[465176]

Has anyone here had any extensive listening comparing the TT2 to the benchmark dac3 or matrix audio x-sabre pro?

Reason being I have the other 2 dacs above and was curious how the TT2 compares.. Because, well, you know, there IS ALWAYS this itch somewhere that needs to be scratched...

I have owned both the DAC3 and TT2, and compared them extensively. The TT2 I felt was the superior sounding of the two, but it wasn’t a huge difference. Many here blow up small differences to be ‘day and night’, but if you think about it (and assuming the designers of each were solely concerned with accurate conversion of the original bandwidth-limited recording) if that is the case then one of the DACs sounds very different it is doing something to really corrupt the source... I felt the DAC3 had the edge with bass - it provided a really solid and resolute foundation for many types of music. Very enjoyable. It also had impressive levels of detail, but after a while I was of the opinion that it sounded like beautifully detailed paper cutout characters in a 3D soundstage, whereas with the TT2 the characters in that soundstage were also fully 3D and fleshed out. On its own the DAC3 was fine, but I found with TT2 it was far easier to ‘hear into’ the music. It opened up. The DAC3 in direct comparison sounded a bit flat and plasticky to me especially on Rock or Indie. I also felt the headphone stage on DAC3 was not as open or transparent as TT2 either. Nor was the control of the volume levels as accurate when using the remote. Impressive connectivity though (I still miss its analogue inputs!) and I do like the no-nonsense approach Benchmark take without creating a sort of ‘cult’ around the technology used, which to be honest I get tired of. They have a refreshing lack of ego or hype, and that’s reflected in their ergonomics too. It’s also half the price of TT2 as well which should be taken into account - it’s really superb value for money (or was until the remote was sold separately for £120!). Ultimately a used Chord Hugo TT for £1400 really gelled for my diverse musical tastes and sonic preferences however.

 

[AndrewH13]

I forgot to say, I was looking at your chain, Nuc with roon rock and mtt2, where does sotm neo fit in ?

I thought the SOTM was a network streamer, isn't thats what the Nuc with roon is for ? or am I missing something ? I'm easily confused so I probably am missing something.

I would of thought Nuc with roon rock as your core and the mscaler feeding your tt2 as your endpoint.

Nuc is the server, and many including those on Roon forums recommend a Bridge or Network streamer connected to your DAC, but NOT physically to the Server. So the Streamer can be beside or in another room, connected by Ethernet or Wi-Fi. The Stack Audio Link sounds interesting with John Westlake’s input on design. For connection to your DAC/m-scaler, there is the option of cutting the 5v within the USB which they feel is beneficial. First time I’ve heard that, but seems logical keeping signal away from power.

 

[Roasty]

I have owned both the DAC3 and TT2, and compared them extensively. The TT2 I felt was the superior sounding of the two, but it wasn’t a huge difference. Many here blow up small differences to be ‘day and night’, but if you think about it (and assuming the designers of each were solely concerned with accurate conversion of the original bandwidth-limited recording) if that is the case then one of the DACs sounds very different it is doing something to really corrupt the source... I felt the DAC3 had the edge with bass - it provided a really solid and resolute foundation for many types of music. Very enjoyable. It also had impressive levels of detail, but after a while I was of the opinion that it sounded like beautifully detailed paper cutout characters in a 3D soundstage, whereas with the TT2 the characters in that soundstage were also fully 3D and fleshed out. On its own the DAC3 was fine, but I found with TT2 it was far easier to ‘hear into’ the music. It opened up. The DAC3 in direct comparison sounded a bit flat and plasticky to me especially on Rock or Indie. I also felt the headphone stage on DAC3 was not as open or transparent as TT2 either. Nor was the control of the volume levels as accurate when using the remote. Impressive connectivity though (I still miss its analogue inputs!) and I do like the no-nonsense approach Benchmark take without creating a sort of ‘cult’ around the technology used, which to be honest I get tired of. They have a refreshing lack of ego or hype, and that’s reflected in their ergonomics too. It’s also half the price of TT2 as well which should be taken into account - it’s really superb value for money (or was until the remote was sold separately for £120!). Ultimately a used Chord Hugo TT for £1400 really gelled for my diverse musical tastes and sonic preferences however.

