[Solarium]

Change may be coming, but it isn't here yet. Not for me. If and when Android phones evetually all migrate to USB-C, that would be a much more reasonable proposition. I would never buy a phone (or headphones) that use a proprietary Apple connector.

I'm also very curious about the engineering in Apple's dongle. Very un-Appple like to offer something at that price.

Doesn't USB-C include analog passthrough?

 

[RugbyPlayer]

  You need to relax. Can you explain why pins can under no circumstances change from digital to analog?

because it isnt as simple as just flipping the input to a pin. The properly carry an analog signal, especially when switched requires significantly more work in terms of isolation or youll get to much noise and interference through it. You cannot just flip a digital interface to carry an analog signal, especially one that is controlled by standards which lightning is.
 
and no, usb-c does not support analog passthrough

 

[shotgunshane]

According this USB C does: https://9to5mac.com/2016/04/27/intel-wants-to-eliminate-3-5-mm-headphone-jack-like-rumored-iphone-7-suggests-usb-c-as-replacement/

 

[RugbyPlayer]

it doesnt, look at the actual spec not some random mac website. USB-C does not support analog out. Some other company could implement it to do it, but it would be a hack, not an officially supported interface

 

[Baroninkjet]

And what about shielding issues while charging? Hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm..........
 
The other "surprise" I bet is coming is the internal DAC is replaced with something cheaper (and amplifier weaker?), since it doesn't have to support headphones anymore. (Heck, they gotta make up the cost of increased memory someplace.)
 
Good news is the Note and LG V20 are picking up Apple's fumble.

 

[bosiemoncrieff]

For more on why, here's the definitive take.

 

[shotgunshane]

From anandtech.com
http://www.anandtech.com/show/10273/intel-proposes-to-use-usb-typec-cables-to-connect-headsets-to-mobile-devices

"In fact, USB-C can be used to transfer analog audio in accordance with the specification of the connector. It all comes down as to how that audio is transmitted.

The USB-C has sideband use pins (SBU1 and SBU2) which can be used for analog audio in audio adapter accessory mode. Use of the sideband pins should not impact data transfers and other vital functionality of USB-C cables, which should make them relatively simple from the engineering point of view. In this case, the USB-C connector will just replace the 3.5 mm mini jack and may even gain some additional features, such as a thermal sensor in an earpiece could measure temperature for fitness tracking."

 

[RugbyPlayer]

From anandtech.com
http://www.anandtech.com/show/10273/intel-proposes-to-use-usb-typec-cables-to-connect-headsets-to-mobile-devices

"In fact, USB-C can be used to transfer analog audio in accordance with the specification of the connector. It all comes down as to how that audio is transmitted.

The USB-C has sideband use pins (SBU1 and SBU2) which can be used for analog audio in audio adapter accessory mode. Use of the sideband pins should not impact data transfers and other vital functionality of USB-C cables, which should make them relatively simple from the engineering point of view. In this case, the USB-C connector will just replace the 3.5 mm mini jack and may even gain some additional features, such as a thermal sensor in an earpiece could measure temperature for fitness tracking."

has it been done? nope. this is a proposal and has yet to actually be used in a single consumer level device. I'm in the industry, i know what i'm talking about

 

[cj3209]

   
And to those who own 2 dozen shirts or a dozen headphones, I ask - why????
 
Bizarre.

It saves me dry cleaning trips.  

 

[trellus]

  has it been done? nope. this is a proposal and has yet to actually be used in a single consumer level device. I'm in the industry, i know what i'm talking about

The fact that it is being proposed for USB-C suggests that it can be developed; while I doubt that this is what Apple has done for Lightning (especially given that this adapter, according to the Apple web site is compatible with all iOS devices that can run iOS 10 and have the port), it at least leaves open the possibility that Apple did do that.  
 
It does seem out of character for Apple to sell a DAC/amp, however cheap it is to them, for $9.   Even their Lightning-to-USB cable costs more than that, which at least suggests that Apple perhaps worked out a solution to carry analog audio over Lightning.
 
Granted, the other possibility is that the DAC in that little thing is just so very mediocre, or that they're not making the same profit margins they make on normal cables -- it just seems very "un-Apple" to me, though perhaps they could be doing it to reduce the inevitable grumbling about needing an adapter in the first place.

 

[RugbyPlayer]

 
The fact that it is being proposed for USB-C suggests that it can be developed; while I doubt that this is what Apple has done for Lightning (especially given that this adapter, according to the Apple web site is compatible with all iOS devices that can run iOS 10 and have the port), it at least leaves open the possibility that Apple did do that.  
 
It does seem out of character for Apple to sell a DAC/amp, however cheap it is to them, for $9.   Even their Lightning-to-USB cable costs more than that, which at least suggests that Apple perhaps worked out a solution to carry analog audio over Lightning.
 
Granted, the other possibility is that the DAC in that little thing is just so very mediocre, or that they're not making the same profit margins they make on normal cables -- it just seems very "un-Apple" to me, though perhaps they could be doing it to reduce the inevitable grumbling about needing an adapter in the first place.

its no more un-apple than removing a headphone jack when a major marketing part of the iphone is their music playback. thats EXTREMELY un-apple. and apple wouldnt make this drastic of change and price gouge you for it, the backlash would be to great

 

[shotgunshane]

Lol. Well, let's recap:
- it's impossible
- it's a hack, not a spec
- it's a proposal of a spec that hasn't been done yet

 

[trellus]

But if this cable is a DAC, it does seem strange that they would only charge $9 for it, when all the other third-party competitors are around $40.  I could get them throwing it in for free with purchase of a phone or there could be significant backlash, but replacements for $9?  Very strange.
 
Must be a really low-end DAC. 

 

[shotgunshane]

If the pre-release/rumor article I posted earlier is the real dongle, this is how they say it worked:

"When the Lightning to 3.5 mm adapter is plugged into a device running iOS 9 or lower, the software displays an incompatibility message to the user, but when used on devices with a beta of iOS 10 installed, the dongle appears to work "immediately" without any issues. The author also notes that if headphones are plugged into both the standard headphone jack on a current iPhone and the adapter connected to Lightning, the device gives priority to the Lightning port for audio output. "

 

[RugbyPlayer]

If the pre-release/rumor article I posted early is the real dongle, this is how they say it worked:

"When the Lightning to 3.5 mm adapter is plugged into a device running iOS 9 or lower, the software displays an incompatibility message to the user, but when used on devices with a beta of iOS 10 installed, the dongle appears to work "immediately" without any issues. The author also notes that if headphones are plugged into both the standard headphone jack on a current iPhone and the adapter connected to Lightning, the device gives priority to the Lightning port for audio output. "

 
because installing ios10 suddenly adds more traces on the pcb for analog audio?