[Hifiearspeakers]

You still need that extra oomph in your amp to get the best out of that Susvara. Yeah, they sound marvelous though.

Yeah, they’re a beast to drive. Have you decided what you want between the Susvara or HEDDphone yet? Or are you holding out for the Abyss TC?

 

[paulybatz]

Have you heard the 4Z? Because I can’t think of anything the 4Z does better than the HEDDphone other than bass. And Audeze earpads are just plain garbage. They’re glued/adhered on, so they’re difficult to change.

And if you change the earpads on the 4 or 4Z by yourself, you VOID your warranty! You have to send them in to Audeze and let them change them. That’s one of the reasons I sold my 4Z and why it will take a lot of change from them for me to ever buy another Audeze again. And they cost twice as much as the HEDDphone to give you so little in return.

Honestly, for $4000, you could find a brand new Susvara with a little digging...and those will actually sound better than the HEDDphone.

What ear pads???

I’m not a fan of hifiman

 

[Hifiearspeakers]

What ear pads???

I’m not a fan of hifiman

The regular stock earpads that Audeze uses. If you change them yourself for newer Audeze pads or to try aftermarket pads by Dekoni, for example, you void your warranty. I went on quite the rant through this with Audeze, because they never even told anyone about that policy and it wasn’t even posted anywhere on their website. It was a weird, unwritten rule for the 4 and 4Z.

So I had to ship my headphones to Audeze to switch pads, because that’s their rule, and they still made me pay for shipping! And then I had to wait for 10 days to get my headphones back.

Never. Again.

 

[heliosphann]

The HEDD, although analytical, remains pleasant to listen to. I would agree that they are quite complimentary.

Definitely. My first session I listened to them for several hours and didn't become fatigued or overwhelmed at any time.

 

[paulybatz]

Definitely. My first session I listened to them for several hours and didn't become fatigued or overwhelmed at any time.

That’s the key. Not fatiguing with respect to weight or sound. Amazing.

 

[paulybatz]

The regular stock earpads that Audeze uses. If you change them yourself for newer Audeze pads or to try aftermarket pads by Dekoni, for example, you void your warranty. I went on quite the rant through this with Audeze, because they never even told anyone about that policy and it wasn’t even posted anywhere on their website. It was a weird, unwritten rule for the 4 and 4Z.

So I had to ship my headphones to Audeze to switch pads, because that’s their rule, and they still made me pay for shipping! And then I had to wait for 10 days to get my headphones back.

Never. Again.

Well I think because they are glued.
That makes sense to me.
It’s like: you break it, you buy it.

 

[PeteSTRADAMUS]

Yeah, they’re a beast to drive. Have you decided what you want between the Susvara or HEDDphone yet? Or are you holding out for the Abyss TC?

First I have to start working again. Financial crisis has struck. Haven’t even thought about what I want until I’m stable again. For the price I can get the Hedd for it’s a no-brainer to buy that first.

 

[paulybatz]

First I have to start working again. Financial crisis has struck. Haven’t even thought about what I want until I’m stable again. For the price I can get the Hedd for it’s a no-brainer to buy that first.

Prayers for that...I agree. It’s amazing at its price point.

 

[paradoxper]

Definitely. My first session I listened to them for several hours and didn't become fatigued or overwhelmed at any time.

As most don't have fit issues, they are a really fantastic headphone.

With most of my listening through my electrostat loud speaker, and how the HEDD gave me a terrifying hotspot, I had to give them up.

 

[Aethelred]

Well, I've joined the HEDD team and for me this is truly best I've heard. It has a lot to do with our preferences and the way we perceive the best sound. Technically this might not be the best - there is a bit extra hump in midrange but for me this makes music more appealing ( I still like ATH-W5000 a lot despite not neutral sounding). Only one longish session so far - Melua, Cohen, Monteverdi, Vivaldi. The presence of the voice is incredible and really scary when you can tell how strong the air hit the microphone when Melua was too close to the mike and at the same time this does not distract you from the music - treble is first class. Also the string plucking very very close to real experience when you hear it live. This is very unusual.
Some stated too much bass on the stock cable - i do not feel it that way and I'm far from bass head.
Now bad things. They are heavy but not uncomfortable. Headband on the border of being too short ( not sure if i got extended on or not ) . If i will let my ears to touch pads a bit, the headband is fine. If i pull down so my ears are not touching pads at all - then it might be too short. Still not sure. No discomfort or anything like it. Connectors when i seat in my normal 'headphone chair" are OK but if i seat straight they touch my shoulders slightly. Which replacement cable will fit BTW? 4 minXLR? anybody selling them?
I've tried them only with one amp due to lack of time - WA2 and i really do not feel like they are underpowered of anything like it. Dynamics is there ( mind I do not listed too loud ) and i think pairing , especially transparency is quite stunning. WA2 maxed with A1834 + Valvo E188CC D getter + EZ80 RFT . Source Micromega Stage 5 , cabling Synergistic Research Core Active, power WA2 - Purist Audio Dulcedo.

