HQPlayer Impressions and Settings Rolling Thread

[sendler2112]

That could be the case with A26, but not sure if same with R26.
R26 I found the U18 which worked well with X26 to sound thin with the same i2s in comparison to standalone USB or Lan. The U18 being not very good as discovered and sought to eliminate the extra box and gain galvanic isolation with the Holo.
X26/i2s/U18 I preferred PCM 7xx with sinc-Mx and LNS15 but could not test DSD as it was broken and hissed.
R26 preferred LAN DSD512 with ext2 and AMSDM7 512+fs.

So, I did try the PCM 7xx with LNS15 and sinc-Mx back and forth with TPDF and poly-sinc-gauss-xla. All 4 interchangeably. And still prefer p-s-g-xla with TPDF. I also prefer ASDM7 512+ to AMSDM7 512+or ASDM7EC-super. Buck convention and theory and try DSDxx at 2048.

 

[sendler2112]

This isn’t how your dac works. It can’t play any higher rates other that DSD256 or PCM768. Those are its maximum limits.
The chip that processes the incoming signal downsamples it to DSD256. It can not do anymore.
Doesn’t matter what you are sending it.

Downsampling in HQplayer is one thing, but forcing your Dac to do this internally introduces a lot of negative effects.

Did you try it?

 

[Hensema]

I hear a slight difference between DSD 48x2048 and DSD 44.1x2048. 1024, 516, 256, they all sound different. DSD516 with the ASDM7EC-super 512+modulator is a big step up from DSD256 with the ASDM7EC-super.

The big step you are hearing might be the 512+ modulator. Might be interesting to try it on DSD256. In my experience the 512+ modulators sound excellent at 256 rate.

 

[sendler2112]

There isn’t any good reason to try this.
The chip attempts to filter all the extra away to the dsd256 rate its hardware maxes out at.
You are just overloading the digital filter.
This kind of internal downsampling can cause all types of bad stuff, aliasing artifacts, quantization noise, ringing, blurred transients, etc etc.

Yeah. I almost made the same mistake and held off trying anything higher than DSD256 for several weeks based on comments like these. Relegating yourself to DSD256 is unfortunately noticeably inferior to PCM768. Which is bettered still slightly by DSD2048. There is obviously some advantage to the internal processing of the filter in HQPlayer that allows the most transparency when working at this rate, before it even leaves the PC. Or maybe some benefit to the transmission in any following digital cables. Or some advantage in the interaction with the onboard clock. Even if it will inevitably undergo a simple integer truncation in the AK4499EX chip set.

What do you have to lose in trying DSD2048 from HQPlayer with the Gustard A26? 20 minutes and 5 cents of electricity?

 

[m-i-c-k-e-y]

Just an OT thought..

Thinking about upsampling to DSD2048 in feeding a DSD512 DAC.

This idea has the same principle as "Supersampling" for graphics in your computer monitor. Where images/video (esp in games) are upsampled and displayed on their current resolution. Try displaying a 1080p wallpaper in a 1080p monitor and the same wallpaper in 4K/8K. The later is better.

Experiment: Download these wallpapers in 1080p, 4K and 8K resolution. Compare images fullscreen (especially nearby bushes/trees). Later has more definition displaying on your screen.

NOT SAYING that upsampling DSD2048 to a DSD512 DAC is good (for now, to your DAC longterm). More experimentation is needed. But the idea is not new.

 

[LXMc]

I've got a question in regards to a slightly different HQPlayer use-case than most. Hoping someone here has some insight..

A while back I had asked about using HQPlayer in conjunction with Virtual Audio Cable (VAC) in order to route music from a non-Roon/Qobuz streaming platform (Deezer at the time) through HQPlayer. In that scenario I locked the VAC line-in to 16/44.1 since that's all Deezer was spitting out and all was good. Now that Tidal is getting rid of MQA and has bundled their hi-res files into their normal subscription I've been trying it out again but I had some questions regarding the possibility of my setup accommodating variable sample rates with Tidal's bit-perfect capability (something Deezer doesn't do).

As far as I can tell, VAC seems like it can handle the automatic changing of sample rates between 16/44.1 up to 24/192. When I enable cable range and channel mixing in VAC and I go to HQPlayer, it gives a spread of options that I have to select from. It seems like selecting the original 'audio:default/44100/2' works as it used to with 16/44.1 song, but as soon as Tidal switches to something higher it gives me an error (in tidal) telling me to switch it to 'high - 44.1' playback. I then tried changing HQPlayer to the maximum available input: 'audio:default/192000/2' and it appears to be allowing playback on all the songs I've tried that vary in sample rate. So technically it works - But I don't know if this is 'correct' or if HQPlayer is just being fed a 24/192 rate regardless or what Tidal is feeding VAC.

These are my VAC settings and how that comes through in HQPlayer:

When playing content, even though the song playing was 24/48 - HQPlayer appeared to just be receiving a straight 192khz rate so I'm assuming this is not working as I actually want and adjusting sample rate on the fly dependent on the song.

I realize this is probably a long-shot hoping someone has some insight as this likely not how most people use the software, but figured I'd ask. As a fallback I can always limit Tidal to 'high' 16/44.1 but it would be nice if I could utilize the wider range of sample rates available.

thanks!

 

[awesomenatorrad]

I am still exploring hqplayer but anyone have particular settings that work well with their susvara? My dac does not process DSD and I am trying to give the susvara a little body using the filters.

 

[BShaw]

I am still exploring hqplayer but anyone have particular settings that work well with their susvara? My dac does not process DSD and I am trying to give the susvara a little body using the filters.

