[Triode User]

I'll point the designer at your comments; if he has a moment he might respond. I have neither the depth of technical knowledge or the energy to get into a debate. Thanks for your post though!

See Rob Watts post here for his thoughts on NOS DACs.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/watts-up.800264/page-33#post-13921492

Quoting his post he says, “NOS DAC's - if your intent is to be as transparent as possible - are an unmitigated disaster. They introduce massive transient timing errors, and huge amounts of out of band noise - sampling images extending up to infinite frequencies. Yes I have heard NOS, and they sound soft, flat and out of focus - consistent with the huge timing errors they create.”

 

[George Hincapie]

Seriously ? This is m scaler thread and you are talking about NOS thing without even HMS listening ? Upsampling is done for more effective filtering of quantization noise. It is not for increasing resolution per se. Though there is overall improvement to resolution too because noise is filtered in a better way. HMS is not a simple upscaler it uses lot more processing than any algorithm

I don't want to take the thread off topic, I was just making a point. That is now made so we can move on.

I have listened to the TT2 and HMS together at the Windsor Show this year. Is that good enough for you?

 

[George Hincapie]

See Rob Watts post here for his thoughts on NOS DACs.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/watts-up.800264/page-33#post-13921492

Quoting his post he says, “NOS DAC's - if your intent is to be as transparent as possible - are an unmitigated disaster. They introduce massive transient timing errors, and huge amounts of out of band noise - sampling images extending up to infinite frequencies. Yes I have heard NOS, and they sound soft, flat and out of focus - consistent with the huge timing errors they create.”

Well all I can say is that's bollocks. There's nothing soft about the audio from my Adagio, which is widely considered to be excellent. Which NOS DAC has he listened to? Not one made by Cees I'd wager.

 

[MacedonianHero]

Well all I can say is that's bollocks. There's nothing soft about the audio from my Adagio, which is widely considered to be excellent. Which NOS DAC has he listened to? Not one made by Cees I'd wager.

There is nothing inaccurate with what he said. I really have enjoyed/owned/reviewed Metrum's products (along with the HoloSpring gear). But they do NOT measure well, so if you're after 100% transparency, then I'd suggest you look elsewhere. But that's not to say NOS DACs when designed right can give you a very analog/organic listening experience.

 

[rkt31]

Only one suggestion to all those proponents of nos DACs, try feeding your nos dac from HMS and then revert back.

 

[514077]

Only one suggestion to all those proponents of nos DACs, try feeding your nos dac from HMS and then revert back.

Or maybe, just let them enjoy their NOS DACs. We're audiophiles, not missionaries.

 

[George Hincapie]

There is nothing inaccurate with what he said. I really have enjoyed/owned/reviewed Metrum's products (along with the HoloSpring gear). But they do NOT measure well, so if you're after 100% transparency, then I'd suggest you look elsewhere. But that's not to say NOS DACs when designed right can give you a very analog/organic listening experience.

Forgive me, but I don't care how something measures, I care how it sounds. Listening to music trumps addiction to technical detail. For me.

 

[JaZZ]

Or maybe, just let them enjoy their NOS DACs. We're audiophiles, not missionaries.

Absolutely agree! Live and let live.

Forgive me, but I don't care how something measures, I care how it sounds. Listening to music trumps addiction to technical detail. For me.

That's a possible approach, but one that doesn't care too much about accuracy and neutrality. A perfect audio component measures perfect (that's why no perfect audio component exists). That said, not all that's audible is measurable – according to Rob Watts and my own experience (e.g. cable sound). Also, not all that's measurable is audible – but those are more rare cases.

 

[George Hincapie]

Absolutely agree! Live and let live.


That's a possible approach, but one that doesn't care too much about accuracy and neutrality. A perfect audio component measures perfect (that's why no perfect audio component exists). That said, not all that's audible is measurable – according to Rob Watts and my own experience (e.g. cable sound). Also, not all that's measurable is audible – but those are more rare cases.

