, more natural decay, and better microdynamics. The treble has a velvety smoothness to it on the 009s while the Jade 2's treble is more crystalline with brighter edges that can be fatiguing at times.

They seem to present sound stage differenly. With the 009's, I feel like I'm sitting first few rows in a concert hall and sound stage is more coherent with properly sized and solid imaging.

In the other hand, I feel like my ears are the mic itself with the Jade 2's which allows for a more intimate experience of the music, as if the singers are face to face with me. This makes for a more emotional experience.

The size of the images on the Jade seem larger given the up close quality of the sound stage, and sound stage stretches all around me as if I'm surrounded by the performers.

Both 009s and Jade 2's are fast but I think the Jade 2s are slightly faster. There is an effortless, fluid flow to the music without any smearing/losing form. The PRaT on the Jade 2's have a fun and upbeat quality to it, whereas the 009s are more even keeled. The Jade 2's make me want to get up and dance whereas the 009s make me want to sit back and relax.

Too bad the cable on the Jade 2's is short to freely dance with them. I tried the Stax extension cable and it seemed to smear details and make sound less lively.

 

[PointyFox]

The PRaT on the Jade 2's have a fun and upbeat quality to it, whereas the 009s are more even keeled. The Jade 2's make me want to get up and dance whereas the 009s make me want to sit back and relax.

As far as anyone can tell "PRaT" is just a measure of how much someone likes what they're hearing and has absolutely nothing to do with "Pace, Rhythm, and Timing" as its name suggests. If something sounds more "fun and upbeat", that particular setup is enhancing the qualities that make it sound "fun and upbeat" to the listener such as boosting treble and bass. I just thought I'd mention it because I hate the term "PRaT" as it's misleading and a very roundabout way to talk about sound preference.

 

[BoyNamedSue]

Thanks for the clarification. My audio vocab is limited to mainly what I read on these forums. My understanding of prat relates to the flow of the music. Usually i think something has good prat is if it has a toe tapping effect, which ime is an important quality in my enjoyment of a headphone. Is there a better term that captures this quality?

 

[BoyNamedSue]

Just googled PRaT. Didn't realize it was such a controversial term.

 

[forestitalia]

It is some time that I'm listening extensively the Jade headphones with the dedicated amplifier Jade. Well, is the only electrostatic amp I have an the moment, so no comparison, just long session First, I found out that the amplifier need to be very warm to perform good, my fault because in past I didn't use it enough. I'm not going to listening before is an hour on, to my ears is better when very hot, I don't know why, maybe some materials need heat to work properly, I remember that the Auralic Vega was similar, had to leave it always stand-by. Lets see if someone else noticed it, or is my ear problem
Second, I'm looking a dac as best pair, so far not sure, I gave a try to the D90 but no, all together too 'musical', must be dac with exaggerated extension, upper-bottom, and great separation.
I keep searching.

 

[BoyNamedSue]

@foresitalia, I have a similar experience with my Jade 2's where it takes a good 45 min to one hour to reach its optimal sound. I think the Jade 2's are so revealing that it can even nuances in warm up time.

 

[BoyNamedSue]

Inner-baffle Sorbothane mod.



This mod involves sticking small pieces of sorbothane on the tabs (where there is a small gap) of the inner baffle as seen in the attached photo. This mod is a good fit for those who want to increase bass impact and shift the frequency response to be more neutral. I have consistently found the stock to be on the brighter side and lacking bass impact in my system, and I have found this to be the best and most elegant solution for reducing the brightness and increasing fullness to the sound. One potential downside is that it gives perception that music is slower.

I had previously tried putting blue tak on the same tabs, but I do not recommend this, due to the blue tak damaging the dust cover if you decide to remove/adjust the mod. Specifically, when I pulled out the inner baffle, small amounts of blue tak fell on the dust cover, and attempts to remove the blue tak on the dust cover ripped it apart. I learned this the hard way, and eventually had to completely remove the dust cover. Thankfully, my Jade 2's are still working fine but it may be a matter of time before dust comes in. Thus, I recommend Sorbothane over blue tak as it is cleanly removable and poses little to no risk of damaging the dust cover.

