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I think this might be due to personal preference, i see your point but i want to make sure something, integrated sound cards sucks.. i'm in computer science, and i can ensure you, based on 10+ years of experience that they do.. even those that are targeted for "GAMING" or "Awesome 7.1 STEREO" sucks.. mostly is some kind of bad emulated virtual 7.1 that in reality is a mere 2.0 with BAD quality.. Try any decent headphone (with decent i'm not necessarily talking about something like the Focal Elear (lul) but even something as basic as a K420 studio or something like that) and you will understand what i mean if you try to compare it with ANY decent DAC (like Fiio A3, even if now there are some better alternatives that are cheaper)
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I think this might be due to personal preference, i see your point but i want to make sure something, integrated sound cards sucks.. i'm in computer science, and i can ensure you, based on 10+ years of experience that they do.. even those that are targeted for "GAMING" or "Awesome 7.1 STEREO" sucks.. mostly is some kind of bad emulated virtual 7.1 that in reality is a mere 2.0 with BAD quality.. Try any decent headphone (with decent i'm not necessarily talking about something like the Focal Elear (lul) but even something as basic as a K420 studio or something like that) and you will understand what i mean if you try to compare it with ANY decent DAC (like Fiio A3, even if now there are some better alternatives that are cheaper)
Well i mentioned a JDS Labs Ol DAC, are you saying that's not a decent DAC? I use it with a JDS Atom and AKG/Beyer HPs so I have tried it with decent gear.
...and its not personal preference. I bought an Ol DAC and would prefer that to sound better but it sounds the same.
Well i mentioned a JDS Labs Ol DAC, are you saying that's not a decent DAC? I use it with a JDS Atom and AKG/Beyer HPs so I have tried it with decent gear.
...and its not personal preference. I bought an Ol DAC and would prefer that to sound better but it sounds the same.
Did i said that? i don't think so, i just said that, in my opinion, based on my personal experience, integrated sound cards sucks, even on high-end well known "gaming" brands, like ROG/Asus or Realtek, not because they don't know or can't make it, just most of the time audio is the most overlooked part in a "GAMING" motherboard unfortunately.
but i want to make sure something, integrated sound cards sucks.. i'm in computer science, and i can ensure you, based on 10+ years of experience that they do
I'm not sure why you felt compelled to appeal to your authority (as a CS, of all things). Do you have measurements or blind listening test results confirming that "integrated sound cards suck"?
Did i said that? i don't think so, i just said that, in my opinion, based on my personal experience, integrated sound cards sucks, even on high-end well known "gaming" brands, like ROG/Asus or Realtek, not because they don't know or can't make it, just most of the time audio is the most overlooked part in a "GAMING" motherboard unfortunately.
I'm not sure why you felt compelled to appeal to your authority (as a CS, of all things). Do you have measurements or blind listening test results confirming that "integrated sound cards suck"?
Compelled? i may ask you the same thing, i just expressed my own personal opinion based on my experience, again, i tested various motherboards, among those many were targeted as "7.1 audio" or as high quality integrated sound cards, but they, compared to a cheaper dedicated DAC, simply weren't.. this wasn't based on actual measurements, just my listening using relatively low imp headphones at the time (70 ohm or something less i don't really remember, still, not crazy), but again, as i said, is just my opinion, might be unpopular but that's my way of seeing it.
Now that's real talk, obviously I can't doubt your experience and I thank you for sharing it.
I have to say that I still didn't hear any difference between various DACs and headphone amps, ranging from USB-powered PCM2704 to EMU 0404, ODAC and dual mono 1955 DIY DAC (made not by me, sadly, but by someone who actually know what they're doing). I used lossless rips of known "audiophile" CDs and listened through HIFIMAN HE-400 and Sennheiser HD800. And I swear I tried hard to hear any reason why I paid $150 for EMU 0404 over the $5 for PCM2704. I even compared EMU to PCM+its internal headphone amp and still didn't hear a difference.
I didn't listen to HD800 much, though, as I didn't like their sound at all, these must be the most over-hyped headphones I owned to date. But I intend to give it another go as I acquired a decent SACD player and I want to get a good original SACD disk to give my DAC and amp comparisons the most credible source / transport I can.
Now that's real talk, obviously I can't doubt your experience and I thank you for sharing it.
I have to say that I still didn't hear any difference between various DACs and headphone amps, ranging from USB-powered PCM2704 to EMU 0404, ODAC and dual mono 1955 DIY DAC (made not by me, sadly, but by someone who actually know what they're doing). I used lossless rips of known "audiophile" CDs and listened through HIFIMAN HE-400 and Sennheiser HD800. And I swear I tried hard to hear any reason why I paid $150 for EMU 0404 over the $5 for PCM2704. I even compared EMU to PCM+its internal headphone amp and still didn't hear a difference.
I didn't listen to HD800 much, though, as I didn't like their sound at all, these must be the most over-hyped headphones I owned to date. But I intend to give it another go as I acquired a decent SACD player and I want to get a good original SACD disk to give my DAC and amp comparisons the most credible source / transport I can.
That's really strange, well, anyone's taste is different, and you may be less sensitive to a source change while i'm more, audio is some of the most subjective argument out there probably, i would suggest you to try something like a OPPO HA 2 tho, paired with a similar price headphone, which imho was great for the price, but not mine unfortunately..
Maybe I need to understand what to listen for, specifically.
As for that OPPO device - thanks for the recommendation! It's way too expensive for me, but if I see one on sale used I may get it.
Looks like Benchmark has still got it with their products. Think Benchmark DAC is what I really should get, even if only to not hear any difference yet again
Eh, I like to know I've given it the best chance I could. Having equipment that is objectively audibly transparent (i. e. impossible to be "heard" by any human) means I never have to worry about it ever again.
But yes, from my experience so far, the acoustic system / headphones is where it's at. Spend money on that. Then get a good enough amp. Then everything else.
Now that's real talk, obviously I can't doubt your experience and I thank you for sharing it.
I have to say that I still didn't hear any difference between various DACs and headphone amps, ranging from USB-powered PCM2704 to EMU 0404, ODAC and dual mono 1955 DIY DAC (made not by me, sadly, but by someone who actually know what they're doing). I used lossless rips of known "audiophile" CDs and listened through HIFIMAN HE-400 and Sennheiser HD800. And I swear I tried hard to hear any reason why I paid $150 for EMU 0404 over the $5 for PCM2704. I even compared EMU to PCM+its internal headphone amp and still didn't hear a difference.
I didn't listen to HD800 much, though, as I didn't like their sound at all, these must be the most over-hyped headphones I owned to date. But I intend to give it another go as I acquired a decent SACD player and I want to get a good original SACD disk to give my DAC and amp comparisons the most credible source / transport I can.
Hearing the difference in inexpensive dacs is hard to do as I find a few I have there is very little difference in them as well. The difference in a Modi3, Khadas Tone Board and Dragonfly Red is none for me sound so similar I could not pick out which is which. Now the difference in my Yggdrasil and those is night and day to me but it was at considerable expense yes and I think most days can pick out my Chord Mojo as well.
As for the Emu 0404 it cost more because it does more as it is a recording device and has a ADC as well as a DAC I used to own one when I was playing around with recording my hapless guitar playing.
I find it harder to tell the difference in dacs and easier to tell the difference in amps most of the time.
The difference between Modi Multibit and Gungnir Multibit (A1) was disappointingly small. The difference between the Airist R-2R DAC and Metrum Amethyst is also small but noticeable.
The difference between Gumby and the RDAC/Amethyst is massive.
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