I'll phrase it another way. I'm happy with what I have. My main system is just about complete.

My headphone system needs an update though and I liked the TT2 when I heard it at Windsor, so it's a possibility.

 

[rkt31]

Or maybe, just let them enjoy their NOS DACs. We're audiophiles, not missionaries.

Why you keep forgetting this is m scaler thread. At least I did not start nos or metrum talk. Since this is m scaler thread, I suggested m scaler. HMS can very well be used with other DACs. There should be no reason why nos people should be afraid of HMS, it will make their nos dac sound better.

 

[Musikfan]

Hi, I hope I can ask an amplifier related question in this thread or perhaps you can point me to a more relevant thread...I'm using a chord dave+mscaler with aesthetix stereo atlas eclipse and vandersteen 5a carbons, with the dave as a preamp...I'd like to know if you guys think a chord stereo amplifier or one of the integrated amps would be a better match for the dave+mscaler combo, and if so which one? Thanks, James

 

[Musikfan]

Just a short post on my recent findings when I demoed a few servers (with the Dave Mscaler), but let me explain I have untrained ears, only been into hifi for a few years and do not do minute details… although I have listened to many high end systems and know what I like.

In short, I want it all, nice tight bass with texture, midrange and treble must be balanced, most importantly no harsh treble, natural simmer of cymbals and no fatigue.

For headphones I prefer the LCD4, I find Focal Utopia too bright (personal preference) …but hang on a moment… I want it all. I want that speed and detail of the Focal (without my perceived brightness or fatigue) added to the LCD4 but in my speaker system…!

I have the Chord Dave – Mscaler (wave BNC interconnects) Chord Music USB cable Bryston Amps with PMC MB2se Chord Sarum T loom. Torus power supply and a few other tweaks.

Melco N1z ver 1

Had for a few years and selling shortly, a mid-range server and I would say average and a big improvement when compared to a laptop or mid-range dap into Dave via USB.

Innous Mk3

Failed to be delivered but after a call to the dealer with my conclusion below it was decided an Innuos statement is demoed instead.

Aurender N10

I found this laid back and softer, better layered detail and more space between musical instruments than the Melco N1z, in short better, but not what I was looking for.

I spent a few hours and enjoyed the SQ and moved on….

Melco N10

Wow … this thing has everything I was blown away, very clean sound, very detailed and precise, perfect bass midrange and treble, very forward and engaging. I spent a few hours and moved on.

Antipodes CX with EX

Speechless. I cannot describe how good this is and no fatigue, detail, wide sound stage, very clean dark sound, the space between the musical instruments and placement, it has it all. I was browsing my music collection and stumbled on some Piano music (which I must admit is not my preferred choice) it sounded like a Piano…this CX EX has me hypnotised, I had an emotional moment. I was spellbound for the next few hours. This is my preferred server well worth trying. IMHO a must.

I have not yet compared the CX or EX as standalone units I will do this as soon as I can.

Conclusion

Please do try this CX EX combo and the Melco N10 if you are considering a new server, if not do not try as you may end up making a purchase.

I would go to say for me Antipodes CX + EX it was a bigger upgrade than the Mscaler mind you more expensive ….!

Just a short post on my recent findings when I demoed a few servers (with the Dave Mscaler), but let me explain I have untrained ears, only been into hifi for a few years and do not do minute details… although I have listened to many high end systems and know what I like.

In short, I want it all, nice tight bass with texture, midrange and treble must be balanced, most importantly no harsh treble, natural simmer of cymbals and no fatigue.

For headphones I prefer the LCD4, I find Focal Utopia too bright (personal preference) …but hang on a moment… I want it all. I want that speed and detail of the Focal (without my perceived brightness or fatigue) added to the LCD4 but in my speaker system…!

I have the Chord Dave – Mscaler (wave BNC interconnects) Chord Music USB cable Bryston Amps with PMC MB2se Chord Sarum T loom. Torus power supply and a few other tweaks.

