[kin0kin]

if you escalate it to paypal, u lost the case, and the scammer gets the 500 bucks back. I've had first hand experience in situation like this and my paypal is still screwed as of now, but i did not lose any $$ as i have had the $$ transferred out right after the payment was made. Paypal gave the $$ back to the scammer.

Paypal can take the $$ from your account if they want (they can do whatever they want basically...if you read their terms and condition), they have done it, check paypalsucks.com.

Paypal's seller protection is bullocks. They need you to:
1) ship to confirmed address in the US, UK, and CA ONLY.
2) Shipped the item(s) with delivery confirmation - UPS/Fedex/DHL kind of tracking system, not USPS. They just dont accept USPS for some reasons.

I hope you took the $$ out of paypal, if u did not, there's a VERY HIGH chance that you will not get the 500 bucks back. What you can try to do is present your case in the paypal dispute, and call up USPS, speak to the security department and tell them your situation, say that someone is attempting to fraud you. Then try to make a claim for the insurance.

Then just sit and wait for paypal's decision. If they grant the $$ to the scammer, shoot a BBB complaint immediately, they will have 10 business days to reply your complaint as soon as the complaint has been served to them by BBB. DO NOT bother using the "contact us" on paypal for the dispute, the system is fabricated to:

1) show a "contact us" option regarding dispute
2) after you send the email, an automatic notification will be sent to you and ask u to do the impossible.
3) the "contact us" option regarding dispute will no longer be there when you try to use it the second time
4) Sending them emails using other options will get you similar emails as #2

This is why you should just go to BBB. However, there is still no $$ back guarantee but you get to communicate to people who can make decisions, and not the front line monkeys. There is also another thing that you can do from the post office which will force them to reopen your case (once the dispute has been closed and no appeal was made) and give you your $$ back but I cannot remember how to do that..sorry. Good luck.

EDIT:
Assuming that you have taken all the $$ out, and now your paypal account shows -$500. What will happen next if you fail to win the dispute is that paypal will send tons of mail asking you to add funds and bring the $$ back to 0. They will do this for a long period of time. Then, they will say that they are going to send your case to a collection agency, which will harrass you, but you can use a letter to shut them up legally (search posts under my name and you will find one I recently posted). They will also tell you that they will close your paypal account....OH BIG DEAL!!!!

However, they will not be able to collect the $$. As far as screwing up your credit ratings, some say they can do that, some said they cannot because they are not a financial institute....I'm not exactly certain how it goes in this regard.

When you start receiving mails about them asking you to top up funds into your account, you should close your bank account and move the funds away. You should also close your CC but some have had success with jsut reporting the card being lost and get a new number. However, when I called my CC compnay last time, they told me that even if you close the account, they can still ask you to pay for the $$ if there's something legal going on. This is because when you accepted their user agreement, you've given them the rights to remove the $$ from your account if situation like this happens. I have personally changed my bank, and changed my card #.

 

[amphead]

You could pull all money from your bank account, and then open a new account. New account number = no association. You can also have a new number put on your credit card to stop that association. Both of these are drastic measures, that might get you barred from paypal though. Good Luck.

 

[Blitzula]

I can't imagine that they can take money out of your bank account...that seems silly to me.

I'll be interested in seeing the resolution. You have proof of delivery, his action should be with the shipper only. I'd sue Paypal if they side with him and take the money out of your Paypal account.

 

[Zorander]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kin0kin /img/forum/go_quote.gif if you escalate it to paypal, u lost the case, and the scammer gets the 500 bucks back. I've had first hand experience in situation like this and my paypal is still screwed as of now, but i did not lose any $$ as i have had the $$ transferred out right after the payment was made. Paypal gave the $$ back to the scammer. Paypal can take the $$ from your account if they want (they can do whatever they want basically...if you read their terms and condition), they have done it, check paypalsucks.com. Paypal's seller protection is bullocks. They need you to: 1) ship to confirmed address in the US, UK, and CA ONLY. 2) Shipped the item(s) with delivery confirmation - UPS/Fedex/DHL kind of tracking system, not USPS. They just dont accept USPS for some reasons. I hope you took the $$ out of paypal, if u did not, there's a VERY HIGH chance that you will not get the 500 bucks back. What you can try to do is present your case in the paypal dispute, and call up USPS, speak to the security department and tell them your situation, say that someone is attempting to fraud you. Then try to make a claim for the insurance. Then just sit and wait for paypal's decision. If they grant the $$ to the scammer, shoot a BBB complaint immediately, they will have 10 business days to reply your complaint as soon as the complaint has been served to them by BBB. DO NOT bother using the "contact us" on paypal for the dispute, the system is fabricated to: 1) show a "contact us" option regarding dispute 2) after you send the email, an automatic notification will be sent to you and ask u to do the impossible. 3) the "contact us" option regarding dispute will no longer be there when you try to use it the second time 4) Sending them emails using other options will get you similar emails as #2 This is why you should just go to BBB. However, there is still no $$ back guarantee but you get to communicate to people who can make decisions, and not the front line monkeys. There is also another thing that you can do from the post office which will force them to reopen your case (once the dispute has been closed and no appeal was made) and give you your $$ back but I cannot remember how to do that..sorry. Good luck. EDIT: Assuming that you have taken all the $$ out, and now your paypal account shows -$500. What will happen next if you fail to win the dispute is that paypal will send tons of mail asking you to add funds and bring the $$ back to 0. They will do this for a long period of time. Then, they will say that they are going to send your case to a collection agency, which will harrass you, but you can use a letter to shut them up legally (search posts under my name and you will find one I recently posted). They will also tell you that they will close your paypal account....OH BIG DEAL!!!! However, they will not be able to collect the $$. As far as screwing up your credit ratings, some say they can do that, some said they cannot because they are not a financial institute....I'm not exactly certain how it goes in this regard. When you start receiving mails about them asking you to top up funds into your account, you should close your bank account and move the funds away. You should also close your CC but some have had success with jsut reporting the card being lost and get a new number. However, when I called my CC compnay last time, they told me that even if you close the account, they can still ask you to pay for the $$ if there's something legal going on. This is because when you accepted their user agreement, you've given them the rights to remove the $$ from your account if situation like this happens. I have personally changed my bank, and changed my card #.

