[Antihawk]

  Hi everyone,
Haven't posted here (on Head-Fi in general) for quite some time.
But nice to be back.
 
How do the ER4s get along with the Fiio DAPs?
X1, X3.2, X5.2
Do they happen to work with iTunes, though some extension or other?
 
Still looking for a Classic though.

I own the X1, so I can speak for that. I use X1 DAP + E12A amp combo for my ER4S at the moment. 
 
The X1 only works with local files. It's pretty easy to get songs on to it. You just drag and drop everything from the computer to the X1's micro SD card when you connect it to the computer. Getting all your iTunes music on there is easy, in that sense. No other features, though.
 
The ER4S with the X1 + E12A really opens them up. Instrument separation is on another level in my opinion. If you're just using the X1 with no external amp, you can EQ up some of the missing sub-bass, which helps.
 
The UI on the X1 is very similar to that of the older iPods. The wheel navigation system works great. The screen is a bit small and leaves a little to be desired, but if you have average eyesight, you shouldn't have a problem making out any writing.
 
I'd avoid 6th gen iPod Classics. As far as I know, it has a rubbish DAC relative to previous gens. Though you should be fine if you bypass that DAC and buy an external DAC/amp.
 
All in all, I don't see any need to get a Classic over the Fiio X1. I put in a 128gb micro SD card and have all the storage I could hope for. That can only go up in the future, too.

 

[Antihawk]

I haven't gushed about how brilliant the ER4s are in a while. I thought I would now.
 
I borrowed some SE846s from a friend, as I was curious how my perception of the ER4S compared to my perception of the top -- price-wise, at least -- UIEMs. I also own the IE800s (which have admittedly plummeted in price) and K3003s, both of which I haven't listened to in ages. I decided to give them all a whirl again.
 
I bought the ER4s for £170 ($265), the IE800s for £300 ($465) and my friend got the SE846s for £600 ($938).
 
Words cannot describe how much I am love with the Etys. All three of these other IEMs just sound muddled and bass-heavy relative to the ER4S. They have no detail/resolution and poor treble extension (especially the SE846s). I found myself wanting to remove the horrible sound from my ears within a few minutes and return to the blissful Etys. 
 
No need to spend any more than £170 for my ideal earphones. 

 

[csglinux]

  Hi everyone,
Haven't posted here (on Head-Fi in general) for quite some time.
But nice to be back.
 
How do the ER4s get along with the Fiio DAPs?
X1, X3.2, X5.2
Do they happen to work with iTunes, though some extension or other?
 
Still looking for a Classic though.

Hi Dreamthinker, It has been a while. Welcome back! It so happens I've been playing with the 2nd gen X5 (and 2nd gen X3) for the last couple of weeks. They both sound good with the ER4S, mainly on account of the extra juice. At lower volume levels (volume matched to my iPhone 6), I'd have to say sound quality differences aren't nearly as large as I expected. For the ER4S, I'd have to recommend the X3.2 over the X5.2. The newer X3 model has a very slightly warmer sound signature (which I think fits better with the ER4S), plus it's smaller, lighter, has better battery life and still has all the other cool features that the X5.2 has (OTG USB, external DAC capability, etc.). The X3.2 does have a bit of a noise floor with more sensitive IEMs, but you'll never hear that with the impedance of the ER4S.
 
iTunes is a no-go. It's dragging and dropping stuff into folders. One other thing to be aware of, the EQ function on the Fiios is not very fine-grained. You get only a small number of (very wide) frequency bins to adjust. I find the Fiio EQ a bit clunky and not so useful.

 

[HiFiChris]

@csglinux:
 
As you have got the X3II and X5II and probably also the first generation models (?), could you please do a quick comparison regarding the noise floor with sensitive IEMs?
I haven't found anyone having done this yet and the ones that own both the first and second generation devices were not able to detect any noise at all (but there is definitely noise on the first generation X3, I am quite sensitive towards hiss).
It would be very kind if you could do so.

 

[james444]

  @csglinux:
 
As you have got the X3II and X5II and probably also the first generation models (?), could you please do a quick comparison regarding the noise floor with sensitive IEMs?
I haven't found anyone having done this yet and the ones that own both the first and second generation devices were not able to detect any noise at all (but there is definitely noise on the first generation X3, I am quite sensitive towards hiss).
It would be very kind if you could do so.

