[Jon L]

comparing the TT2, modi 3 + smsl sp200 and my Av receiver (Marantz sr 6013).

I would be interested to know TT2(DAC mode)->SMSL SP200 vs. TT2 (DAC+headphone amp mode vs front headphone jack) vs TT2 (DAC+headphone amp mode via rear XLR jacks).

 

[lawshredpower]

Is it possible to buy an extra PSU for the TT 2? Mine is tucked away neatly behind my desktop system and sometimes I feel like taking the Hugo to other rooms in my home.

 

[dawktah2]

Is it possible to buy an extra PSU for the TT 2? Mine is tucked away neatly behind my desktop system and sometimes I feel like taking the Hugo to other rooms in my home.

Yes, I bought one from my dealer, took a while to get it though.

 

[GreenBow]

Anyone interested, the 21st Anniversary Edition of HiFi + (issue 182), is the Editor's Choice Award magazine.

 

[HughF]

Anyone interested, the 21st Anniversary Edition of HiFi + (issue 182), is the Editor's Choice Award magazine.

I have that issue. It should have been really interesting but with NO price information for ANY chosen products and with some products they review having immense price tags I can't be bothered to look up all the original reviews to see if that product would bankrupt me or could be very interesting and cost-effective.

What a missed opportunity. They could even have just quoted the price when reviewed and added the review date to that, it would have taken almost no extra work. Shame.

Cheers,

Hugh

 

[N Quarter]

I am curious if anyone is using Klipsch Heresey 1V’s driven directly off their TT2, or has heard them? A friend on another forum mentioned how great the review’s on them are, a friend of his is using them now and loves them, but he is probably using an amp. The guy using them has owned many high end speakers from Dynaudio and PMC to name a couple... (C1’s, focus 340’s from Dyn and fact 8 and12’s from PMC). I looked them up and they are super efficient. The reviewer prefers them to his Dyn special 40’s which I owned, and are really good.


https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=10&ved=2ahUKEwiz3K3vw7zoAhWFQs0KHUweDZ4QtwIwCXoECAMQAQ&url=http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/2020/02/17/klipsh-heresy-iv-review-klipsh-steps-into-the-audiophile-realm/&usg=AOvVaw2JmsD4xpV80AtcwIlPSRtb

 

[GreenBow]

I have that issue. It should have been really interesting but with NO price information for ANY chosen products and with some products they review having immense price tags I can't be bothered to look up all the original reviews to see if that product would bankrupt me or could be very interesting and cost-effective.

What a missed opportunity. They could even have just quoted the price when reviewed and added the review date to that, it would have taken almost no extra work. Shame.

Cheers,

Hugh

Most HiFi + reviews are online. Since with any item that might catch your interest, it would be wise to seek more reviews. Meaning you would google anyway, and discover price and more opinion.

I don't see you problem. If you are looking for one or two bits of kit which most of us are. It's hardly a marathon to look a few of Hifi + Editors' Choice Award winners. You probably know the price of half the stuff you're interested in anyway.

I am subscribes to HiFi + digitally, so it's easy to find the reviews if I want. Either if their reviews are online or not.

 

[HughF]

Most HiFi + reviews are online. Since with any item that might catch your interest, it would be wise to seek more reviews. Meaning you would google anyway, and discover price and more opinion.

I don't see you problem. If you are looking for one or two bits of kit which most of us are. It's hardly a marathon to look a few of Hifi + Editors' Choice Award winners. You probably know the price of half the stuff you're interested in anyway.

I am subscribes to HiFi + digitally, so it's easy to find the reviews if I want. Either if their reviews are online or not.

I just have a print subscription so I'd have to juggle mouse and magazine. Many of the HiFi+ brands are little known and I don't know their prices by heart unless they are already familiar e.g. Chord DACs. My point was just that it would have taken so little extra work to be a really useful issue.
However, I'll leave it there as Chord does not publish HiFi+.
Hugh

 

[HumanMedia]

@MachineGunz
Hang on, AV receiver? The analog inputs to your AV receiver?
if so that is your problem. Most AV recevers don’t have an analog preamp section and use really cheap and nasty analog to digital converters to take the analog inputs back into digital. Definitely not recommended for any quality audio. or am I missing something?

