[gerrtier]

Guys i still want to ask again, what do you think about Daart Canary I used with them, is it enough amp for? Maybe by some miracle someone knows?

 

[Haris Javed]

Guys i still want to ask again, what do you think about Daart Canary I used with them, is it enough amp for? Maybe by some miracle someone knows?

Checking into Daart Canary amp..by amp specification it seems like it should be able to drive it. 1W @ 32Ohms (specifications dont say if that is continuous or maximum dynamic burst) - but you should list your exact amp version as there seems to be multiple versions of Daart Canary. My IFI Idsd in normal mode puts out 1W @ 32 OHMS continuously and it powers the HE-560 V1 just fine however it does sound phenomenally better with more power - when I run my IFI in turbo mode which does 1.6W @ 32 OHMS continuously - it makes the sound tighter, sub bass becomes fuller, and decay becomes better, not much improves on the highs (they just get a tad brighter) but due to these changes the sound stage is also increased - more speaker like, reiterating that the HE 560 V1 need power, and lots of it to sound their best. They scale again a bit when I power them with AudioGD amp rated at 9W @ 40 OHMS, especially at low volumes.

 

[phthora]

Guys i still want to ask again, what do you think about Daart Canary I used with them, is it enough amp for? Maybe by some miracle someone knows?

The best way to know for sure requires a few steps.

First, download one of the many free volume-measuring apps for your phone. I use Decibel X, which seems to be accurate according to my own attempts at calibration. Then, start listening to music at the volume you usually do. Once that's set, raise the volume slightly then measure. That slight raise will help make up for leakage of sound and our tendency to raise the volume a bit as we listen to music longer. Measure that output with your phone, making sure to get a good seal and to measure multiple songs.

Second, run your headphone numbers here: https://www.headphonesty.com/headphone-power-calculator/ (90 db SPL/mW, 50 ohm, IIRC) That will give you an idea of exactly how much power is needed to get to exactly your loudest preferred volume. For me, that ends up being about 6 mW of power. Not much at all. I'm pretty sure my phone can do that.

Third, you'll want to account for a bit of headroom. Measuring multiple songs, I've found that some older recordings are as much as ten decibels less loud that my typical music. Also, I need to raise music about 6 decibels to get back to normal loudness after EQ. I also like to leave another 6 decibels to preserve macro-dynamics and avoid clipping. So, call that 22 db. That ends up making my worst-case power requirement about 160 mW.

Lastly, check the specs for your amp. It should be able to put out that amount of wattage into that resistance continuously. So, for me, 160 mW into 50 ohm. Mine does about 10x that, so I'm good. Most amps give that info in terms of 32 ohm, but you can generally double the resistance and halve the power to get to your number. So, 1 W into 32 ohm becomes 500 mW into 64 ohm, etc.

 

[gerrtier]

Checking into Daart Canary amp..by amp specification it seems like it should be able to drive it. 1W @ 32Ohms (specifications dont say if that is continuous or maximum dynamic burst) - but you should list your exact amp version as there seems to be multiple versions of Daart Canary. My IFI Idsd in normal mode puts out 1W @ 32 OHMS continuously and it powers the HE-560 V1 just fine however it does sound phenomenally better with more power - when I run my IFI in turbo mode which does 1.6W @ 32 OHMS continuously - it makes the sound tighter, sub bass becomes fuller, and decay becomes better, not much improves on the highs (they just get a tad brighter) but due to these changes the sound stage is also increased - more speaker like, reiterating that the HE 560 V1 need power, and lots of it to sound their best. They scale again a bit when I power them with AudioGD amp rated at 9W @ 40 OHMS, especially at low volumes.

Thanks, very helpful information. Now Im gonna looking for amp with more power than 1W @ 32Ohms. This Canary I bought for my dt 770 and akg k7xx but 560's seems like really need more amp.

 

[Brahmsian]

Ordered Focus A pads from HifiMan a month ago but they never came and was given a refund. Been waiting for the Ether Flow angled pads to come back in stock. However, my Focus pads are literally falling apart, and I want new pads ASAP. I could go for the Ether Flow flat pads OR it seems that the VOCE estat pads can be used on the Ether Flow and therefore apparently also on the HE560. Anybody use the VOCE pads on the 560?

