Hugo TT 2 by Chord Electronics - The Official Thread
Feb 16, 2021 at 4:04 PM Post #12,526 of 19,009
I just missed buying one last week for $3300 on Forum here. Mint, still warranty. I looked everywhere. I'm sure one will pop up but I am impatient and because I've bought before I got a discount that was the best I was offered from three dealers.
 
Feb 16, 2021 at 4:16 PM Post #12,527 of 19,009
I just missed buying one last week for $3300 on Forum here. Mint, still warranty. I looked everywhere. I'm sure one will pop up but I am impatient and because I've bought before I got a discount that was the best I was offered from three dealers.
That seems to be the range for used MS with warranty in the US.
It's tough to be patient in audio but there will always be shiny objects for sale!
I was fortunate to snag one listed on the forum in January for $3250, mint condition with warranty.
 
Feb 16, 2021 at 4:31 PM Post #12,528 of 19,009
That seems to be the range for used MS with warranty in the US.
It's tough to be patient in audio but there will always be shiny objects for sale!
I was fortunate to snag one listed on the forum in January for $3250, mint condition with warranty.
NWave. Have you been watching the Prada/America's Cup? Those new 75 Foil boats are incredible. One hit 100 kph a few weeks back.
 
Feb 16, 2021 at 4:40 PM Post #12,530 of 19,009
NWave. Have you been watching the Prada/America's Cup? Those new 75 Foil boats are incredible. One hit 100 kph a few weeks back.

No but I'll check it out!
Foiling sure has gained popularity for windsurfing and kite boarding here in The Gorge. Thankfully we get a lot of big wind days here and I am only tempted to try foiling on light days when I can't get out.
 
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Feb 16, 2021 at 11:39 PM Post #12,531 of 19,009
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Feb 17, 2021 at 1:09 AM Post #12,532 of 19,009
"gain bass but lose transparency" but is this that simple ?
Maybe one thing you will got is lose transparency which also can be seen as gain in bass.

Things are not so easy when it comes to perception of the sound. I'm still having a headache when comparing some of the audio components.
Has particular component better bass ? Maybe its just bloated ? Maybe its output impedance is higher hence damping factor is lower. Is "bigger" bass depending only on power ? And finally what is "bigger" bass ? Does it mean bass goes deeper or is bigger acoustically? or softer muddier ?
I don't know I only know one thing there is a lot of things that influence your sound perception.
One thing that shows me that raw power doesn't particularity mean "better" bass (again what is better ?)

Once I was using some low end Harman Kardon integrated amplifier. I used it only as a power amplifier (bypassing it's preamp) - pre amp and dac was Hugo 2.
Back then my speakers were: bowers and wilkins dm602 s3.
Once I changed my power amplifier to clone of high end dartzeel power amplifier.
My bass perception changed dramatically.
At first I was shocked: "omg my bass disappeared what is going on. I have more power now I should get "better" bass".
Clone was rated about 140-150wats into 8ohms and Harman was about 70wats into 8ohms.
So doubling the power but my bass was like 2 times weaker.

Anyway after listening for some time and comparing each amplifiers I realized that I gained a lot of transparency in sound. I wasn't losing any bass. With Harman
I was just losing transparency. Bass was bloated not fully controlled. Music sounded like it has this coat. Mids were recessed. And I get it some people like this.
If I invited 10 random people and have them listen to both amplifiers and compare. I'm sure 10/10 would have said that Harman is better because of perception of bass.
Once transparency improved everything sounded leaner better controlled. Also the dynamics were like squashed. At least it sounded a bit like this - everything was more even sounding.

I don't want to criticize anybody's taste in music reproduction. As I said I'm still having headaches when comparing some of the gear and trying to evaluate their overall sound quality.
One thing is for sure: it's hard and once your personal preferences step into place it's even harder.
You pose a lot of great questions. After some folks reported hearing no difference between the SE and balanced XLR, I did some A/B testing myself. I can provide a few of my own answers to your questions about what exactly is better about the bass coming from the TT2's XLR outputs.

Gear
AB 1266 TC (burned in 250 hrs): volume -19 for balanced, -13/-12 for SE
ZMF Verite Closed (burned in at least 400 hrs): volume -30 balanced, -24/-23 for SE
Cables: both Norne Silvergarde S3, in dual XLR3 for the rear and 1/4 SE.
I am running the M-Scaler, with WAVE stream BNC cables.

Test tracks
1. SHAED - ISOU (particularly the bridge's sub-bass tones)
2. Gold Fields - Make Me Feel (which has bass synths throughout and 4/4 beat).
3. Little Dragon - Another Lover (wonderful bass track, incredible bridge)
4. Phoenix - 1901 (this song is basically a lot of treble but bass-capable headphones really make it a different experience).

I know the volume adjustment is supposed to be ~6 but at this adjustment the difference was pretty obvious to me. I have been primarily been using the XLR outs and am very accustomed to the sound, especially with my test tracks. Switching to the SE, the bass is just not as full and satisfying. Anemic, as some others have called it. To be fair, still very good since both headphones have great bass reproduction.

