[Mau10]

Any advantages coax vs usb?

There's been some discussion about the use of optical and Coax in Chord DACs to bypass the amanero chip controlling the USB, claiming that it reduces the internal RF produced by the chip itself. I have been doing some tests with the TT2, using ( optical, Coax and USB) in the last couple of days to review the iFi NEO Stream. That led me to be able to detect some differences between them when coming from the same source (NEO). My findings were that Optical and Coax sound very similar, while USB subjectively feels like having a bit more bass quantity but less defined texture, and curiously a deeper stage. However.... focus and instrument separation is a tad better while using coax and optical. Using a very clean USB signal helps a lot, like the one you get from a good streamer. In the other hand, optical is very consistent and feels less system dependent; in contrast Coax suffers if the source is not clean due to RF. Testing the SRC DX connected to different USB sources can go from really poor sounding, even presenting cracks and pops while playing HQplayer 768khz when connected directly to my Mac mini, to sound the best when plugged to the super clean signal of the NEO Stream at the same sample rates. If your Doku doesn't have a good implementation of RF control and isolation, your coax will be a detrimental factor in your signal. In my opinion, making optical work properly in your system, sounds like your best bet to feed the Mscaler. At the end, the Mscaler aside of being an upsampler is a good DDC when paired with Chord DACs, USB should work well too....
Perform some tests with tracks you know well, and trust your ears, keep the one you like the most and enjoy, you have a very nice setup.

 

[smutnyjoe]

My findings about usb, coax, and streamers (= good sources) are the same as yours. I don't know which one is better in theory but after very extensive testing I think the usb from my ifi zen stream is the best (fuller bass, deeper), coax is very close (better separation but very little), and usb from my macbook is really bad.

The differences are still little and hard to hear if you don't listen actively for them.

The outcome for me is: just use the usb from the ifi zen stream and stop thinking about it.

 

[OCC7N]

Any advantages coax vs usb?

You definitly need a reaally good USB conditioner of some kind. TT2 sounds alot better on my JCAT than just the USB cable alone. Asides that it still has horrible USB driver. I recommend the Windows driver instead of the chord.

There are some noise from the TT2(USB) that compliments the high notes. It can give the impression that it sounds better, but it does "sounds" like saturation of some sort. On JCAT this noise is eliminated alot, but the reason I bought a DDC and optical cable is to eliminate it completely hopefully....and bypassing the Chord USB driver

 

[OCC7N]

Perform some tests with tracks you know well, and trust your ears, keep the one you like the most and enjoy, you have a very nice setup.

This is soo important. I have set myself to test all my equipment by recording audio of every part I can record into files that can be A/B tested here.

Everytime I get a new thing my brain tunes it be good(placebo) and after some time with it I start my criticism. Then my stubborness comes in, now I really want to hear the difference. January 2023 I will record every combination I can of all my gear.

 

[musickid]

Does the zen stream usb out need a driver into mac? Mac is is usb driverless on everything else. Also the zen stream is about the same price as the matrix ddc usb to optical which is better money spent? I'd use the zen stream on wifi if i did.

 

[OCC7N]

Does the zen stream usb out need a driver into mac? Mac is is usb driverless on everything else. Also the zen stream is about the same price as the matrix ddc usb to optical which is better money spent? I'd use the zen stream on wifi if i did.

you have the mscaler + tt2?

1. I don´t think it will be possible to connect you mac with the USB interface. You will be able to communicate through WIFI/Ethernet.
2. You can´t really compare Stream and the Matrix. Stream is more of an DLNA device to use on the LAN side of you audio.
-Yes you can connect a DAC and HDD to the stream.....

How do you connect mscaler to the Apple... USB?

I don´t know how the mscaler works besides the upscaling, if it has DDC and good galvanic isolation and good clock, I would use the USB.

So my recommendation would go on a bridge/ddc/streamer that has a good usb filtering for dac/usb....most importantly a good clock.
-Zen stream is not meant for PC/Apple connection, but on the LAN/DAC side.

 

[Mau10]

Does the zen stream usb out need a driver into mac? Mac is is usb driverless on everything else. Also the zen stream is about the same price as the matrix ddc usb to optical which is better money spent? I'd use the zen stream on wifi if i did.

What software are you using to play music?

 

[musickid]

roon tidal qoubuz imac to usb mscaler. i forgot yes the zen is a standalone device. is it plug and play usb to mscaler?

 

[Mau10]

roon tidal qoubuz imac to usb mscaler. i forgot yes the zen is a standalone device. is it plug and play usb to mscaler?

Indeed... ZEN stream is an excellent product for it's price point. You are using ROON already, so as soon as you connect the ZEN into your Ethernet or WIFI, the integration with ROON will be seamless since ZEN stream is a roon ready device . And yes, as soon as you connect the Mscaler into the ZEN stream USB, it should work with no extra drivers or special configuration. I have been using my ZEN stream and now the NEO stream with chord products and they work really good together. ROON should be able to detect the Mscaler in the chain, since Mscaler is a roon tested product too.

 

[Reactcore]

roon tidal qoubuz imac to usb mscaler. i forgot yes the zen is a standalone device. is it plug and play usb to mscaler?

If one is using a Mscaler the focus to keep noise out should be on the DBNC link.. its the DAC that needs the isolation.. imo optical is best. Then the Mscaler's input choice doesnt matter.

Opto-DX is the best commercial product i can think of ..or use my schematic and build one.
I could also make my solution boxed once my PCB design is tested and working.

 

[Mau10]

If one is using a Mscaler the focus to keep noise out should be on the DBNC link.. its the DAC that needs the isolation.. imo optical is best. Then the Mscaler's input choice doesnt matter.

Opto-DX is the best commercial product i can think of ..or use my schematic and build one.
I could also make my solution boxed once my PCB design is tested and working.

Do you have any experience using the DC BLOCK and LP Filters from audiowise? I have the SRC DX connected to my NEO STREAM to experiment with HQ player, and it sounds really nice. I just wonder how much of an upgrade those filters would represent in my system.

 

[Mau10]

By the way SRC DX really needs a clean USB source with clean power to shine. The difference is night and day. I know that it may not be the same case when using the Mscaler.

 

[Reactcore]

By the way SRC DX really needs a clean USB source with clean power to shine. The difference is night and day. I know that it may not be the same case when using the Mscaler.

All our efforts are to keep the noise out of the DAC..

SRC DX is made to bypass the DAC's own USB chip so it generates less noise inside

But in case of Mscaler the source is connected to that one. So the work must be done on its link to the DAC to better its performance.

 

[Progisus]

I believe @musickid has Wave Storm bnc cables from mscaler to TT2 so he is covered for noise there. It is from the mac to the mscaler where there could be noise.

 

[musickid]

Hello i have wave stream they are excelllent. Immediate added refinement to the music. I want to try the coax out from the douk ddc into the mscaler. Can someone confirm if this 75 ohm cable on amazon is the right one. Thanks.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/MainCore-Connectors-Phono-Cable-Available-Yellow/dp/B075MG3ZQY/ref=sr_1_2_sspa?keywords=bnc+to+rca+cable&qid=1665687353&qu=eyJxc2MiOiIyLjYzIiwicXNhIjoiMi40MCIsInFzcCI6IjIuMDYifQ==&sr=8-2-spons&th=1

As a sidenote ive ordered a 20cm optical cable to try the douk ddc again.