 

[paulybatz]

Yes. Challenging to drive.
Going to try the jot balanced as soon as I get the cable. Also. I think the stock cable is pretty darn good IMO

 

[tonereef]

As most don't have fit issues, they are a really fantastic headphone.

With most of my listening through my electrostat loud speaker, and how the HEDD gave me a terrifying hotspot, I had to give them up.

You've given up the HEDDphones? It was only a few weeks ago you were saying they were the only phones you needed, that they bested the Stax 009/T2 combo you used to have.

I'm curious about the hotspot - you mean your scalp heats up under the band? I haven't had that problem but they sure do heat up my ears, and after only half an hour (to be fair, other hard-clamping phones are just as bad).

But ergonomics aren't the only problem. I have the 009s and a couple of really good DIY tube amps (not saying they are as good as the T2, which I've never heard, but certainly in the same league as the Blue Hawaii etc.) and in a direct comparison the HEDDs don't come off well, listening through my 3 watt DIY hybrid amp in balanced mode and using very low capacitance custom cotton hp cables. The 009s run circles around the HEDD in detail retrieval, transient response, subtle timbral discrimination, and soundstage depth and transparency, and are at least their equal in dynamics (though maybe not slam). The 009s too have a bump in the 1-3K range but the effect is different - the Stax sound "sunny" (not bright exactly but not quite natural either); the HEDD sound bright and hard, pushing the sound out - the opposite of relaxed.

But ok, the HEDD cost only a small fraction of the 009s + a really good amp. However, I've been listening again to my LCD-3Fs, which I've had for several years but hadn't put in a lot of time on because I preferred the 009s and even my Lambda Signatures. Anyway, I've been really surprised at how good they sound. They used to sound dark - better than the LCD-2s but still with not enough energy in the highs to make cymbals ring convincingly, for example. But no more. I can't explain this change of perception. In any case, compared to the HEDDs, and on acoustic or mostly acoustic music (jazz, classical) they just sound more like the real thing.

If you really want to test the abilities of a transducer you have to feed it complex material about which you have a pretty good idea how it should sound. For me that's orchestral music. Starting with the string section: the Audeze have more texture (definition) and especially better mid-to-low bass (double basses sound nice and plump but still articulate). Woodwinds are sweeter, the brass have more body, and low percussion (bass drum and tympani) that sounds a bit shallow on the HEDD seems all there timbrally and dynamically, even though the 3Fs are rolled off in the sub-bass. Another thing: the 3Fs retrieve quite a lot more low-level ambient detail - the resonating space the music is bringing to life is more palpable; the HEDDs sound drier, closed-in. The 3Fs are surely somewhat euphonically warm, but even so they make it easy to forget their sound and just listen to the music, whereas for me the more constrained, less timbrally realistic sound of the HEDDs has become hard to ignore.

Another difference is soundstaging: the 3Fs have more depth and I think width as well. There's something paradoxical about the HEDDs' soundstaging: although they often sound upfront with less complex music, orchestral music sounds somehow pushed back and miniaturized - out of reach. Certainly they don't layer as well, but it also comes back to a relative lack of detail - first violins sound like a unified section rather than 25 or so violins playing (almost) together. With the Audeze I feel more engaged in the space in which the music is happening, it feels like I'm physically closer to the music-making. The HEDDs/ presentation is more compact and forceful. That might be a plus for genres I don't listen to.

Obviously this is a minority report - it's almost as though I'm listening to a different headphone than most other people here. When I first heard a demo of the HEDDs I was impressed and decided to buy a pair, but after a while, listening to them at home and comparing them with my other phones, disillusion set in. I have heard and liked AMT speakers, and I'm still interested in hearing what HEDD can do with a concerted TOTL phone. But maybe the fact that the HEDDs went through 25 iterations before being finalized is an indicator of difficult technical issues in designing AMT drivers for full range.

 

[paulybatz]

You've given up the HEDDphones? It was only a few weeks ago you were saying they were the only phones you needed, that they bested the Stax 009/T2 combo you used to have.

I'm curious about the hotspot - you mean your scalp heats up under the band? I haven't had that problem but they sure do heat up my ears, and after only half an hour. One night I had to ice my ears for 10 or 15 minutes to cool them down enough to fall asleep!

