[Fearless1]

If you're into high efficiency speakers, you can always use one of those lower power (25 or so watts) amplifiers. I'm considering getting some Zu Audio speakers and pairing em with some FirstWatt J2 amps. Nelson Pass got my attention quite a while ago, and I might get an HE-6 to see what exactly it's capable of. However, this will be at least 5-10 years from now, plans may change. All that's concrete now is the Gungnir Multibit and HD650. The HE-500 is staying, and I have to say that it's a fantastic bang for the buck can. It really sets the bar for sound quality at its price point. 

I run a J2 with the HE6 and the pairing is fantastic, I say go for it! You won't be disappointed! The J2 is great with the 500 as well.

 

[intlsubband]

A question to those who use speaker amps... Given that power ratings of amps are usually based on 4 ohms resistance, wouldn't a 25 WPC speaker provide about 2.6 WPC to the load of the HE-500? and if so, wouldn't you get a similar result from a dedicated headphone amp with similar (or higher) output?
 
I'm enjoying mine with a Meier Classic and, while I never tried speaker taps, I can't imagine how it would benefit from even more power. Half the time I don't even go beyond low gain.

 

[StanD]

  Clould someone explain to me how and why HE-500 would need "more" power? HE-500 needs 400 mW to produce 115 dB which is quite uncomfortable sound level. I haven't noticed any heat coming out of my HE-500 drivers. So if that extra power is not used to produce sound or heat I am not really sure where all that extra energy is aimed to disappear.

 
 
My O2 produces more than enough power at 38 Ohm (600 mW) to drive HE-500 to incredibly high levels. The volume knob of my O2 is att highest at 10 o'clock (mostly with highly dinamic classical recordings). O2 has also really great control of my HE500. 
 
For those moments when I wish to "pollute" the signal chain with some "tubes euphonic" 

 I use my hybrid X-Can with 1W output power. Besides the slight "coloring" of the sound I don't experience any better sound due to that excess power. 
 
I don't know though what listing levels you are used to. 

 

Well, something has to power the imagination. 

 

[richard51]

  Clould someone explain to me how and why HE-500 would need "more" power? HE-500 needs 400 mW to produce 115 dB which is quite uncomfortable sound level. I haven't noticed any heat coming out of my HE-500 drivers. So if that extra power is not used to produce sound or heat I am not really sure where all that extra energy is aimed to disappear.

 
 
My O2 produces more than enough power at 38 Ohm (600 mW) to drive HE-500 to incredibly high levels. The volume knob of my O2 is att highest at 10 o'clock (mostly with highly dinamic classical recordings). O2 has also really great control of my HE500. 
 
For those moments when I wish to "pollute" the signal chain with some "tubes euphonic" 

 I use my hybrid X-Can with 1W output power. Besides the slight "coloring" of the sound I don't experience any better sound due to that excess power. 
 
I don't know though what listing levels you are used to. 

 

 

  A question to those who use speaker amps... Given that power ratings of amps are usually based on 4 ohms resistance, wouldn't a 25 WPC speaker provide about 2.6 WPC to the load of the HE-500? and if so, wouldn't you get a similar result from a dedicated headphone amp with similar (or higher) output?
 
I'm enjoying mine with a Meier Classic and, while I never tried speaker taps, I can't imagine how it would benefit from even more power. Half the time I don't even go beyond low gain.

I am no engineer ,, i was here 2 years ago ,newbie, and read samething, not necessary to have more power, same argument : you dont use them etc etc... I buy these arguments for 2 reason they are reasonnable, and it is more economic to try the hifiman with a "normal" headphone amplifier..." 2 years later after 4  headphone amps and tubes,after my dissatisfaction with the HE 400 versus the fostex TH7B (60 dollars) i take the plunge and buy a speakers amp, go directly behind the speakers taps and now i Know by experience the truth... I only want to communicate to some what i had read here 2 years ago but had dont want to trust because it seems to me irrational  : a speakers amp ! what !  bUt now my hifiman are better or on par with my FOSTEX AND I KNOW THAT I TRULY LISTEN THEIR POTENTIAL, GOING BACK TO AN HEADPHONE AMP IS IMPOSSIBLE, EXCEPT IF I PAY MORE THAN ONE THOUSAND PERHAPS I DONT KNOW...

it is only my 2 cents of experience ... best regards to all
 
p.s. the sorbothane mod is more important than a speaker amp by the way for a better sound

 

[bracko]

   

I am no engineer ,, i was here 2 years ago ,newbie, and read samething, not necessary to have more power, same argument : you dont use them etc etc... I buy these arguments for 2 reason they are reasonnable, and it is more economic to try the hifiman with a "normal" headphone amplifier..." 2 years later after 4  headphone amps and tubes,after my dissatisfaction with the HE 400 versus the fostex TH7B (60 dollars) i take the plunge and buy a speakers amp, go directly behind the speakers taps and now i Know by experience the truth... I only want to communicate to some what i had read here 2 years ago but had dont want to trust because it seems to me irrational  : a speakers amp ! what !  bUt now my hifiman are better or on par with my FOSTEX AND I KNOW THAT I TRULY LISTEN THEIR POTENTIAL, GOING BACK TO AN HEADPHONE AMP IS IMPOSSIBLE, EXCEPT IF I PAY MORE THAN ONE THOUSAND PERHAPS I DONT KNOW...

it is only my 2 cents of experience ... best regards to all
 
p.s. the sorbothane mod is more important than a speaker amp by the way for a better sound

 
How would you describe the differences in sound between a headphone amp and a speaker amp?