Thanks very much for chiming in!

I very much agree with your views on Benchmark, both on their products and their company philosophy. I'm actually very happy with the benchmark stack (dac3b, hpa4, ahb2) but I keep thinking about the short time I had listening to the TT2 paired with an mscaler.. and that combo was really very very very good.

So I take it that you were happy enough with the TT that you didn't deem the TT2 necessary? Or was it that you simply preferred the sound of the TT over the TT2.

Both of my current dacs combined still cost less than one TT2. But if i do change out one (or both of my dacs) for the TT2, then it is very likely the mscaler will follow closely. So I do fear for my wallet. More so, I fear it seems like the mTT2 is more of an eventuality, rather than a possibility..

 

[mightyKyn]

Nuc is the server, and many including those on Roon forums recommend a Bridge or Network streamer connected to your DAC, but NOT physically to the Server. So the Streamer can be beside or in another room, connected by Ethernet or Wi-Fi. The Stack Audio Link sounds interesting with John Westlake’s input on design. For connection to your DAC/m-scaler, there is the option of cutting the 5v within the USB which they feel is beneficial. First time I’ve heard that, but seems logical keeping signal away from power.

here is a pic of the chain....

DIY fanless Roon Nuc + as Server/Core into custom SOTM modified router, router to SOTM Ultra NEO... NEO to Mscaler.

I have LPS coming for Roon appliance... also ripped out the mic last night and turned off in bios along with others (shut off wlan, BT, fan, audio, dimmed all lights, etc).... however going to test with wifi and hook antenna up and shut off LAN. Setting up WIFI 6 router to see if that makes a diff.

Again.... the difference with this set up is SIGNIFICANT

and as the chap above mentioned all the research i did shows that server/core separate from endpoint is the way to go. it sounds AMAZING!

 

[Amberlamps]

here is a pic of the chain....

DIY fanless Roon Nuc + as Server/Core into custom SOTM modified router, router to SOTM Ultra NEO... NEO to Mscaler.

I have LPS coming for Roon appliance... also ripped out the mic last night and turned off in bios along with others (shut off wlan, BT, fan, audio, dimmed all lights, etc).... however going to test with wifi and hook antenna up and shut off LAN. Setting up WIFI 6 router to see if that makes a diff.

Again.... the difference with this set up is SIGNIFICANT

and as the chap above mentioned all the research i did shows that server/core separate from endpoint is the way to go. it sounds AMAZING!

Tip.

When you get your MHF4 aerials and antenna's, when fitting them to the nuc, the main wifi connector is the one closest to the front of the case, the other one is a backup.

Also, when you connect/if you connect them to the atom sized connectors on the mobo, use tape to hold them down permanently, as ALL replacement aerials that I have bought, ping off at the slight touch of the wire, or the slightest tension on the wire.

Tape is mandatory for this schit.

 

[gnomen]

The Stack Audio Link sounds interesting with John Westlake’s input on design.

I have been keeping an eye on the Stack Link but so far not seen enough info to be convinced. Beekhuysen has done a video but he still prefers the SoTM 200. I would love to hear from anyone in this forum with actual experience of the Link.

So I take it that you were happy enough with the TT that you didn't deem the TT2 necessary? Or was it that you simply preferred the sound of the TT over the TT2.

The Hugo TT has always been a 'sweet spot' device with a wonderfully balanced range of attributes. I kept mine for headphone listening in the study when I upgraded to a TT2, and I still love it. The TT2 is a clear upgrade however. When my wife first heard the TT2 she paid it the ultimate compliment: "it sounds more real than the concerts we go to".

 

[rkt31]

My question to rob, as you have been using 12v portable power solution for tt2 and HMS, can you please tell about how low the supply can drop below 12v before tt2 and HMS stop working ? I am asking because 12v is already 3v less than 15v .

