[Deftone]

Go take 3k out of the bank in £20 notes, just look at it. It’s a huge amount of notes and currency. Double it for what you already paid for stuff. Seems like we are paying too much !

To to the bank and take out 3K in five pound notes

 

[musickid]

Money comes money goes.

 

[Rob Watts]

I have experienced a strange issue with my M Scaler and TT2. (DBNC, stock BNC cables, stock PSUs)

I`m using Fostex TH-900 headphones, which are pretty sensitive (100db/mW, 25Ohm), so my TT2 was rarely driven higher than -20H. Yesterday I listened to very quiet recording, turned up a volume and when music ended I noticed a background hiss. Typical "white noise" like an old TV not tuned to a channel. I have tested my setup in different conditions and here is what i found. With my headphones connected (nothing is playing) I can hear how this background hiss grows with volume:

-20H - very-very quiet hiss (I would not notice it, if I was not aware of it)
-17H - still quiet hiss, but noticeable
-12H - not so quiet background hiss
-8H - moderate hiss, impossible to ignore

I have tried «digital silence» track from Focal Tools CD and get the same result - hiss is there, no matter if TT2 is playing or not. Same result with other headphones.

This hiss is coming from M Scaler, switched to 1M taps. If I switch TT2`s input to optical, or if I switch M Scaler to passthrough, 250k or 500k taps the hiss disappear and my phones are dead silent even at +22H volume level. After I found that switching inputs removes the hiss, I continued listening tests with lower volume levels. At -26H I can`t really say that I hear hiss, but I hear that background is blacker with M Scaler not switched to 1M taps mode. At a lower volume level I can`t tell if M Scaler is on.

I don`t know if this is normal behavior for M Scaler and I need to start thinking about that expensive cables with ferrites, or it`s something with my unit. I assume there are people here even with more sensitive headphones like Utopia. Can anybody hear a background hiss in same conditions?

@Rob Watts your comment would be highly appreciated.

P.S. BNC cables are not twisted or looped, they are not touching power cables or each other.

That sounds really odd. I haven't experienced anything like that, and can't think of a technical reason for it - unless there is something strange about the Fostex, some kind odd weird EMC issue. Since you run at -20H, try running in low gain mode - that's good to -3L (that is impossible to clip).

 

[LWR999]

I think it’s quite possible from reviewing all the Chord products myself that what you make up in soundstage on better speakers will mean the m scaler ‘might’ not be necessary. It’s main area is in soundstage. The detail and everything reverred in the m scaler eg detail, etc, is largely a product of the soundstaging imo. Concentrate on the dac. Personally I don’t think I’d buy the m scaler but I wouldn’t miss out on the Qutest or tt2 for the world. The ms is an upscaler and not a dac so it’s never going to be a replacement for a dac or as much value as a great dac. I’ve been open in saying this in my reviews. Chord won’t like me for it. But I’m honest in my reviews. The m scaler is expensive for what it does at vfm. I can think of spending that money on different hifi can getting more marked results. If you just like chord and the sound and you’ve got the cash, and a finishing off product to great hifi then why not.

I have different opinion on this. I own a TT2 and M-Scaler, with stock cables and power. I use Roon as my music source, and do 80% of my listening on Genelec 8050 nearfield monitors and their matching sub woofer. The other 20% is on Shure KSE1200 with a bit of Sennheiser HD800S thrown in.

If i were to measure the M-Scaler effect and describe in the terms we normally speak of hifi; resolution, depth, breadth, instrument separation, etc., then I think I might agree that it doesn't add £-for-£ what other kit in my chain does.

However, if I measure it by the outcome of enjoying the music, the holistical view of "was that a better listening experience" then it may be the most valuable piece of equipment I have. I listen to more whole albums with the M-Scaler. I try more new music with the M-Scalar. The part of my brain that tries to analyse the music is triggered far less with the M-Scaler.

 

[Triode User]

A very appreciative review of the Hugo MScaler has just been published by AudioBacon.

I like the bit where he says that adding an Mscaler to the Dave is "like activating God mode"!

www.audiobacon.net/2019/05/31/chord-electronics-hugo-m-scaler-review-digital-disruption/

 

[ZappaMan]

To to the bank and take out 3K in five pound notes

Make sure to give the branch adequate notice

 

[Ragnar-BY]

That sounds really odd. I haven't experienced anything like that, and can't think of a technical reason for it - unless there is something strange about the Fostex, some kind odd weird EMC issue. Since you run at -20H, try running in low gain mode - that's good to -3L (that is impossible to clip).

I have tried the low gain mode. Absolutely same behavior - background hiss when M Scaler is set to 1M taps, increasing with volume. I can hear it at -10L and higher.

My audio-technica IEMs gave the same result as Fostex headphones. IEMs are more sensitive and the hiss is noticeable at lower volumes.

 

[Amberlamps]

A very appreciative review of the Hugo MScaler has just been published by AudioBacon.

I like the bit where he says that adding an Mscaler to the Dave is "like activating God mode"!

www.audiobacon.net/2019/05/31/chord-electronics-hugo-m-scaler-review-digital-disruption/

I dunno, as god mode is either a hack or a cheat, are you saying Dave is cheating ???

I'm sure it was a misprint, and what he meant to say was TT2+HMS was God.

