[Mython]

Quote:

Hi all, I may be getting an HDP-R10 via a trade, but am wondering if I'd be better off with DX100. Can anyone who's owned / used both tell me the pros and cons of these two?

 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/656501/what-is-the-best-most-economical-way-to-obtain-an-hdp-r10-japanese-version-dx100-in-usa#post_9302208

 

[Loquah]

Quote:

I can only say the hep r10 I own sounds great and has no issues

If I were you read the dx100 thread that should be enough to make ur decision really easy
AL D

 
I've actually just come to this thread after spending ages on the DX100 thread (I was originally planning on a DX100).
 
Every player has it's issues (just look at the AK100 and Tera Player threads). I am happy to work with most limitations of a player, but when there are 2 almost identical, I figure I should get the one that's "better" (subjective, I know).
 
Any comparisons of DX100 vs R10 in terms of usability and  sound quality?

 

[rudi0504]

I've actually just come to this thread after spending ages on the DX100 thread (I was originally planning on a DX100).

Every player has it's issues (just look at the AK100 and Tera Player threads). I am happy to work with most limitations of a player, but when there are 2 almost identical, I figure I should get the one that's "better" (subjective, I know).

Any comparisons of DX100 vs R10 in terms of usability and  sound quality?

Hi Loquah

We have done the comparison 2 days ago between 5 DAP as follow :
Dx 100 vs
HDP R10
AK 100 stock
AK 100 mod
Studio V 3rd Edition



Dx 100 with the latest firmware 1.42 stil can not compete my HDP R10
Dx 100 :
High : is as smooth and clean and clear my HDP R 10
Mid : my HDP R10 sweeter like tube sound midrange
I can hear how the singer speak the pronounciation more clear
Bass : my HDP R10 has more body , detail and better bass impact / more solid.
Separation : my HDP R 10 has better separation , sounding more balance than dx 100
Soundstage : my HDP R 10 is wider and toler than dx 100
Conculsion : the closest SQ to AK 100 mod

Note : to making together judgement ,we connected all the dap to active speaker too
Beside pair with LCD 2 rev3 and VModa M10

This our personal impression

 

[Loquah]

Hi Loquah

We have done the comparison 2 days ago between 5 DAP as follow :
Dx 100 vs
HDP R10
AK 100 stock
AK 100 mod
Studio V 3rd Edition



Dx 100 with the latest firmware 1.42 stil can not compete my HDP R10
Dx 100 :
High : is as smooth and clean and clear my HDP R 10
Mid : my HDP R10 sweeter like tube sound midrange
I can hear how the singer speak the pronounciation more clear
Bass : my HDP R10 has more body , detail and better bass impact / more solid.
Separation : my HDP R 10 has better separation , sounding more balance than dx 100
Soundstage : my HDP R 10 is wider and toler than dx 100
Conculsion : the closest SQ to AK 100 mod

Note : to making together judgement ,we connected all the dap to active speaker too
Beside pair with LCD 2 rev3 and VModa M10

This our personal impression

Great description! Thanks Rudi!

 

[rudi0504]

Great description! Thanks Rudi!

Thank you and How is your AK 100 ?

 

[rudi0504]

HDP R10 line out to pico power simply the best sound quality can come out from HDP R 10
Can drive my ULS SIG PRO so sweet and high end SQ

 

[Veenrok]

I can't understand, how can a 3,3V battery drive head phones better than a 8,5V battery of dx100. HDP R 10 is made for IEM.

 

[rudi0504]

I can't understand, how can a 3,3V battery drive head phones better than a 8,5V battery of dx100. HDP R 10 is made for IEM.

It is not true HDP R 10 is not only for driving iems

The HDP R 10 battery is not 3,3 Volt , it is :

(Corresponding to the Electrical Appliance and Material Safety Law) will be equipped with a lithium-polymer battery capacity of 4800mAh.

And use op amp 627

The dx 100 battery is :

Power Source：Built-in 2000mAh 8.4V Li-polymer Battery pack

HDP R 10 has more ampere compare to dx 100

 

[the wizard of oz]

Quote:

Quote:

Hi Loquah

We have done the comparison 2 days ago between 5 DAP's as follows :
DX100 vs
HDP-R10
AK100 stock
AK100 mod
Studio V 3rd Edition



DX100 with the latest firmware 1.4.2 still can not compete  with my HDP-R10
DX100 :
High : is as smooth and clean and clear as my HDP-R10
Mid : my HDP R10 sounds sweeter, like tube sound midrange
I can hear the singer's pronunciation more clearly
Bass : my HDP-R10 has more body, detail and has better bass impact / more solid.
Separation : my HDP-R10 has better separation, sounding more balanced than DX100
Soundstage : my HDP-R10 is wider and deeper than DX100
Conclusion : the closest SQ to AK100 mod

Note : so that we could make a joint assessment, we connected all the DAP's to active speaker too
Beside pair with LCD 2 rev3 and VModa M10

This our personal impression

Great description! Thanks Rudi!

And with firmware version 1.2.7, does this ranking still stand, or did you not try it in the comparison, considering that by auditioning the DX100 on its own, latest 1.4.2 is the best sounding FW version yet?