I don’t have susvaras but I find the filters to be somewhat genre dependent, so maybe a little info of what you generally listen to? For instance I listen to a lot of jazz, small ensembles, and love p-s-g xla/LNS15, but as soon as things get too busy it’s a bit of a swamp!

 

[bogi]

It seems like selecting the original 'audio:default/44100/2' works as it used to with 16/44.1 song, but as soon as Tidal switches to something higher it gives me an error (in tidal) telling me to switch it to 'high - 44.1' playback. I then tried changing HQPlayer to the maximum available input: 'audio:default/192000/2' and it appears to be allowing playback on all the songs I've tried that vary in sample rate. So technically it works - But I don't know if this is 'correct' or if HQPlayer is just being fed a 24/192 rate regardless or what Tidal is feeding VAC.

When playing content, even though the song playing was 24/48 - HQPlayer appeared to just be receiving a straight 192khz rate so I'm assuming this is not working as I actually want and adjusting sample rate on the fly dependent on the song.

Make sure WASAPI output is set in Tidal app.

VAC allows to define a range of input sample rates, but WASAPI doesn't allow automated switching of input sample rate in HQPlayer. So you need to adapt the input rate in HQPlayer according to source content rate.

VAC contaions simple upsampling engine to adapt to VAC output rate if necessary. That's why your 48k content was seen as 192k in HQPlayer. To avoid that, as stated above, you need to set input rate in HQPlayer according to source.

If you want automated rate switching you could use RPi4 as input NAA and connect your HQPlayer computer with RPi4 using USB cable. See https://community.roonlabs.com/t/settings-t-a-dac-200-with-hqplayer-embedded/271710/36.

Or use HQPlayer Embedded UPnP/DLNA functionality to play Tidal (Embedded license is separate from Desktop license).

Or switch to Qobuz, which si supported by HQPlayer Client. That works both with Desktop and Embedded editions.

Or use Roon to play Tidal to Desktop or Embedded.

 

[LXMc]

Make sure WASAPI output is set in Tidal app.

VAC allows to define a range of input sample rates, but WASAPI doesn't allow automated switching of input sample rate in HQPlayer. So you need to adapt the input rate in HQPlayer according to source content rate.

VAC contaions simple upsampling engine to adapt to VAC output rate if necessary. That's why your 48k content was seen as 192k in HQPlayer. To avoid that, as stated above, you need to set input rate in HQPlayer according to source.

If you want automated rate switching you could use RPi4 as input NAA and connect your HQPlayer computer with RPi4 using USB cable. See https://community.roonlabs.com/t/settings-t-a-dac-200-with-hqplayer-embedded/271710/36.

Or use HQPlayer Embedded UPnP/DLNA functionality to play Tidal (Embedded license is separate from Desktop license).

Or switch to Qobuz, which si supported by HQPlayer Client. That works both with Desktop and Embedded editions.

Or use Roon to play Tidal to Desktop or Embedded.

Thanks very much for the explanation and alternative suggestions - I do have Tidal in exclusive mode (assuming this is what you are referring to by saying to make sure Wasapi output is set) so I think for now I'll just lock Tidal to 16/44.1 when using hqplayer so I can leave it at a single set sample rate and let it do all the upsampling from 16/44.1.

 

[jlaako]

dac correction GPU usage went down by 8gb.. the manual mentions it affects resource consumption I just have a hard time understanding why this is a setting and not dynamically adjusted depending on your output configuration.

It is normal that you would have more pipelines than you have output channels. Or input channels. People using HAF filters or certain cross-feed configurations for example need four for stereo. If you want to do 5.1 channel to stereo mixdown, you need six. Different matrix profiles may use different number of pipelines. There are many different variations and use cases.

 

[BShaw]

While I await my Cyan2, I thought I'd go ahead and write the HQP NAA to a clean microSD card, intalled in my Holo Red. I use a mac but I do have a Windows rig I can drag out if it's easier. Is there a tutorial somewhere that can guide me?
Thanks!

 

[kumar402]

Apparently the filter in HQPlayer works better during the conversion from PCM 24/ 48 to DSD 2048 than to DSD 256 even though the Gustard A26 display can't confess to receiving anything higher than LAN DSD512, and the dac chips then supposedly truncate anything higher to DSD256.

I would LOVE to set up a public ABX trial. I hear a slight difference between DSD 48x2048 and DSD 44.1x2048. 1024, 516, 256, they all sound different. DSD516 with the ASDM7EC-super 512+modulator is a big step up from DSD256 with the ASDM7EC-super.

Maybe next year at CanJam NYC? I appreciate that the designer is working hard and has been very generous with support on the other forums, but I assume they are making a good buck (a "finally" situation no doubt) at $300 a pop for an HQPlayer license. Maybe they will see the value in setting up a booth with Holo or somebody at the Canjams to get even more people hooked.

Canjam is not a great place to listen to hardware only forget about listening to subtle changes that upsampling brings unless you get a quiet listening room.
Anyone can get a trial version and try at home.

 

[bogi]

Is there a tutorial somewhere that can guide me?

Download naa-500-raspberrypi4-holored.7z from https://www.signalyst.eu/bins/naa/images
Unzip it and write it to SD card using https://etcher.balena.io/
Use a separate SD card, do not overwrite your original one which came with Red.

 

[BShaw]

Download naa-500-raspberrypi4-holored.7z from https://www.signalyst.eu/bins/naa/images
Unzip it and write it to SD card using https://etcher.balena.io/
Use a separate SD card, do not overwrite your original one which came with Red.

Got it, thank you Bogi.