Gosh. That's a nightmare.

 

[infinitesymphony]

Good luck. At least it's $500 and not $5,000... I've just entered into a similar dispute for the first time, but luckily (or not) I'm on the buyer's end.

kin0kin, where does it say that they won't accept USPS?

 

[bhd812]

I got screwed twice, well they attempted the first but my bank called asking if I was who was on paypal..

I changed banks twice and credit cards twice..nothing happened to me or my credit score so..

 

[terrymx]

Thank you for your advices.Yes I have the -$500 in my paypal right now. I could transfer the money in my current bank account, but I still have a balance on the cc haven't fully paid, so I can't do much about that. I never heard of BBB, but I will look it up.

 

[ecclesand]

I'm confused....can Paypal pull the money from your attached bank account and/or credit card if you have no money in your Paypal account? I guess I could go wade thru the endless legalese dribble on their website...was hoping that someone had a definitive answer...

 

[kin0kin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by infinitesymphony /img/forum/go_quote.gif Good luck. At least it's $500 and not $5,000... I've just entered into a similar dispute for the first time, but luckily (or not) I'm on the buyer's end. kin0kin, where does it say that they won't accept USPS?

I believe it is stated somewhere within the dispute faq, I've also read some guy saying the same thing on paypalsucks.com. IIRC, if you intend to use USPS priority, you need to get the signature feature to make them accept USPS.

Paypal's system has been carefully designed to lock all your funds when a dispute is raised. You can add money, but you can't take them out. They even removed the option to refund $$ to buyers (a method to get $$ back when they locked your account) but if you complaint to BBB, they will allow you to refund the buyers.

@ecclesand
yes they can, but at what step/when during a dispute, I don't know. Paypal can do whatever they want in the states, but in UK and CA, IIRC they do not have as much power just yet.

There had been a few class action law suit against paypal for randomly locking accounts, they just paid for the settlement and didn't go through the whole law suit. People in that law suit only got back a small fraction of their $$, that also means paypal ate up so much $$ from doing this.

Anyway, I suggest everybody look at paypalsucks.com, just to be aware of what they have done to many innocent people.

 

[n_maher]

If your dispute goes much further I would contact the local police department (local to the buyer) and ask them what the procedure is for filing a mail fraud complaint. As far as I know it is a federal offense and not treated lightly.

 

[GSurge]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ecclesand /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm confused....can Paypal pull the money from your attached bank account and/or credit card if you have no money in your Paypal account? I guess I could go wade thru the endless legalese dribble on their website...was hoping that someone had a definitive answer...

Yes.

 

[Febs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by terrymx /img/forum/go_quote.gif sold some guy a video card for ~$500 on ebay, the tracking number said delivered, at his house, and he gave me a positive feedback. he had perfect feedback.

What did the feedback say? If it said anything at all about the product that you sent him, that would be compelling evidence that he received it.

 

[Blitzula]

I still say they can't pull money from your bank account. Banks would have huge issues if anyone could go in like that and withdraw funds without authorization.

That's just my opinion, but I think it's common sense. I'd be willing to bet they can't legally do it.

 

[AuroraProject]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blitzula /img/forum/go_quote.gif I still say they can't pull money from your bank account. Banks would have huge issues if anyone could go in like that and withdraw funds without authorization. That's just my opinion, but I think it's common sense. I'd be willing to bet they can't legally do it.

They can, you give them authorization when you agree to the Paypal TOS.

 

[Blitzula]

Removed