 

[Reyer]

Few months ago I've got barely used HE560 for $270 and they're absolute beasts, airy, crisp and easily the most realistic headphones I ever heard so far.
They're awesome when it comes to instrumental part of music but vocals are a little bit withdrawn or even anemic. I find it especially annoying in Heavy metal and Hard Rock with the prime example of Dio:

Dio - Don't talk to strangers
Black Sabbath - Children of the Sea
Black Sabbath - Sign Of The Southern Cross
Black Sabbath - Heaven and Hell

I'm not complaining tho, they're way too good in the instrumental part to want me pass on them, I just want to find something else to compliment them and use in those genres.
I also have DT990 which were great (vocals were also slightly muffled) until I got HE560, now they lack in clarity and are too bloated in comparison and AKG K550 (Mk III) which had perfect vocals until pads foam went bad and pleather peeled off (couldn't find any replacement that wouldn't cost as much as new K550 and other popular options changed sound way too much to my liking) but they are out of competition when it comes to clarity and resolution.

I've been thinking about having some side grade of similar quality to HE560.
As of now I've researched HD800 and Focal Elex and I'm curious if any of you have any opinions regarding those two or have any other suggestions of your own.

Much thanks for help \o

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Few months ago I've got barely used HE560 for $270 and they're absolute beasts, airy, crisp and easily the most realistic headphones I ever heard so far.
They're awesome when it comes to instrumental part of music but vocals are a little bit withdrawn or even anemic. I find it especially annoying in Heavy metal and Hard Rock with the prime example of Dio:

Dio - Don't talk to strangers
Black Sabbath - Children of the Sea
Black Sabbath - Sign Of The Southern Cross
Black Sabbath - Heaven and Hell

I'm not complaining tho, they're way too good in the instrumental part to want me pass on them, I just want to find something else to compliment them and use in those genres.
I also have DT990 which were great (vocals were also slightly muffled) until I got HE560, now they lack in clarity and are too bloated in comparison and AKG K550 (Mk III) which had perfect vocals until pads foam went bad and pleather peeled off (couldn't find any replacement that wouldn't cost as much as new K550 and other popular options changed sound way too much to my liking) but they are out of competition when it comes to clarity and resolution.

I've been thinking about having some side grade of similar quality to HE560.
As of now I've researched HD800 and Focal Elex and I'm curious if any of you have any opinions regarding those two or have any other suggestions of your own.

Much thanks for help \o

That's a tough one - you might like the HE-500 more for that genre, with their better midrange presence. Something you might still get if you EQ more midrange into the HD-560 with software.

HE-560 amps: The HiFiMan EF-100 tube hybrid amp is a great match with the HE-560 and fills in the mids to make them richer sounding. You may have to do a little tube rolling. Their EF-6 amp has more power for them, but is more neutral and energetic and doesn't help the midrange as much as their EF-5 amp, which does help with those issues, at the expense of a smaller soundstage. The Schitt Audio Magni 3 is a pretty good match with the HE-560.

HD800 amps: The HD800 might fit the bill if you have an amp with enough voltage swing and power to add a nice foundation in the bass - we find that genre of music (and all others) is great with HD800/800s when using our Pioneer VSX-LX102 and VSX-LX303 audio video receiver's headphone out, with a nice Adioengine or CEntrance external DAC feeding it. The HiFiMan EF-6 amp is not bad with HD800, but is better when also paired with a new warmer cable (Moon-Audio Black Dragon).

But, most of our other SS and tube hybrid amps in the house with HD800 will sound a little thin in the bass and brighter in the highs (DACmini, Schitt Audio Magni 3, HiFiMan EF-100, Millett Hybrid). The CEntrance HiFi M8 v2 that I had the review sample for was actually pretty good with HD800/800s, and they should be shipping around the end of June. The M8 v2 was much better with HD-800 and HE-6 than it was with HE-560, although not bad with HE-560 (Magni 3 might be a little better synergy with HE-560).