 
Which firmware is your X3 on? Some pre-fw3.0 decoders have been quite noisy on the first gen X3, just saying...

 

[HiFiChris]

 
@csglinux
:

As you have got the X3II and X5II and probably also the first generation models (?), could you please do a quick comparison regarding the noise floor with sensitive IEMs?
I haven't found anyone having done this yet and the ones that own both the first and second generation devices were not able to detect any noise at all (but there is definitely noise on the first generation X3, I am quite sensitive towards hiss).
It would be very kind if you could do so.

Which firmware is your X3 on? Some pre-fw3.0 decoders have been quite noisy on the first gen X3, just saying...

I'm using the latest FW provided by James in the official X3 thread.

Also, I'm referring to the noise floor that is present while playback is paused, not some noise that may be on the recording or due to encoding.

It is not bothering as I just usw my X3 for traveling where ground noise is irrelevant due to non-quiet environment. I'm just thinkting of getting the X5 to get along as semi-portable DAP for use at home, so I am interested in someone's experience who owns the old and new generation X3/X5 and definitely spotted hiss on the first generation.

 

[uzi2]

I'm using the latest FW provided by James in the official X3 thread.

Also, I'm referring to the noise floor that is present while playback is paused, not some noise that may be on the recording or due to encoding.

It is not bothering as I just usw my X3 for traveling where ground noise is irrelevant due to non-quiet environment. I'm just thinkting of getting the X5 to get along as semi-portable DAP for use at home, so I am interested in someone's experience who owns the old and new generation X3/X5 and definitely spotted hiss on the first generation.

I've had both X3 and X5 and have not experienced hiss with ER4S. The ground noise would have to be pretty severe (indicating a faulty unit) to be noticeable with these IEMs.
Surely the ER4s will isolate your "non-quiet environment" making the fact that they will not reproduce hiss even more relevant.
 
Edit: You are likely to get a better response posting in the FiiO threads as there will be plenty of X3/X5 owners with sensitive IEMs. Even the ER4P is not particularly sensitive.

 

[HiFiChris]

I'm using the latest FW provided by James in the official X3 thread.


Also, I'm referring to the noise floor that is present while playback is paused, not some noise that may be on the recording or due to encoding.


It is not bothering as I just usw my X3 for traveling where ground noise is irrelevant due to non-quiet environment. I'm just thinkting of getting the X5 to get along as semi-portable DAP for use at home, so I am interested in someone's experience who owns the old and new generation X3/X5 and definitely spotted hiss on the first generation.

I've had both X3 and X5 and have not experienced hiss with ER4S. The ground noise would have to be pretty severe (indicating a faulty unit) to be noticeable with these IEMs.
Surely the ER4s will isolate your "non-quiet environment" making the fact that they will not reproduce hiss even more relevant.

Just to clarify, I wrote down "with sensitive IEMs" (which the ER-4S aren't) a few posts ago. I also don't hear any hiss with the X3 and my ER-4S.

And by the way, while traveling I use different IEMs than the Ety.

Edit:
I've already posted in the FiiO threads but the users who replied either didn't hear any hiss at all, used insensitive IEMs or didn't have the first generation FiiOs.

 

[uzi2]

Just to clarify, I wrote down "with sensitive IEMs" (which the ER-4S aren't) a few posts ago. I also don't hear any hiss with the X3 and my ER-4S.

And by the way, while traveling I use different IEMs than the Ety.

Edit:
I've already posted in the FiiO threads but the users who replied either didn't hear any hiss at all, used insensitive IEMs or didn't have the first generation FiiOs.

I also know of a few original X3/X5 users who have sensitive IEMs (Shure SE846 and JH Angie) who hear no hiss.
They appear to be the worst IEMs for demonstrating this. It has also been widely discussed in the Chord Hugo thread. My conclusion is that some people are a lot more sensitive to hiss than others and hence you get a wide variety of responses with the same IEMs.
 
The Etys are made for travelling - why not use them? - the isolation is second to none.
 