 

[GreenBow]

I have been keeping an eye on the Stack Link but so far not seen enough info to be convinced. Beekhuysen has done a video but he still prefers the SoTM 200. I would love to hear from anyone in this forum with actual experience of the Link.


The Hugo TT has always been a 'sweet spot' device with a wonderfully balanced range of attributes. I kept mine for headphone listening in the study when I upgraded to a TT2, and I still love it. The TT2 is a clear upgrade however. When my wife first heard the TT2 she paid it the ultimate compliment: "it sounds more real than the concerts we go to".

TT2 is brilliant. Comments that say otherwise dumbfound me.

(Only possibility is folk never let brain burn-in happen.)

(EDIT: I meant TT2. I never heard TT, but imagine it's great.)

 

[mightyKyn]

Tip.

When you get your MHF4 aerials and antenna's, when fitting them to the nuc, the main wifi connector is the one closest to the front of the case, the other one is a backup.

Also, when you connect/if you connect them to the atom sized connectors on the mobo, use tape to hold them down permanently, as ALL replacement aerials that I have bought, ping off at the slight touch of the wire, or the slightest tension on the wire.

Tape is mandatory for this schit.

Great tip!

 

[465176]

Thanks very much for chiming in!

I very much agree with your views on Benchmark, both on their products and their company philosophy. I'm actually very happy with the benchmark stack (dac3b, hpa4, ahb2) but I keep thinking about the short time I had listening to the TT2 paired with an mscaler.. and that combo was really very very very good.

So I take it that you were happy enough with the TT that you didn't deem the TT2 necessary? Or was it that you simply preferred the sound of the TT over the TT2.

Both of my current dacs combined still cost less than one TT2. But if i do change out one (or both of my dacs) for the TT2, then it is very likely the mscaler will follow closely. So I do fear for my wallet. More so, I fear it seems like the mTT2 is more of an eventuality, rather than a possibility..

Unfortunately I never got to hear TT2 with an M-Scaler. Way out of my price range alas, and to be frank I prefer a DAC to be ‘self contained’ as it were, not needing any extras to sound at its best, or it starts getting into the Naim-like never-ending upgrades territory. I’ve noticed it’s ridiculously easy to ruffle feathers (and even be accused of trolling!) on Head-Fi by simply being honest, but to be honest I found I has a slight preference for TT to TT2. I owned two TT2s. The first had a little cosmetic blemish and was sent back to the retailer. To be honest I wasn’t entirely ‘blown away’ by it either, and kept looking at it and thinking, is this what a £4K DAC sounds like? After a couple months of spending more time here and reading about all the delighted TT2 users, I decided to get another thinking my first might not have been representative (or perhaps even faulty). Unfortunately I felt the same mixed feelings about it again. Whilst all the individual ‘hifi checkboxes’ were ticked (and then some), something just didn’t grab me in quite the way my original Hugo, and then Hugo 2 had. I gave the 2nd TT2 a good 6 months this time too. I sold it and then took a chance on a used TT. This hit the spot for me pretty much immediately. It might not have *quite* the detail retrieval or sound-staging as TT2, but there was/is something about the way the music just flows with it that draws me deep into the music, it just bubbles with life! It’s reminds me of a very good vinyl system in regards to that effortless flow. Perhaps it's something to do with the battery power design (something Hugo and Hugo 2 had in common). For whatever reason TT2 just didn’t ‘wow’ me as much on that gut level when you just know if something is doing it for you, or not, regardless of internet hyperbole. I must admit however after having read the past 20+ pages in this thread, I find myself second-guessing my findings yet again, and feel the temptation to try a TT2 for a third time (my speakers and room layout have changed since)!

Must. Stay. Away. From. Head-Fi!

Whatever you decide to go for, definitely try to get an audition in your own home and system first. And I hope you find what you’re looking for in terms of sonics!