 

[phthora]

Few months ago I've got barely used HE560 for $270 and they're absolute beasts, airy, crisp and easily the most realistic headphones I ever heard so far.
They're awesome when it comes to instrumental part of music but vocals are a little bit withdrawn or even anemic. I find it especially annoying in Heavy metal and Hard Rock with the prime example of Dio:

Dio - Don't talk to strangers
Black Sabbath - Children of the Sea
Black Sabbath - Sign Of The Southern Cross
Black Sabbath - Heaven and Hell

I'm not complaining tho, they're way too good in the instrumental part to want me pass on them, I just want to find something else to compliment them and use in those genres.
I also have DT990 which were great (vocals were also slightly muffled) until I got HE560, now they lack in clarity and are too bloated in comparison and AKG K550 (Mk III) which had perfect vocals until pads foam went bad and pleather peeled off (couldn't find any replacement that wouldn't cost as much as new K550 and other popular options changed sound way too much to my liking) but they are out of competition when it comes to clarity and resolution.

I've been thinking about having some side grade of similar quality to HE560.
As of now I've researched HD800 and Focal Elex and I'm curious if any of you have any opinions regarding those two or have any other suggestions of your own.

Much thanks for help \o

The Focal is a superb headphone, one of the best options under $1k. In comparison to the HE560, you will get much better impact and slam, more forward and natural mids, and a little more even and more natural treble. The 560 and Elex exemplify the qualities of sound particular to their driver type, so they absolutely complement each other. The Elex are not the absolute best for mids at the price range. For that I'd go with HD 660S, but the Elex is so much better overall it seems like the obvious choice.

I did not find the HD800 to be excellent at vocals and the overall tonality is... an acquired taste. I'm not sure what your price range is, but the best mids and vocals I've heard, without qualification, is the ZMF Auteur. For me, they are the tops for realism and timbre there and don't fall short of excellent in any area except driver speed.

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

The Focal is a superb headphone, one of the best options under $1k. In comparison to the HE560, you will get much better impact and slam, more forward and natural mids, and a little more even and more natural treble. The 560 and Elex exemplify the qualities of sound particular to their driver type, so they absolutely complement each other. The Elex are not the absolute best for mids at the price range. For that I'd go with HD 660S, but the Elex is so much better overall it seems like the obvious choice.

I did not find the HD800 to be excellent at vocals and the overall tonality is... an acquired taste. I'm not sure what your price range is, but the best mids and vocals I've heard, without qualification, is the ZMF Auteur. For me, they are the tops for realism and timbre there and don't fall short of excellent in any area except driver speed.

That's a good point, I forgot about the HD660S and I think that would be a good headphone for what the poster wants.

 

[Reyer]

HD6xx/HD600/HD650 and Elex were my best bets but I've seen numerous people recommending HD800 over them and I have no idea how close/far from the HE560 those are. If their purpose is different and can provide unique experience I can just streamline them for a later purchase, its price is still within my budget.

My current amp is JDS Atom which should do just fine with any of those headphones. I have not had a chance to listen to different amps but it's my goal for later.

 

[Steve80]

HE560 for $270 and they're absolute beasts, airy, crisp and easily the most realistic headphones I ever heard so far.
They're awesome when it comes to instrumental part of music but vocals are a little bit withdrawn or even anemic.

I appreciate the same things on these headphones. 560 unmatched and airy on instrumental music. But the middle is slightly failed.
I advise you to listen Sundara, It is amazing headphones, especially for its value. I think you will like it.

 

[phthora]

HD6xx/HD600/HD650 and Elex were my best bets but I've seen numerous people recommending HD800 over them and I have no idea how close/far from the HE560 those are. If their purpose is different and can provide unique experience I can just streamline them for a later purchase, its price is still within my budget.

My current amp is JDS Atom which should do just fine with any of those headphones. I have not had a chance to listen to different amps but it's my goal for later.