 

[Veenrok]

Quote:

It is not true HDP R 10 is not only for driving iems

The HDP R 10 battery is not 3,3 Volt , it is :

(Corresponding to the Electrical Appliance and Material Safety Law) will be equipped with a lithium-polymer battery capacity of 4800mAh.

And use op amp 627

The dx 100 battery is :

Power Source：Built-in 2000mAh 8.4V Li-polymer Battery pack

HDP R 10 has more ampere compare to dx 100

You do understand that mAh and Volts - are not the same thing, right? Plus DX100 has two 2000 mAh batteries as well as HDP R 10 has two batteries. They ever look the same. The difference is in voltage and the connection scheme. R10 has parallel scheme when dx100 has a sequential scheme, so dx100 also has 4000 mAh. If it had only 2000mAh, the battery life would have been moutch less then 6-7 hours with 8,5V. And a 2000 mAh battery doesn't need such big space that dx100 battery has.  If the capaсity of the R10 battery was twice the amount of dx100, it would be twice bigger in size, because lithium has it's limitations in power and size!
 
I am surprised that a HDP R 10 user doesn't know it's battery voltage. As I know, the R10 has a battery with 3.3V because of the Japaniese market, where DAPs with small life time have bad sales, and that is the only reason (Maybe it's not exactly 3,3V, but it's surely half the voltage of dx100). You can double check this information, and ever check the voltage, if You want. If I am wrong in the voltage question, I would appreciate a correction. 
 
This is not an issue if You are using an external amp, if I'm not mistaking. And the difference between dx100 and R10 sound with IEM must be generrally in SW, because in audiotract HW they are practically the same! Even the phone amp is also OPA627 + Buf634
 
Audiotract of HDP R 10:

 
DX100:

 
I'm not a specialist. The difference is in the power supply circuit, right?

 

[Mython]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Veenrok /img/forum/go_quote.gif

You do understand that mAh and Volts - are not the same thing, right? Plus DX100 has two 2000 mAh batteries as well as HDP R 10 has two batteries. They ever look the same. The difference is in voltage and the connection scheme. R10 has parallel scheme when dx100 has a sequential scheme, so dx100 also has 4000 mAh. If it had only 2000mAh, the battery life would have been moutch less then 6-7 hours with 8,5V. And a 2000 mAh battery doesn't need such big space that dx100 battery has. If the capaсity of the R10 battery was twice the amount of dx100, it would be twice bigger in size, because lithium has it's limitations in power and size!
 

 
 
 
 
 
Forgive me if I'm missing something here, but how do you propose that the DX100 can use the same cells as the HDP-R10, but operate at twice the voltage yet still have same capacity  as the HDP-R10?
 
You cannot have something for nothing.
 
 
If you have 2 cells, each of them having individual specification of 3.7 v and 2000 mah, then you can combine them in two ways. You can connect them in parallel configuration and keep same voltage and achieve double capacity, or you can connect them in series configuration and keep same capacity and achieve double voltage:
 
 
 3.7 v 2000 mah configure x2 in  Parallel = 3.7 v 4000 mah
 
 3.7 v 2000 mah configure x2 in    Series = 7.4 v 2000 mah
 
 
I am just discussing principles here. In reality, iBasso quote DX100 battery as 8.4 v 2000 mah, and Hibino quote HDP-R10 battery as 4800 mah
 
In addition to Hibino perhaps wishing to supply a DAP with better battery duration, there may be other issues to consider, such as perceived safety of running lithium batteries in series, which can be potentially explosive unless a balancing circuit is employed, which iBasso have assured me they do use in the DX100 battery pack. Personally, I do still prefer the idea of using the Hibino battery configuration, though.
 
It will be interesting to see if the upcoming iBasso DX50 (http://www.head-fi.org/t/661167/dx50-a-new-smaller-dap-coming-from-ibasso) uses a 3.7v pack (I suspect it will).
 
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Veenrok /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
 
This is not an issue if You are using an external amp, if I'm not mistaking. And the difference between dx100 and R10 sound with IEM must be generrally in SW, because in audiotract HW THEY ARE THE SAME! Even the phone amp is also OPA627 + Buf634
 
This is the audiotract of HDP R 10:

 
This is dx100:

 
Thankyou for posting both pictures of HDP-R10 / DX100 circuit boards.
 
It is interesting that there are clearly differences in the layout of the boards, if you look at the far right of each of the photographs.
 
I've highlighted the areas I mean, in the edited pics below:

 

[Mython]

 

 

[Veenrok]

Mython, as I understand, it is the power supply. But I am not a specialist. 

 

[Rollk2]

And that's why HDP-R10 could be charged in USB 5V. Could something confirm that's possible to charge the HDP-R10 like that ? Thanks

 

[Mython]

Quote:

Mython, as I understand, it is the power supply. But I am not a specialist.

 
 
Neither am I, but I think you are possibly correct.
 
 
 
Quote:

And that's why HDP-R10 could be charged in USB 5V. Could something confirm that's possible to charge the HDP-R10 like that ? Thanks

 
Apparently, USB charging does not work on the HDP-R10:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/656501/what-is-the-best-most-economical-way-to-obtain-an-hdp-r10-japanese-version-dx100-in-usa#post_9363104