 

[GreenBow]

Unfortunately I never got to hear TT2 with an M-Scaler. Way out of my price range alas, and to be frank I prefer a DAC to be ‘self contained’ as it were, not needing any extras to sound at its best, or it starts getting into the Naim-like never-ending upgrades territory. I’ve noticed it’s ridiculously easy to ruffle feathers (and even be accused of trolling!) on Head-Fi by simply being honest, but to be honest I largely prefer TT to TT2. I owned two TT2s. The first had a little cosmetic blemish and was sent back to the retailer. To be honest I wasn’t entirely ‘blown away’ by it either, and kept looking at it and thinking, is this what a £4K DAC sounds like? After a couple months of spending more time here and reading about all the delighted TT2 users, I decided to get another thinking my first might not have been representative or perhaps even faulty. Unfortunately I felt the same way about it again. Whilst all the individual ‘hifi checkboxes’ were ticked (and then some), something just didn’t grab me in quite the way my original Hugo, and then Hugo 2 had. I gave the 2nd TT2 a good 6 months this time too. I sold it and then took a chance on a used TT. This hit the spot for me pretty much immediately. It might not have *quite* the detail retrieval or sound-staging as TT2, but there was/is something about the way the music just flows with it that draws me deep into the music, it just bubbles with life! It’s reminds me of a very good vinyl system in regards to that effortless flow. Perhaps it's something to do with the battery power design (something Hugo and Hugo 2 had in common). For whatever reason TT2 just didn’t ‘wow’ me as much on that gut level when you just know if something is doing it for you, or not, regardless of internet hyperbole. I must admit after having read the past 20+ pages in this thread, I’m second-guessing my findings yet again, and felt the temptation to try a TT2 yet again! Must. Stay. Away. From. Head-Fi!

Whatever you decide to go for, definitely try to get an audition in your own home and system first. And I hope you find what you’re looking for in terms of sonics!

I would imaging that the TT2 has a lot more than quite more detail retrieval than the TT. I think the TT2 has a more advanced output stage also. Not sure, but I think so. Better all round. I can't even imagine how the TT2 sounds anything less than natural at music reproduction.

 

[465176]

I would imaging that the TT2 has a lot more than quite more detail retrieval than the TT. I think the TT2 has a more advanced output stage also. Not sure, but I think so. Better all round. I can't even imagine how the TT2 sounds anything less than natural at music reproduction.

Yes of course TT2 is technically better. However, these were my own subjective findings, with my tastes in music, with my ears... Everyone is different

 

[N Quarter]

Yes of course TT2 is technically better. However, these were my own subjective findings, with my tastes in music, with my ears... Everyone is different

I notice that you have a pair of Focal Aria’s, I used to own Sopra 1’s. Did you try running the Focal’s directly off the TT2, since they are fairly easy to drive? A few of us here are using our TT2 ‘s this way, (including Rob Watts) and are more than happy.

 

[musickid]

Quality of recording is just as important as the hardware IMHO. I really mean just as important. Makes or breaks multi K systems. This point is never stressed enough here.

 

[kelly200269]

Yes of course TT2 is technically better. However, these were my own subjective findings, with my tastes in music, with my ears... Everyone is different

One cannot ignore synergy in a system.
I have a very revealing, somewhat clinical-sounding Linn Aktiv system. My original TT1 sounded sublime, and it’s slight ‘softness’ (compared to TT2) complimented the slightly ‘hard’/unforgiving nature of my system.
Following an upgrade to TT2, I missed (and think I still do miss) the ‘roundness’ of the TT1.
Yes, the TT2 is more revealing, more exhilarating. But it’s also not as ‘easy’ to listen to as TT1 in my system.
Ergonomically, there is no comparison. The DAC mode of TT2 is a godsend for me, as I play it directly into my preamp, and setting the level on TT1 before listening always drove me mad.
However, TT1 is still very relevant today, and I can fully understand why some would prefer the sound signature of TT1 over TT2, notwithstanding how awesome TT2 is.