But ergonomics aren't the only problem. I have the 009s and a couple of really good DIY tube amps (not saying they are as good as the T2, which I've never heard, but certainly in the same league as the Blue Hawaii etc.) and in a direct comparison the HEDDs don't come off well, listening through my DIY hybrid amp in balanced mode and using very low capacitance custom cotton hp cables. The 009s run circles around the HEDD in detail retrieval, transient response, subtle timbral discrimination, and soundstage depth and transparency, and are at least their equal in dynamics (though maybe not slam). The 009s too have a bump in the 1-3K range but the effect is different - the Stax sound "sunny" (not bright exactly but not quite natural either); the HEDD sound bright and hard, pushing the sound out - the opposite of relaxed.

But ok, the HEDD cost only a small fraction of the 009s + a really good amp. However, I've been listening again to my LCD-3Fs, which I've had for several years but hadn't put in a lot of time on because I preferred the 009s and even my Lambda Signatures. Anyway, I've been really surprised at how good they sound. They used to sound dark - better than the LCD-2s but still with not enough energy in the highs to make cymbals ring convincingly, for example. But no more. I can't explain this change of perception. In any case, compared to the HEDDs, and on acoustic or mostly acoustic music (jazz, classical) they just sound more like the real thing.

If you really want to test the abilities of a transducer you have to feed it complex material about which you have a pretty good idea how it should sound. For me that's orchestral music. Starting with the string section: the Audeze have more texture (definition) and especially better mid-to-low bass (double basses sound nice and plump but still articulate). Woodwinds are sweeter, the brass have more body, and low percussion (bass drum and tympani) that sounds a bit shallow on the HEDD seems all there timbrally and dynamically, even though the 3Fs are rolled off in the sub-bass. Another thing: the 3Fs retrieve quite a lot more low-level ambient detail - the resonating space the music is bringing to life is more palpable; the HEDDs sound drier, closed-in. The 3Fs are surely somewhat euphonically warm, but even so they make it easy to forget their sound and just listen to the music, whereas for me the more constrained, less timbrally realistic sound of the HEDDs has become hard to ignore.

Another difference is soundstaging: the 3Fs have more depth and I think width as well. There's something paradoxical about the HEDDs' soundstaging: although they often sound upfront with less complex music, orchestral music sounds somehow pushed back and miniaturized - out of reach. Certainly they don't layer as well, but it also comes back to a relative lack of detail - first violins sound like a unified section rather than 25 or so violins playing (almost) together. With the Audeze I feel more engaged in the space in which the music is happening, it feels like I'm physically closer to the music-making. The HEDDs/ presentation is more compact and forceful. That might be a plus for genres I don't listen to.

Obviously this is a minority report - it's almost as though I'm listening to a different headphone than most other people here. When I first heard a demo of the HEDDs I was impressed and decided to buy a pair, but after a while, listening to them at home and comparing them with my other phones, disillusion set in. I have heard and liked AMT speakers, and I'm still interested in hearing what HEDD can do with a concerted TOTL phone. But maybe the fact that the HEDDs went through 25 iterations before being finalized is an indicator of difficult technical issues in designing AMT drivers for full range.

With all of that said they are like everything. Source and amp dependent..........
With MASTER bit quality and the jot, they are simply perfect..but slightly underpowered with that amp...going to try them balanced and then we will see...my WA7 powers them well but with less detail than the jot.

 

[paradoxper]

You've given up the HEDDphones? It was only a few weeks ago you were saying they were the only phones you needed, that they bested the Stax 009/T2 combo you used to have.

I'm curious about the hotspot - you mean your scalp heats up under the band? I haven't had that problem but they sure do heat up my ears, and after only half an hour. One night I had to ice my ears for 10 or 15 minutes to cool them down enough to fall asleep!

From the onset I have complained about having an issue with the headband comfort (exacerbated by the weight, it's a heavy pain complaint on the top of my head.) As such, I tried to push-through in hopes of break-in having some mitigating effect.
Alas, that wasn't the case. And as I primarily listen to speakers, when I do switch to headphones, I've concluded I'm not willing to make concessions in terms of comfort.

 

[tonereef]

With all of that said they are like everything. Source and amp dependent..........
With MASTER bit quality and the jot, they are simply perfect..but slightly underpowered with that amp...going to try them balanced and then we will see...my WA7 powers them well but with less detail than the jot.

For sure - but the source has mostly been a Marantz SA-KI Ruby (so no problem there) and the amp is a unique design combining an input stage using current sources with a pair of 6N30Ps (or 6DJ8s etc.) going to a unity-gain high-quality FET output stage to bring the impedance down to 42 ohms = 3 watts. I would say the amp is pretty neutral and dynamic, adding or taking away not much from the source, and (I would think) capable of driving the HEDDs. I have also played the HEDDs through an older and much less powerful ss amp that is more coloured and lacking in the bass, but still had plenty of gain to play loud. The distinctive HEDD sound that I tried to describe pretty much carried over from one amp to the other. Still, I would be interested in hearing the HEDDs through other amps that are known quantities.