 

[MachineGunz]

@MachineGunz
Hang on, AV receiver? The analog inputs to your AV receiver?
if so that is your problem. Most AV recevers don’t have an analog preamp section and use really cheap and nasty analog to digital converters to take the analog inputs back into digital. Definitely not recommended for any quality audio. or am I missing something?

My av receiver is the Marantz sr 6013.

It's connected to my PC via HDMI.

I bought it mainly for its stereo performance. It's actually very good.

A bit out of topic but:

I have a home theater system:

I had the svs prime satellite system which is a 1000$ 5.1 system with the Yamaha RXV 583 (an entry 500$ receiver)

I upgraded the front speakers to the ultra bookshelf speakers (1000$ a pair) to get better stereo performance - Since I used the speakers more than I used my headphones, But in music the LCD-X sounded much better than the speakers and it was really obvious.

I was very disappointed since the new bookshelf speakers sounded the same as the small satellites and the difference should be massive.

I then upgraded the Yamaha receiver to the Marantz sr 6013 (1500$) and the difference was huge, The Marantz sr 6013 brought my speakers to life and the differences between the LCD-X and my speakers became smaller and more acceptable.

It also was ok with driving the LCD-X through the headphone output on the receiver - Not the same quality as the modi 3 & smsl sp200 but it was fine.

I chose the Marantz sr 6013 because I read in reviews that it was very good with stereo performance and indeed it was.



When I got the TT2 I tested it and was underwhelmed so as I wrote here before - I compared it to the modi 3 & smsl sp200 and to the Marantz sr 6013.

As you said yourself - The DAC performance of the AV receiver should be quite bad when compared to a standalone DAC.

When I compared the TT2 with my LCD-X and with the headphone output of the Marantz sr 6013 The difference was very small and it drove me crazy.

The TT2 was only a bit better while it should have destroyed the Marantz sr 6013.

When I connected the TT2 to the Marantz via RCA to compare the TT2 with my av receiver with my speakers I could not tell a difference at all. With the headphones the difference was small but with the speakers they sounded Identical.

So I was extremely angry and disappointed so that's why I came here and asked for help.

Because there is absolutely no way that my AV Receiver and my 100$ Modi 3 pretty much sound the same as my 5000$ DAC / AMP.



Now, When I started to use TIDAL with exclusive mode I could hear a very large improvement with all of them, The TT2, the Modi 3 and my Marantz sry 6013.

And I finally started hearing differences between the TT2 and the Modi 3 and Marantz sr 6013, And now the TT2 is clearly superior to both (as it should be).

Yes the Marantz sr 6013 sound really really good with my speakers - Much better than before.

But the TT2 is just superior in every way - The soundstage depth of the TT2 is amazing, It creates an extremely wide front stage.

The TT2 is also more detailed and much more controlled.

I literally screamed when I heard the ACTUAL capabilities of the TT2 with my speakers - I stood up and started screaming because the control and detail of everything just shocked me. songs that I heard almost thousands of times now sound different and I can clearly clearly clearly hear new sounds I didn't knew existed - And sounds I did know sound much more detailed. The TT2 just creates an amazing 3D space. I can hear every single nuance.

And the bass of the TT2 is insane - My subwoofers are roaring!


And I get this experience EVEN while using cheap RCA cables to connect the TT2 to the Marantz sr 6013 - But the difference is here, The TT2 is better in every way.

Edit: Just did a small comparison with the TT2 vs Modi 3 - both connected to the Marantz sr 6013.

The modi 3 is leaner, And is obviously going for a cleaner sound with little bass.

The only advantage I heard with this is in Daft punk Pentatonix - at 03:21 you have these weird effects at the left side. They are clearer on the Modi 3.

But this comes at a cost of everything sounding much more leaner, thinner.

The TT2 is much fuller, deeper and is more detailed, able to suck out the details that just disappeared with the Modi 3.

 

[GreenBow]

I just have a print subscription so I'd have to juggle mouse and magazine. Many of the HiFi+ brands are little known and I don't know their prices by heart unless they are already familiar e.g. Chord DACs. My point was just that it would have taken so little extra work to be a really useful issue.
However, I'll leave it there as Chord does not publish HiFi+.
Hugh

Yes I forgot to mention that the Chord Huei won an Editor's Choice award in the that issue of HiFi +. Had meant to.