 

[skyline315]

  Clould someone explain to me how and why HE-500 would need "more" power? 

 
Generally speaking, the power obsession is overrated.  The 500s can sound fine out of something like the O2 or Vali. 
 
In my experience, they do sound better when you start feeding them more power, but only as long as overall amp implementation is good.  A bad speaker amp is going to make the 500s sound like crap, regardless of how much juice it's putting out there.  
 
As an aside, putting more power into the 500s isn't about volume.  It's about better dynamics, tighter bass, better imaging, etc.  Don't ask me for a technical explanation of why that happens...I can't give it to you.  

 

[BeatsWork]

   
Generally speaking, the power obsession is overrated.  The 500s can sound fine out of something like the O2 or Vali. 
 
In my experience, they do sound better when you start feeding them more power, but only as long as overall amp implementation is good.  A bad speaker amp is going to make the 500s sound like crap, regardless of how much juice it's putting out there.  
 
As an aside, putting more power into the 500s isn't about volume.  It's about better dynamics, tighter bass, better imaging, etc.  Don't ask me for a technical explanation of why that happens...I can't give it to you.  

 
+1:  This has been beaten to death

 
The He-500 is not "power hungry" rather it's very revealing of your source material, DAC & Amp.  Fully agree it does need an amp to sound it's best but the QUALITY of the amp is far more important.  The He-500 sound shockingly good in SE mode off my lowly FIIO X5 & E12.  Better on my primary setup at 5x the price but not 5x better

 

[richard51]

   
How would you describe the differences in sound between a headphone amp and a speaker amp?

imagine that you have a very good headphone amplifier .... Imagine that you have a very good speaker amplifier.... Imagine that this 2 amplifiers  are metaphorically speaking like 2 very handsome guy's face and smile.... If you look at the body of this 2 guys not their face , one body is slim but ordinary, the other body is like the perfect muscular body without too much muscle ...The one ordinary is my headphone amp the other the speaker amp.... The planars in general NEEDS power i dont know why but i had experiment that first row....

 
I have no doubt that you can pay for an headphone amp that will do the job.... But i am poor and i can afford speakers amp vintage ( my sansui had cost me 150 dollars my Hitachi 120 dollars) i cannot afford an headphone amp of top quality....The ember is very good trust me with my dynamic headphone  and the ember can drive the planars but it is no match to the speakers amplifier swing  ...
 
P.S. i had no idea  why (and it is not logical for  me)  planars need power... I am not an engineer too...For me it is a fact that a good speakers amp out is better....By the way in the next year i want to buy an headphone amp that will drive my he 400 at the same level and probably more (microzotl2 and it drive them at 1 watts only) Hence Planars needs power is not exactly true... Planars needs particular amplifier, most of the time not ordinary headphone amp, to got to their peak...that is more true but more words  to said it

  Sorbothane mod. is also and perhaps better upgrade to the planars than an amplifier...Trust me on that...
 
He 400 +speakers amp+sorb. mod = High end headphone listening( my basic Stax are boring and 2 dimensional, not competitive in comparison  with that... )

 
best regards....and thanks for you interest 

 

[borrego]

+1:  This has been beaten to death

The He-500 is not "power hungry" rather it's very revealing of your source material, DAC & Amp.  Fully agree it does need an amp to sound it's best but the QUALITY of the amp is far more important.  The He-500 sound shockingly good in SE mode off my lowly FIIO X5 & E12.  Better on my primary setup at 5x the price but not 5x better

I am sure the HE-500 will sound "reasonably" nice from your Fiio X5 & E12 combo. But I am more certain the cheaper and lighter Grado 325e will sound equally well or even better than the HE-500 off the X5/E12.

Like all other orthos, the quality of the HE-500 lies in the lower frequency range. My experience is the HE-500 has no sound quality advantage over my Grado 325e in the mid and treble frequency range when both driven by my audio-gd SE-31SE. However, in the bass frequency range the HE-500 just killed the Grado with the high current output SE-31SE

My point is if one does not have a high current output amp, one should be better off with cheaper/lighter headphones. My Grado sounds better than the HE-500 does when driven by my EPA-007 amp.

 

[StanD]

I am sure the HE-500 will sound "reasonably" nice from your Fiio X5 & E12 combo. But I am more certain the cheaper and lighter Grado 325e will sound equally well or even better than the HE-500 off the X5/E12.