The HD800 would improve what it seems you already like about the 560: the treble, the clarity, the detail, the soundstage, and the imaging. No doubt about that. Either the 800 or the 800S are truly TOTL headphones when it comes to those areas. However, they would also offer little to no improvement on the mids/vocals. In fact, given their generally brighter tonality and tendency to accent the sibilance and glare in a recording, I find they make vocals sound artificial, thin, and shrill. Moreover, you will lose that incredible sub-bass extension that the 560 has. No open-back dynamic driver can do that. While the Elex also has that roll-off, it has increased mid-bass and fantastic slam to make up for it. With the 800, you don't get those either, just a tight clear initial bass note without a whole lot of body or power to it. Personally, I find that bass completely unsatisfying.

The other issue is your amp. The 800 is a notoriously difficult headphone to drive well. Its impedance peaks all the way up at around 650 ohms. That means even if your amp can handle the nominal impedance of 300 ohms, it may struggle to drive the headphone at 650 ohms, leading to a skewed frequency response. I haven't heard the Atom, so I couldn't tell you for sure, but you may want to ask around an HD800 thread to see if it will hold up. It may be totally fine, I don't know.

 

[Brahmsian]

Copying my post from the MISSION: REPLACE HIFIMAN EAR PADS thread.

I was able to mount the VOCE pads on the clip-on rings. The fit isn't perfect, but it's good enough. The stitching isn't perfect either, and the leather has some imperfections. I bought these brand new straight from Dan Clark Audio mind you. The Audeze lambskin pads are better quality for less money in my opinion.

Sound is a different story. These are only subjective impressions, but I think soundstage improved, bass has more texture, and the treble got tamed. It's a warmer sound overall. Things get pushed out a little. Some might interpret that as a loss of presence. But maybe it's just an artifact of going from old squashed pads to new firmer ones.

Comfort is good though not stellar. The ear cups are roomy if just a tad shallow. My ear slightly brushes the fabric. But they're an improvement over the stock HE560 pads in this (and perhaps every) respect.



I should add that while the new rounded headband isn't bad what I miss about the old square one is that it gives you more flexibility since you can really bend the metal part this way and that in a way that you can't do with this one.

 

[phthora]

Copying my post from the MISSION: REPLACE HIFIMAN EAR PADS thread.

I was able to mount the VOCE pads on the clip-on rings. The fit isn't perfect, but it's good enough. The stitching isn't perfect either, and the leather has some imperfections. I bought these brand new straight from Dan Clark Audio mind you. The Audeze lambskin pads are better quality for less money in my opinion.

Sound is a different story. These are only subjective impressions, but I think soundstage improved, bass has more texture, and the treble got tamed. It's a warmer sound overall. Things get pushed out a little. Some might interpret that as a loss of presence. But maybe it's just an artifact of going from old squashed pads to new firmer ones.

Comfort is good though not stellar. The ear cups are roomy if just a tad shallow. My ear slightly brushes the fabric. But they're an improvement over the stock HE560 pads in this (and perhaps every) respect.



I should add that while the new rounded headband isn't bad what I miss about the old square one is that it gives you more flexibility since you can really bend the metal part this way and that in a way that you can't do with this one.

Great to know! I would imagine that massive opening in the Voce pads helps quite a bit with minimizing reflections and thereby increasing clarity. I've tried the ZMF Ori sheepskin and Dekoni TH900 sheepskins on my 560 and in both cases the slightly wider opening helped in that regard. Plus, the sheepskin helped boost the sub-bass just a little.

 

[Brahmsian]

Great to know! I would imagine that massive opening in the Voce pads helps quite a bit with minimizing reflections and thereby increasing clarity. I've tried the ZMF Ori sheepskin and Dekoni TH900 sheepskins on my 560 and in both cases the slightly wider opening helped in that regard. Plus, the sheepskin helped boost the sub-bass just a little.

Clarity definitely seems improved. Tonality too. Before this pad swap, the 560 and 400i sounded like completely different headphones to me. I bought the 560 because I liked the 400i. But the 400i lacked treble and deep bass. To me, they were all midrange (despite the slightly recessed vocals). They also suffered from some sibilance. I wanted the 400i, but better. And that's what I have now with the VOCE pads.

I also just received a pair of FocusPad-A. Might do a comparison.