 

[absolutk]

Hi all - is there a dedicated thread for using the TT2 with loudspeakers? I couldn't find one and was wondering if it makes sense to create one vs letting the posts meander into this thread.

I traded in my Micromega M-One M150 and sold my pair of Magico S1 to try the Hugo TT2 + sensitive speaker route. Placed an order for a pair of Omega Super Alnico Monitors (Louis suggested I go with the standard, not High Output version, if what I like is imaging and accuracy), with Zenwave internal wiring and a pair of Sound Anchors. However, till the speakers arrive, I have my friend's pair of Avalon Acoustics IDEA loudspeakers (which I need to list for him!). I created a pair of RCA<>binding post adapters (can post the tutorial if someone is interested) using the extra Furutech FT-867 binding posts I had from my DIY days and hooked up the IDEAs using a pair of Sablon Audio Panatela cables. Yes, I am using just the 7wpc available through the RCA. Rated nominally at 4 ohms, and a sensitivity of a lowly 88 db/w/m, I wasn't expecting much from the IDEAs plugged into the TT2 directly, but BOY was I wrong.

Wowza. I've never heard my setup sound this transparent and neutral. I'm constantly between -15 and -5, volume-wise and will rarely go above +3 (when watching TV). I am not listening to music on low, quiet volume, mind you - this is at a point where I can't have a conversation without raising my voice. The IDEAs are augmented with a REL Carbon Limited (high level), and I can't tell where the speakers stop and the sub picks up. I didn't have this level of seamlessness with the Micromega. Now I'm a bit bummed for having sold the Magicos because I really really REALLY liked their sound, and at 87db/w/m, would not have taken much away from the system at the volumes I listen to it at.

I decided to try a pair of 15v Farad Super3 on the TT2 and M Scaler. They got delivered today. While the TT2 sees a marginal benefit (I will report back when the Farads have broken in a little), the HMS steps into a different league. There is far more channel separation with instruments and vocals finding their place and staying solidly there.

EDIT 1: Nobody wants to read a bunch of model numbers of my past gear . Happy to share my journey is anyone if interested in hearing it. Skipping to my current setup:

Isotek Aquarius
L Farad 7v > EtherRegen
L Farad 19v > QNAP NAS/Roon Server
L Farad 19v > Nuc7i7 in fanless case/Euphony
L Farad 7v > ISO Regen
L Farad 15v > Hugo M Scaler
L Farad 15v > Hugo TT2

EDIT 2: Some thoughts on the Farad vs stock SMPS below

I know this isn't a request for support, but I thought I'd share my impressions with the community, in case someone else is interested in this route!

 

[N Quarter]

Thanks for posting this, I think you are right in that we need a dedicated TT2/MScaler with speakers thread. I use my TT2/Mscaler to drive speakers directly too, and every time I post about it here, I feel like I am somehow in the wrong place.

 

[absolutk]

OK, so some more insights on the Farad Super3 on the TT2.

TL;DR: Stock SMPS is not quite up to snuff. The Farad brings detail and hence spatial awareness.

EDIT1: Rob Watts explains a few posts later why the SMPS is actually superior and what appears as detail to me is actually RF and commonly fools listeners.

I ran a little A/B testing tonight. 5 times, to be precise. I really wanted the SMPS to be better (or at least as good) - so I could justify following the manufacturers direction. Upon the first swap to the Farad, I felt like it was quieter, so was concerned about its ability to supply the required current. I tried hard to believe the sound was blurry, and hence weaker. But when I swapped back to the SMPS, it became obvious that the SMPS was suppressing a LOT of details and hence sounded shouty. I also wondered why the music stage shrunk to the 70° in front of me. Swapping back to the Farad, all the details in voices emerged, and sounds that float mid-air were actually found floating. As a result the stage widened at least an additional 30°. I listened to this for a few minutes before swapping back to the SMPS - to confirm what my ears were hearing. Sure enough - FLAT. What had decay and air on the Farad was flat and 2D. I listened to a couple more tracks on the SMPS before finally switching back to the Farad and realizing the point of this exercise. The main track was PD7 from Anoushka Shankar's Breathing Under Water, if anyone is curious.