Here are instructions:

Prep:
1. Purchase either 1/10, 70 duro Sorbothane film: https://www.amazon.com/Isolate-Sorb...ywords=sorbothane&qid=1606838481&s=hi&sr=1-10. I used 1/8 but it was too thick and had to shave a bit off on top to make it fit. 1/10th would be better fit.
2. Cut out 12x (6 on each side), 0.5cm x 1cm rectangular pieces.
3. Find a clean, dust-free area to do the work.
4. Find something to wedge between the left and right sides to create some distance between the ear cups to make the operation easier. I used a rectangular shaped trivet placed between where the head bands intersect with the ear cups.
5. The only tool you really need is a small phillips screwdriver, but it may also be helpful to have something to cover the driver while you are doing mod (e.g., plastic film, dust free cloth).

Steps:
1. Use a credit card to remove the earpads. Just wedge the card between the gap between the earpads and housing, and pry apart along the perimeter with your finger tips.
2. Remove the 8 screws. Be careful not to strip the screws and avoid screw driver accidentally slipping into the driver.
3. Use same screw driver to pry apart the inner baffle without moving or disturbing the driver. The driver should stay in the housing for entirety of the mod. Sometimes the rectangular pattern filter comes apart with the inner baffle. This is no problem, just don't forget to reinsert it when its time to re-assemble.
4. While doing mod, cover the driver with something to protect it from dust falling in. Your driver should still have the cover on so it is probably not necessary but just in case.
5. Adhere the small pieces of Sorbothane on the six tabs in the picture. Sorbothane needs some compression to work, and what's great about this mod is that when you re-insert the baffle into housing, the sorbothane should compress automatically due to how tight the gap is. Please note that I've observed that too much compression can lead to boomy bass, so just slight compression is needed.
6. Re-insert the modded baffle into the housing. You shouldn't need to force it in. If so, this may result in too much compression.
7. Re-insert the 8 screws.
8. Re-insert the ear pads.

I'm curious as to people's impressions if they get to try this mod. This mod is easily removable if it is not to your taste, or if you think it doesn't do much. I'm not sure if its the Sorbothane, the mass loading, or just filling in the gaps that make the difference. In the latter's case, other materials may work just as well, but Sorbothane worked for me, especially with its acoustic dampening properties.

 

[BoyNamedSue]

Currently, my Jade 2's have three distinct mods, but the above-mentioned inner-baffle Sorb mod is the only one I recommend. Overall, the combination of the three mods has made the sound more neutral (brightness reduced), full-bodied, weighty and natural (less shouty), but speed, sound stage, and instrument separation seems to have been reduced slightly. My Jade 2's are noticeably heavier with these mods (similar to weight of my HE1000's), so not sure if it is the mass loading improving sound or the Sorbothane itself.

1. Inner-baffle Sorbothane mod. Recommended.
2. Added pieces of Sorbothane all around the exterior of earcups and headband. Not recommended if you care for aesthetics but recommended if ultimate goal is SQ.
3. Removed dust cover. Not recommended for obvious reasons. I was forced to do this due to accidentally ripping my dust cover.

In addition, I would like to share my trial and error process, so others can be informed from what worked and didn't work for me, including my mistakes (in chronological order of my process):

1. Acoustic filter just inside the outer grill. I cut out an oval shaped shelf liner (one layer) and placed it just inside the outer grill. Sound got smoother and soundstage slightly more coherent and better center focus, but sound stage shrunk. Two layers of the shelf-liner resulted in congestion. One layer = mixed results. Two layer = not recommended.

2. Blue tak in gaps in the headphone ear cups. Increased bass and and fullness to sounds, but sound became slightly congested and slightly less transparent. Too much blue tak had a "fish bowl" effect. Not recommended due to risk of damaging dust cover! As an aside, removing the blue tak was a PITA.

3. Removed dust cover. Added transparency but obvious downside of risking dust getting into driver. Not recommended.

4. Removed rectangular pattern filter (located between the inner baffle and driver). Sound became slightly more natural, but there appeared to be less instrument separation. Mixed results.

5. Acoustic filter in ear pad. I cut out an oval shaped shelf liner and put it in earpad. This made sound too smooth and rounded. Mixed results.

6. Rubber cord in ear pad. I added 1/8 " diameter rubber cord in the inside perimeter of the ear pad. Sound got wonky. Not recommended.

7. Sorbothane on exterior of earcups and headband to dampen mechanical vibration. Made overall sound more natural, full-bodied, weighty, and neutral, but slower and slightly less transparent. Also, this mod ruins the aesthetics and added noticeable weight to the headphones (weight is now about same as my he1000's). Mixed result but I lean towards recommending it.