Thankfully the question of hiss is completely irrelevant to this thread.

 

[HiFiChris]

^^^

As csglinux seems to have experience with both the X5II and X3II and was able to detect some hiss with more sensitive IEMs, I asked him if he could probably do a quick comparison between the X3's, X5's, X3II's and X5II's noise floor.

And as you said, some people are more sensitive to hiss than others, thatKs what I also experienced during many active years in a German audio online community.

Coming back at your question why I don't use the Etys for traveling - when driving on the highway or being on the go I just prefer some of my other IEMs to the Etys I mainly use in rather quiet environment for critical and concentrated listening.

 

[headdict]

FWIW, I heard no hiss with 1st gen X3 and HF5, even in very quiet environments.

 

[james444]

I'm using the latest FW provided by James in the official X3 thread.

Also, I'm referring to the noise floor that is present while playback is paused, not some noise that may be on the recording or due to encoding.

 
The noise I was talking about was neither in the recording nor due to encoding, it was a result of decoding artifacts. Anyway, thanks for clarifying.
 

And as you said, some people are more sensitive to hiss than others, thatKs what I also experienced during many active years in a German audio online community.

 
I'd pm @shigzeo , he's the resident hiss maven around here.

 

[uzi2]

^^^

As csglinux seems to have experience with both the X5II and X3II and was able to detect some hiss with more sensitive IEMs, I asked him if he could probably do a quick comparison between the X3's, X5's, X3II's and X5II's noise floor.

And as you said, some people are more sensitive to hiss than others, thatKs what I also experienced during many active years in a German audio online community.

Coming back at your question why I don't use the Etys for traveling - when driving on the highway or being on the go I just prefer some of my other IEMs to the Etys I mainly use in rather quiet environment for critical and concentrated listening.

I certainly wouldn't recommend Etys (or any other IEM) for driving. I would hope it is also illegal like use of mobile phone.
In a quiet environment, I will use fully open headphones. The Etys are my on the go choice.

 

[csglinux]

^^^

As csglinux seems to have experience with both the X5II and X3II and was able to detect some hiss with more sensitive IEMs, I asked him if he could probably do a quick comparison between the X3's, X5's, X3II's and X5II's noise floor.

And as you said, some people are more sensitive to hiss than others, thatKs what I also experienced during many active years in a German audio online community.

Coming back at your question why I don't use the Etys for traveling - when driving on the highway or being on the go I just prefer some of my other IEMs to the Etys I mainly use in rather quiet environment for critical and concentrated listening.

Hi HiFiChris, I've never owned the first gen X3 or X5, so I can't make that comparison. Sorry. What I can tell you is the second gen X3 (mine shipped with firmware 1.1) has a lot of hiss from its amp (which you can clearly hear, even in pause mode) when used with a sensitive IEM like the SE846. I don't know how to put that hiss on a scale of 1 to 10 because everyone hears these things differently and I like to avoid hyperbole in general, but I'm sensitive to hiss and to me it is unbelievably awful. For a stand-alone DAP that's marketed as a "hi-res" audio device, it's unforgivable to have this kind of a noise floor. To give some perspective, with the same SE846, I hear no noise floor at all with the second gen X5 (firmware 1.0) or even with my iPhone 6. But with the ER4S, there's no hiss on the X3ii either

 

[castleofargh]

just to point out that noises when in pause might have nothing to do with noise when playing music. it is not at all a good indication of the noise that will actually be there when playing.
as pause is often associated with some part of the circuit being cut off, sometimes to hide the hiss that really was there when playing, so the paused DAP will seem perfectly clean. sometimes it's the other way around, when paused, some noises are loud, but they go away when playing(don't know why, I suspect that when the signal is cut off, it might change the impedance in the circuit or create some instability, stuff way over my head. but the result is crap all over only when paused).
obviously I would expect people to talk about hiss when the DAP is playing. as the rest is irrelevant to music.
 
and yeah er4s isn't a hiss prone IEM, while the hf5 certainly is. not the most sensitive, but still way up there.
in fact it's simple, if the noise is a constant (and not a noise that goes up with rising the volume level), then from the sensitivities we know that the hf5 will make any component noise 15db louder than the er4S when both are level matched.