Also, something to note: Even when you turn off the TT2 before swapping power, when the power cable is plugged in, the unit automatically powers on. It would be fine except there is a split second where the output stage gets current (you hear a thump on the speakers) and you see the volume LED come on during that time. I assume everyone else's TT2 does the same thing? And doesn't stay chilling in standby when power is plugged in?

 

[Arniesb]

My av receiver is the Marantz sr 6013.

It's connected to my PC via HDMI.

I bought it mainly for its stereo performance. It's actually very good.

A bit out of topic but:

I have a home theater system:

I had the svs prime satellite system which is a 1000$ 5.1 system with the Yamaha RXV 583 (an entry 500$ receiver)

I upgraded the front speakers to the ultra bookshelf speakers (1000$ a pair) to get better stereo performance - Since I used the speakers more than I used my headphones, But in music the LCD-X sounded much better than the speakers and it was really obvious.

I was very disappointed since the new bookshelf speakers sounded the same as the small satellites and the difference should be massive.

I then upgraded the Yamaha receiver to the Marantz sr 6013 (1500$) and the difference was huge, The Marantz sr 6013 brought my speakers to life and the differences between the LCD-X and my speakers became smaller and more acceptable.

It also was ok with driving the LCD-X through the headphone output on the receiver - Not the same quality as the modi 3 & smsl sp200 but it was fine.

I chose the Marantz sr 6013 because I read in reviews that it was very good with stereo performance and indeed it was.



When I got the TT2 I tested it and was underwhelmed so as I wrote here before - I compared it to the modi 3 & smsl sp200 and to the Marantz sr 6013.

As you said yourself - The DAC performance of the AV receiver should be quite bad when compared to a standalone DAC.

When I compared the TT2 with my LCD-X and with the headphone output of the Marantz sr 6013 The difference was very small and it drove me crazy.

The TT2 was only a bit better while it should have destroyed the Marantz sr 6013.

When I connected the TT2 to the Marantz via RCA to compare the TT2 with my av receiver with my speakers I could not tell a difference at all. With the headphones the difference was small but with the speakers they sounded Identical.

So I was extremely angry and disappointed so that's why I came here and asked for help.

Because there is absolutely no way that my AV Receiver and my 100$ Modi 3 pretty much sound the same as my 5000$ DAC / AMP.



Now, When I started to use TIDAL with exclusive mode I could hear a very large improvement with all of them, The TT2, the Modi 3 and my Marantz sry 6013.

And I finally started hearing differences between the TT2 and the Modi 3 and Marantz sr 6013, And now the TT2 is clearly superior to both (as it should be).

Yes the Marantz sr 6013 sound really really good with my speakers - Much better than before.

But the TT2 is just superior in every way - The soundstage depth of the TT2 is amazing, It creates an extremely wide front stage.

The TT2 is also more detailed and much more controlled.

I literally screamed when I heard the ACTUAL capabilities of the TT2 with my speakers - I stood up and started screaming because the control and detail of everything just shocked me. songs that I heard almost thousands of times now sound different and I can clearly clearly clearly hear new sounds I didn't knew existed - And sounds I did know sound much more detailed. The TT2 just creates an amazing 3D space. I can hear every single nuance.

And the bass of the TT2 is insane - My subwoofers are roaring!


And I get this experience EVEN while using cheap RCA cables to connect the TT2 to the Marantz sr 6013 - But the difference is here, The TT2 is better in every way.

Edit: Just did a small comparison with the TT2 vs Modi 3 - both connected to the Marantz sr 6013.

The modi 3 is leaner, And is obviously going for a cleaner sound with little bass.

The only advantage I heard with this is in Daft punk Pentatonix - at 03:21 you have these weird effects at the left side. They are clearer on the Modi 3.

But this comes at a cost of everything sounding much more leaner, thinner.

The TT2 is much fuller, deeper and is more detailed, able to suck out the details that just disappeared with the Modi 3.

I remember when i heard the Dave with KEF Reference 3 speakers it blow my mind more than any gimmicky Surround setup. Could be just me, but Sound depth and realism was much better than any Surround system.