Like all other orthos, the quality of the HE-500 lies in the lower frequency range. My experience is the HE-500 has no sound quality advantage over my Grado 325e in the mid and treble frequency range when both driven by my audio-gd SE-31SE. However, in the bass frequency range the HE-500 just killed the Grado with the high current output SE-31SE

My point is if one does not have a high current output amp, one should be better off with cheaper/lighter headphones. My Grado sounds better than the HE-500 does when driven by my EPA-007 amp.

If you can reach the required wattage, you will already have the required current. Any extra capability for current that an amp may have will not be used. If your amp cannot deliver the required power for a particular set of headphones then that's another story.
Power = Voltage² / Resistance    also     Current = Voltage / Resistance
You can substitute impedance for resistance. These are hardfast very basic rules, they are the same for low frequencies as any other.

 

[richard51]

the question is not what power wattage he 500 or hifiman in general needs to sound very good (there is engineering calculus to ask for that )... The question is what is necessary if you want to put them at the top of their potential....my advise result from first hand experience : a receiver or power amp speakers out  evidently good and cheap in price ( a bad one will not score better than an ordinary headphone amp ) and  most certainly the most important thing is :

SORBOTHANE MOD...
 
p.s. if you had money dont bother and buy a 2 k  headphone amp.... next year i will try the microzotl one watt only...Now i wait for a Sansui au 7700 at one hundred dollars...
 
Engineering calculus can say about the  theoretical minimum necessary for an amp to make some headphone sound good but to propulse the headphone to the peak of his performance require artist intelligence in the designer ear's...same difference in all field of life...

 

[borrego]

  If you can reach the required wattage, you will already have the required current. Any extra capability for current that an amp may have will not be used. If your amp cannot deliver the required power for a particular set of headphones then that's another story.
Power = Voltage² / Resistance    also     Current = Voltage / Resistance
You can substitute impedance for resistance. These are hardfast very basic rules, they are the same for low frequencies as any other.

 
Definitely not that straight forward. Audio amplifier circuit design are different from your typical mobile phone charger.
 
If your mobile phone draws 1A max at 5V, it makes no difference if you are using a 5V 1A charger or 5V 2A charger. So your claim is valid for this case.
 
For every audio amplifier design, output signal distortion rise proportionally with load (see: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/big-sound-2015-getting-some-numbers#rY4f7VpH7cCYgsTU.97). This is even before the amp starting to clip. The reasons: for Class AB amp design switching from Class A to Class B operation, or for Class D amp design with its switching power supply noise level increasing, or even for pure Class A design amp having its output transistors/tubes drawing more more current, in turns affect the amount NFB induced by the amp circuitary.
 
More headroom is always a good thing, as long as it still makes economical sense. It also depends if one prefer listening less distortion from amp, or from headphones.

 

[StanD]

   
Definitely not that straight forward. Audio amplifier circuit design are different from your typical mobile phone charger.
 
If your mobile phone draws 1A max at 5V, it makes no difference if you are using a 5V 1A charger or 5V 2A charger. So your claim is valid for this case.
 
For every audio amplifier design, output signal distortion rise proportionally with load (see: http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/big-sound-2015-getting-some-numbers#rY4f7VpH7cCYgsTU.97). This is even before the amp starting to clip. The reasons: for Class AB amp design switching from Class A to Class B operation, or for Class D amp design with its switching power supply noise level increasing, or even for pure Class A design amp having its output transistors/tubes drawing more more current, in turns affect the amount NFB induced by the amp circuitary.
 
More headroom is always a good thing, as long as it still makes economical sense. It also depends if one prefer listening less distortion from amp, or from headphones.

Don't buy a crappy amp. There is a huge supply of different amps that can produce 1 Watt RMS of clean power. Power above the maximum headroom is never used, it is an easy chore to find so many excellent amps that can drive the HE-500's with superb results.

 

[Haris Javed]

You all need to drop the HE-500 Train and Jump on the HE-4 / HE -6 Train. If HE-560 is like the HE-500 I must say that HE-4 will sound better (in my humble opinion) - The Bass is less compared to 560, but not by a lot..Mids are much better, Vocals are much better. The sound stage and the resolution is on another planet compared to HE-560, and LCD-X. You just need the right Amp / Dac Combo. I own HE-560, HE-4, and LCD-X.
 
- Cheers

 

[elwappo99]

You all need to drop the HE-500 Train and Jump on the HE-4 / HE -6 Train. If HE-560 is like the HE-500 I must say that HE-4 will sound better (in my humble opinion) - The Bass is less compared to 560, but not by a lot..Mids are much better, Vocals are much better. The sound stage and the resolution is on another planet compared to HE-560, and LCD-X. You just need the right Amp / Dac Combo. I own HE-560, HE-4, and LCD-X.

- Cheers

Lcdx... resolving
If you want in your face sound stage and resolution get some hd800. The he500 are very resolving with the right dac and music.