For the purpose of this test, I added +1 gain on SE (-12 on 1266 TC, -23 on VC) just for kicks. Overall the volume via SE for everything else was louder than I was comfortable with (confirming for me that the +6 gain adjustment is correct) but just analyzing the bass, there was still a clear difference which I can summarize as follows: the XLR output produces a louder and more physical, impactful bass experience, particularly in the sub-bass rumble. I can feel the sound pressure hitting my ears more, and my temples/mandible/ mastoid process all vibrating a little more. This was most apparent during the bridge in the songs ISOU and the breathtakingly bassy bridge in Another Lover. It retains all the texture and tonal quality of the SE bass, but is just more present and abundant. The SE bass is present and is within reach, but the XLR bass, particularly the 1266's, is like a demon trying to possess you.

So to summarize, yes, better bass. Haha.

As always, YMMV. I think that's my first time saying that. I guess I'm an official Head-Fier now.
 
Feb 17, 2021 at 1:31 AM Post #12,533 of 19,009
You pose a lot of great questions. After some folks reported hearing no difference between the SE and balanced XLR, I did some A/B testing myself. I can provide a few of my own answers to your questions about what exactly is better about the bass coming from the TT2's XLR outputs.

Gear
AB 1266 TC (burned in 250 hrs): volume -19 for balanced, -13/-12 for SE
ZMF Verite Closed (burned in at least 400 hrs): volume -30 balanced, -24/-23 for SE
Cables: both Norne Silvergarde S3, in dual XLR3 for the rear and 1/4 SE.
I am running the M-Scaler, with WAVE stream BNC cables.

Test tracks
1. SHAED - ISOU (particularly the bridge's sub-bass tones)
2. Gold Fields - Make Me Feel (which has bass synths throughout and 4/4 beat).
3. Little Dragon - Another Lover (wonderful bass track, incredible bridge)
4. Phoenix - 1901 (this song is basically a lot of treble but bass-capable headphones really make it a different experience).

I know the volume adjustment is supposed to be ~6 but at this adjustment the difference was pretty obvious to me. I have been primarily been using the XLR outs and am very accustomed to the sound, especially with my test tracks. Switching to the SE, the bass is just not as full and satisfying. Anemic, as some others have called it. To be fair, still very good since both headphones have great bass reproduction.

For the purpose of this test, I added +1 gain on SE (-12 on 1266 TC, -23 on VC) just for kicks. Overall the volume via SE for everything else was louder than I was comfortable with (confirming for me that the +6 gain adjustment is correct) but just analyzing the bass, there was still a clear difference which I can summarize as follows: the XLR output produces a louder and more physical, impactful bass experience, particularly in the sub-bass rumble. I can feel the sound pressure hitting my ears more, and my temples/mandible/ mastoid process all vibrating a little more. This was most apparent during the bridge in the songs ISOU and the breathtakingly bassy bridge in Another Lover. It retains all the texture and tonal quality of the SE bass, but is just more present and abundant. The SE bass is present and is within reach, but the XLR bass, particularly the 1266's, is like a demon trying to possess you.

So to summarize, yes, better bass. Haha.

As always, YMMV. I think that's my first time saying that. I guess I'm an official Head-Fier now.
What do you feel the difference in resolution was between the 2. Just how wide would you say the gap is
 
Feb 17, 2021 at 6:56 PM Post #12,535 of 19,009
I have been using the TT2 since the last few months and been very pleased with the purchase. I do prefer pairing TT2 with LCD-3 (more musical), than with HD800s (Analytical but less enjoyable).

I am now considering adding the M Scaler. My question is whether its price justify the improvements . How much further would it improve on the already excellent TT2?
 
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Feb 17, 2021 at 7:03 PM Post #12,536 of 19,009
I have been using the TT2 since the last few months and been very pleased with the purchase. I do prefer pairing TT2 with LCD-3 (more musical), than with HD800s (Analytical but less enjoyable).

I am now considering adding the M Scaler. My question is whether its price justify the improvements . How much further would it improve on the already excellent TT2?
I suggest reading this review from a respected member here.
https://audiophilestyle.com/ca/revi...ord-electronics-hugo-m-scaler-hugo-tt-2-r781/
 
Feb 18, 2021 at 5:40 AM Post #12,538 of 19,009
Feb 18, 2021 at 6:11 AM Post #12,539 of 19,009
stop posting stuff like that, my wallet can't take it! :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

It may also represent the conclusions at one extreme. I think (correct me if I am wrong) from reading many, many impressions in this thread, and from my own experience, that the M Scaler brings about subtle improvements. This review suggests that they are of a "can't live without" level. Not questioning the truthfulness of his impressions, just saying one shouldn't buy outright expecting this. One might be disappointed.
 
Feb 18, 2021 at 8:34 AM Post #12,540 of 19,009
It may also represent the conclusions at one extreme. I think (correct me if I am wrong) from reading many, many impressions in this thread, and from my own experience, that the M Scaler brings about subtle improvements. This review suggests that they are of a "can't live without" level. Not questioning the truthfulness of his impressions, just saying one shouldn't buy outright expecting this. One might be disappointed.
CaptainFantastic, could I live listening to music using only my Chord Hugo TT2? Yes I could. Would I want to now that I have an M Scaler? No I don’t. I’ve been listening to Mahler’s Symphony No. 2 in C Minor in many recorded formats my entire life, and I’ve never never heard it sound so sublime and beautiful as it does now with the HMS/TT2 paired together.
 

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