 

[Amberlamps]

I have tried the low gain mode. Absolutely same behavior - background hiss when M Scaler is set to 1M taps, increasing with volume. I can hear it at -10L and higher.

My audio-technica IEMs gave the same result as Fostex headphones. IEMs are more sensitive and the hiss is noticeable at lower volumes.

I have experienced a strange issue with my M Scaler and TT2. (DBNC, stock BNC cables, stock PSUs)

I`m using Fostex TH-900 headphones, which are pretty sensitive (100db/mW, 25Ohm), so my TT2 was rarely driven higher than -20H. Yesterday I listened to very quiet recording, turned up a volume and when music ended I noticed a background hiss. Typical "white noise" like an old TV not tuned to a channel. I have tested my setup in different conditions and here is what i found. With my headphones connected (nothing is playing) I can hear how this background hiss grows with volume:

-20H - very-very quiet hiss (I would not notice it, if I was not aware of it)
-17H - still quiet hiss, but noticeable
-12H - not so quiet background hiss
-8H - moderate hiss, impossible to ignore

I have tried «digital silence» track from Focal Tools CD and get the same result - hiss is there, no matter if TT2 is playing or not. Same result with other headphones.

This hiss is coming from M Scaler, switched to 1M taps. If I switch TT2`s input to optical, or if I switch M Scaler to passthrough, 250k or 500k taps the hiss disappear and my phones are dead silent even at +22H volume level. After I found that switching inputs removes the hiss, I continued listening tests with lower volume levels. At -26H I can`t really say that I hear hiss, but I hear that background is blacker with M Scaler not switched to 1M taps mode. At a lower volume level I can`t tell if M Scaler is on.

I don`t know if this is normal behavior for M Scaler and I need to start thinking about that expensive cables with ferrites, or it`s something with my unit. I assume there are people here even with more sensitive headphones like Utopia. Can anybody hear a background hiss in same conditions?

@Rob Watts your comment would be highly appreciated.

P.S. BNC cables are not twisted or looped, they are not touching power cables or each other.

No hiss hear, nothing playing and tt2 went right upto max volume on high gain, it was silent.

If I had to guess, I would say it could be the dodgy stock cables, mines kept cutting out at the slightest movement, so it could be the stock cables as lots of folk moaned about them cutting out.

 

[Ragnar-BY]

No hiss hear, nothing playing and tt2 went right upto max volume on high gain, it was silent.

If I had to guess, I would say it could be the dodgy stock cables, mines kept cutting out at the slightest movement, so it could be the stock cables as lots of folk moaned about them cutting out.

I have never had any dropouts with stock cables. Any ideas what cables I can try, to understand if this is a cable problem? Wave are too expensive for experiment.

 

[miketlse]

Yep, I'm back. Thanks.

Welcome back, I had been wondering who the new poster SalvorHardin was.

 

[bikutoru]

I have tried the low gain mode. Absolutely same behavior - background hiss when M Scaler is set to 1M taps, increasing with volume. I can hear it at -10L and higher.

Have you tried disconnecting everything, leaving just your amp and your speakers or headphones. No signal and try rotating amp volume nob to the limit. Hopefully there is no hiss there, even when the volume is maxed out, PLEASE make sure nothing can send audio signal to it! Then volume to min, turn all off, connect next piece of equipment and repeat the experiment. I hope you get the point.

There should be not hiss. I had no idea when people describe multi $K systems and live with hiss until I've bought iFI DSD and it hissed, some even tried convince me it is NORMAL!!! I sent it back and that's how I ended trying Chord(Mojo). My chain, RPI3 to M Scaler to Qutest to NAD to speakers, is dead SILENT unless I send music to it, that's how it should be!

 

[Ragnar-BY]

That sounds really odd. I haven't experienced anything like that, and can't think of a technical reason for it - unless there is something strange about the Fostex, some kind odd weird EMC issue. Since you run at -20H, try running in low gain mode - that's good to -3L (that is impossible to clip).

I`ve shoot a video to illustrate the hiss problem. Hiss is present only when M Scaler is set to 1M taps and double BNC is on. Could it be something like a ground loop due to possibly defective BNC cable?

PLEASE make sure nothing can send audio signal to it! Then volume to min, turn all off, connect next piece of equipment and repeat the experiment. I hope you get the point.

TT2 produces absolutely no noise on it`s own. It`s dead silent in any other case, except for DBNC connection.

 

[Triode User]

I`ve shoot a video to illustrate the hiss problem. Hiss is present only when M Scaler is set to 1M taps and double BNC is on. Could it be something like a ground loop due to possibly defective BNC cable?

TT2 produces absolutely no noise on it`s own. It`s dead silent in any other case, except for DBNC connection.

Is there anything in your home that could be creating any electrical or RF noise that is being picked up, possibly by the dual bnc cables such as router, dect phone of even perhaps LED lights or other power supplies? Have you tried turning off EVERYTHING else in your home apart from the Mscaler and TT2? Even including the central ventilation system etc. I am not suggesting these as a cause, I am just trying to eliminate other possible causes before pointing suspicion at the mscaler.

 

[bikutoru]

.... Could it be something like a ground loop due to possibly defective BNC cable? ...

Have you tried swapping them? Tried just leaving one or the other? If it is one of them, it should hiss even at 0.5M taps unless there is something else going on between them.