8. Sorbothane in inner-baffle. See above post. Recommended.

I said this the last time, but I think I'm finally satisfied with the sound. I haven't this much fun modding headphones since my HE6's and its been a great learning process in how the housing affects the sound. Adding/removing the amount of Sorbothane on the exterior also allows you to "EQ" the sound, less is brighter, more is darker.

IMHO, I think the modded Jade 2's are one of the best headphones I've heard in my system, and goes toe to toe with my Stax 009's and 007's, but presents the music differently (more musical, fast, and lively).

 

[Mufti]

@TeamHiFiMAN

Can we please get a JADE III like this one?

 

[crion]

I just upgraded my DAC from Mytek Liberty to a Topping D90 MQA. There was a hidden setup menu to disable preamp and BT, asio buffer 2048, ROON endpoint advanced/disable MQA core decoder.

But all things done, this is one sweet DAC. The soundstage opened up and is more enveloping than ever before, more liquid. So these cans keep on scaling with the source!

Thankyou @TeamHiFiMAN !

 

[ColSaulTigh]

Hey gang!

Very late to the party, but since I'm just now getting into estat, I decided to pick up both the Jade II and the Shangri La Jr. from HiFiMan this weekend in an Ambien-fueled spending spree. While I wait for the reality of my actions to hit me square in the wallet I was wondering - do the Jade II benefit from pad rolling? I see the Dekoni makes a few pads for them and was curious if they might improve the (from what I'm reading) light bass issue.

Thoughts?

Thanks!

 

[AudioCats]

..... pick up both the Jade II and the Shangri La Jr. from HiFiMan this weekend .....

nice, can't wait to read your reviews on them.

 

[Therkild]

Being the only actual person here that has Jade II and Jr, i say they are more different than anything else. And Jr and 009 are also VERY different. I have a KGSSHV Carbon coming in and will benchmark them both again.
The Jade for the cost is extremely good sounding.

I'm considering one of these and from what I read, it's "mandatory" to lisetn to the Jade before even considering the Shangri La Jr? Is this correct interpreted?

 

[ColSaulTigh]

So I had someone ask me if the Shang Jr was worth getting in a private message the other day, and I thought I'd post my reply here because it seems to be fitting:

"Thanks for dropping me a note! The short answer is - no.

The longer answer is.....probably not, and here's why:

I had originally planned on buying a pair used from the classifieds for $2,500, which is a decent price for them. But I had an issue with my "play money" account and long story short, had to pass on them. Fast forward a week or so and in an Ambien-fueled shopping spree, I wound up ordering them new directly from HiFiMan (along with the pair of Jade II's). And here's where the problems begin.

The packaging is terrible. For $4,000, you get a poorly made "leather-wrapped" box with an aluminum panel on the front. Except my leather was chewed up on the edges, the box was covered in dust, and the panel was no longer glued to the box. So minus 1 point for poor presentation. Problem #2 is the cable - it's WAY too short (for my liking), it's very cheap (compared to a Stax ribbon cable), and it is a nylon-wrapped, somewhat unwieldy mess. Problem #3 is that the Shangri La Jr. are very poorly constructed. Yes, the earcups are made from aluminum. Everything else is plastic or cheap stamped steel. The earcups squeak and creak when you move them. They feel like they are $29 headphones from Walmart.

Now for the positives - they do sound very good. Slightly dry, and lack bass, but they are very clean, crisp, and flat (with the typical roll-off of bass on the low end that all estats suffer from). The bass is there, but it's not gonna slam you around. You KNOW you're hearing a cello or a bass, but you can't really FEEL it.

So, knowing all that, here's where the problem lies - they're too expensive at retail to justify them instead of spending another $1k-$1,500 for a (slightly) used set of Stax x9000 (which are far superior, IMO), -OR- at the $2,500-ish used price point, they're too expensive when you can get a pair of used Stax 007 Mk 2.9 (or 2.5, for that matter) for $1,200-$1600-ish which have more bass but are not quite as resolving. The Stax 009 is probably comparable, but I've yet to hear them.

Here's the other problem. The Jade II's are, for the price, REALLY good if you can look past the all-plastic build quality. They sound every bit as good as the 007 (without as much bass, mind you), and on the used market can be had for $600.