Melco N1z ver 1

Had for a few years and selling shortly, a mid-range server and I would say average and a big improvement when compared to a laptop or mid-range dap into Dave via USB.

Innous Mk3

Failed to be delivered but after a call to the dealer with my conclusion below it was decided an Innuos statement is demoed instead.

Aurender N10

I found this laid back and softer, better layered detail and more space between musical instruments than the Melco N1z, in short better, but not what I was looking for.

I spent a few hours and enjoyed the SQ and moved on….

Melco N10

Wow … this thing has everything I was blown away, very clean sound, very detailed and precise, perfect bass midrange and treble, very forward and engaging. I spent a few hours and moved on.

Antipodes CX with EX

Speechless. I cannot describe how good this is and no fatigue, detail, wide sound stage, very clean dark sound, the space between the musical instruments and placement, it has it all. I was browsing my music collection and stumbled on some Piano music (which I must admit is not my preferred choice) it sounded like a Piano…this CX EX has me hypnotised, I had an emotional moment. I was spellbound for the next few hours. This is my preferred server well worth trying. IMHO a must.

I have not yet compared the CX or EX as standalone units I will do this as soon as I can.

Conclusion

Please do try this CX EX combo and the Melco N10 if you are considering a new server, if not do not try as you may end up making a purchase.

I would go to say for me Antipodes CX + EX it was a bigger upgrade than the Mscaler mind you more expensive ….!

Hi, I am using a sonicorbiter i5 and sonore opticalrendu with chord dave+mscaler. Does the melco n10 take the place of the i5+OR combo? And is the melco roon ready? Thanks, James

 

[Triode User]

Hi, I hope I can ask an amplifier related question in this thread or perhaps you can point me to a more relevant thread...I'm using a chord dave+mscaler with aesthetix stereo atlas eclipse and vandersteen 5a carbons, with the dave as a preamp...I'd like to know if you guys think a chord stereo amplifier or one of the integrated amps would be a better match for the dave+mscaler combo, and if so which one? Thanks, James

Oh, wow, that is a serious amp and speakers. Unfortunately I have no experience of either so would find it difficult to comment. On the basis that you would be keeping your speakers there is only one way to find out and that is to borrow some demo amps from your chord dealer. You already have Dave and MScaler so I guess they would take you seriously if you asked for a home demo.

Out of interest, is there any aspect of your current amp that you are not happy with or are you just getting itchy feet to change? There is a quote along the lines of comparison being the thief of joy which often springs to mind.

 

[Musikfan]

Oh, wow, that is a serious amp and speakers. Unfortunately I have no experience of either so would find it difficult to comment. On the basis that you would be keeping your speakers there is only one way to find out and that is to borrow some demo amps from your chord dealer. You already have Dave and MScaler so I guess they would take you seriously if you asked for a home demo.

Out of interest, is there any aspect of your current amp that you are not happy with or are you just getting itchy feet to change? There is a quote along the lines of comparison being the thief of joy which often springs to mind.

Hi, that's a good question...I guess maybe i have an itch to change, but at the same time I'm wondering if there is any synergy i can gain by using a Chord amplifier with the dave+mscaler combo...I think what I'd like to get is a deeper soundstage...im getting a lot of clarity, imagingmand detail...but soundstage could be deeper maybe...I wonder if an chord integrated amplifier would give any improvements or the dave preamp is good enough and to spring for a chord amp....thanks for your response.

 

[JM1979]

How about HMS + Qutest compared to the HMS + TT2 combo?

I had the Qutest (after Hugo 2) then added an MAcaler and then replaced the Qutest with the TT2.

The Qutest is a great and really fun DAC. I enjoyed it a good bit more than the Hugo 2 due to depth, bass and for lack of a better term, a lot more substance to the music.

When MScaled, the Qutest improves a lot with soundstage and imaging.

However, the TT2 is on another level. Soundstaging is better, imaging is better, clarity is better, depth is better, bass is better. Is just a significant step up. The first time I listened to TTS/HMS it felt like the music was in the room with me. It was wild.