So the quandry is, as always, money. If you can afford it, just jump straight to the x9000 and don't look back. If you're looking for flagship lite, save money and go with the 007's and do the bass port mod (about $5 worth of "Blue Tack" putty from Amazon). If you want the best "value" priced, get a pair of Jade II's. There's a pair in the classifieds now for $630, but I'd steer clear of those - the pads look like they're shredded and you will find better deals if you're patient.

As for energizers, invest in quality. I had a Stax SRM-007t v1 which was good, but not great. I happened upon my Kevin Gilmore Grounded Grid in the classifieds, and it's an incredible amp. $3,500 shipped, and it's dead quiet and sounds amazing! You can have one built for about $5k +/-, or pick up some of the other quality variants (Moljnir, T2, Carbon, etc.) that pop up in the classifieds all the time.

A final word of caution - I had a very bad experience with Audeze regarding the CRBN. I WANTED love them, but I got two defective pair in a row, and their customer service was very elitist and not really interested in taking care of a customer. So I've sworn off them. YMMV, but I can't recommend them.

Feel free to ask any follow up questions you may have - I'm here to help!"

 

[ThanatosVI]

So I had someone ask me if the Shang Jr was worth getting in a private message the other day, and I thought I'd post my reply here because it seems to be fitting:

"Thanks for dropping me a note! The short answer is - no.

The longer answer is.....probably not, and here's why:

I had originally planned on buying a pair used from the classifieds for $2,500, which is a decent price for them. But I had an issue with my "play money" account and long story short, had to pass on them. Fast forward a week or so and in an Ambien-fueled shopping spree, I wound up ordering them new directly from HiFiMan (along with the pair of Jade II's). And here's where the problems begin.

The packaging is terrible. For $4,000, you get a poorly made "leather-wrapped" box with an aluminum panel on the front. Except my leather was chewed up on the edges, the box was covered in dust, and the panel was no longer glued to the box. So minus 1 point for poor presentation. Problem #2 is the cable - it's WAY too short (for my liking), it's very cheap (compared to a Stax ribbon cable), and it is a nylon-wrapped, somewhat unwieldy mess. Problem #3 is that the Shangri La Jr. are very poorly constructed. Yes, the earcups are made from aluminum. Everything else is plastic or cheap stamped steel. The earcups squeak and creak when you move them. They feel like they are $29 headphones from Walmart.

Now for the positives - they do sound very good. Slightly dry, and lack bass, but they are very clean, crisp, and flat (with the typical roll-off of bass on the low end that all estats suffer from). The bass is there, but it's not gonna slam you around. You KNOW you're hearing a cello or a bass, but you can't really FEEL it.

So, knowing all that, here's where the problem lies - they're too expensive at retail to justify them instead of spending another $1k-$1,500 for a (slightly) used set of Stax x9000 (which are far superior, IMO), -OR- at the $2,500-ish used price point, they're too expensive when you can get a pair of used Stax 007 Mk 2.9 (or 2.5, for that matter) for $1,200-$1600-ish which have more bass but are not quite as resolving. The Stax 009 is probably comparable, but I've yet to hear them.

Here's the other problem. The Jade II's are, for the price, REALLY good if you can look past the all-plastic build quality. They sound every bit as good as the 007 (without as much bass, mind you), and on the used market can be had for $600.

So the quandry is, as always, money. If you can afford it, just jump straight to the x9000 and don't look back. If you're looking for flagship lite, save money and go with the 007's and do the bass port mod (about $5 worth of "Blue Tack" putty from Amazon). If you want the best "value" priced, get a pair of Jade II's. There's a pair in the classifieds now for $630, but I'd steer clear of those - the pads look like they're shredded and you will find better deals if you're patient.

As for energizers, invest in quality. I had a Stax SRM-007t v1 which was good, but not great. I happened upon my Kevin Gilmore Grounded Grid in the classifieds, and it's an incredible amp. $3,500 shipped, and it's dead quiet and sounds amazing! You can have one built for about $5k +/-, or pick up some of the other quality variants (Moljnir, T2, Carbon, etc.) that pop up in the classifieds all the time.

A final word of caution - I had a very bad experience with Audeze regarding the CRBN. I WANTED love them, but I got two defective pair in a row, and their customer service was very elitist and not really interested in taking care of a customer. So I've sworn off them. YMMV, but I can't recommend them.

Feel free to ask any follow up questions you may have - I'm here to help!"

Thx for this Feedback.
Very interesting.

When will you try the DCA estats?