Hearing Safety and Ear Health Thread (a diary of a ear health noob)

[ryhawk52]

Newer here. I don't listen above 85—for sure. And yet, sometimes, with maybe certain headphones (Ananda?), afterwards, for a couple days, my left ear kinda just feels weird. And rings if I push it closed

Question is: Is it actually more above decibels? OR can certain frequency response graphs, or just tuning of headphones, react weird to certain ears? Again, the Ananda's maybe did that to me. But I was also listening to more music than normal (again not loud).

Thanks for any help! I love the Anandas, but would rather keep ear health IF certain headphones can do something like this...

 

[Afiroxlty]

"Safe Listening!"


Photograph by: Kevin Van Aelst


This is going to start as a diary, rather than a thread. I want to accumulate the links and information around the "Hearing Safety and Ear Health" topic.

Please feel free to add yours.


Apart from audio hobby, I am a diver and motor-biker. Those things/hobbies bears dangers. Every time when a diver or motor-biker goes to diving/riding friends tells him/her: "Safe Diving!" and/or "Safe Riding"

Why don't we remind each other every time in threads (even in our signatures) using the sentence: "Safe Listening!"

In my opinion we should use this warning sentence more and more... Our hearing safety is more important than say a: 10.000 USD DAC/AMP or player. Even the highest priced equipment is meaningless when we loose ear/hearing health...



Above Photo Source: http://smattes.com/article/59/loudness


"One in five teenagers in America can’t hear rustles or whispers, according to a study published in August in The Journal of the American Medical Association. These teenagers exhibit what’s known as slight hearing loss, which means they often can’t make out consonants like T’s or K’s, or the plinking of raindrops. The word “talk” can sound like “aw.” The number of teenagers with hearing loss — from slight to severe — has jumped 33 percent since 1994" (Virginia Heffernan, The New York Times Magazine, January 7, 2011).





Source for above table: http://www.dangerousdecibels.org/education/information-center/decibel-exposure-time-guidelines/


How to Prevent Hearing Loss
Source article: http://www.healthguidance.org/entry/12812/1/How-to-Prevent-Hearing-Loss.html

• Exposure to very loud sounds is the major cause for hearing loss. Increased exposure to sounds that are above 85 decibels increases the risk of hearing loss.
• If you work as a fire engine driver or an ambulance driver, take appropriate measures to reduce the intensity of hearing the siren sound as these sirens give a sound in the range of 105 to 140 decibels.
• Increase in the technology resulted in the development of ipod’s and MP3 players that are also increasing the risk of developing hearing loss. Hence, reduce their usage. Use them in very low volume. Music should be soothing to the ear, but not harmful.
• Individuals who remain on phone conversations for longer period are also at increased risk. Hence, use either speaker phones or if the talk it is a very long one, try to do it personally, if possible.
• In fact, even the sound in low decibel range is also harmful if heard for a very period of time. It is even more dangerous than loud sound heard intermittently. It is recommended to use ear plugs to reduce the intensity of the sound you hear.
• In some cases, single exposure to very large sounds such as gun firing can result in permanent damage to the ears resulting in hearing loss. Hence, stay away from such sounds. If unavoidable, consider using ear plugs to protect the ears from those high intensity sounds.
• Research studies show that intake of antioxidant vitamins such as vitamin A, C, E and minerals such as magnesium help to prevent hearing loss. This is especially useful in people who cannot use ear muffs to avoid hearing large sounds. It is a must for soldiers residing in the battle ground for great many days. These vitamins can be taken as supplements or as a part of a nutribar.
• Women who are expecting to become pregnant should take MMR vaccine, to prevent birth of babies with hearing loss. It is found that diseases such as measles increase the risk of developing hearing loss.
One last factor that is essential to remember is that while using any sort of machinery such as lawn mower, you should be able to hear outside noises. If you are not able to hear outside noises, then you are hearing a very big noise and you should consider using ear muffs. Another factor to judge that you are being exposed to a very large voice is if you are unable to hear the voice of a person who is just three feet away. In all these cases, it is recommended to use earmuffs that are of high quality. However, in some cases such as genetic defects, hearing loss is unavoidable.





An article about hearing loss and its relation to HP use:

Against Headphones

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/09/magazine/09FOB-medium-t.html?_r=0
An article on the hearing and hearing loss:

HEARING LOSS

http://www.dizziness-and-balance.com/disorders/hearing/hearing.html



A basic online hearing test (in reality you have get your ears checked by an audiologist):

Hearing Test Simulator

http://www.starkey.com/online-hearing-test



A chart to correlate the sound pressure levels with daily life situations and "Daily Permissible Noise Level Exposure":

Decibel (Loudness) Comparison Chart

http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos/loudness.html





A basic article for preventing hearing loss:

Tips to Avoid iPod Hearing Loss

http://ipod.about.com/od/generalmaintenance/a/avoiding-ipod-hearing-loss.htm



An article from innerfidelity:

Loud Music Sucks!

http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/loud-music-sucks



An article about the dangers of HP usage:

Earphones 'potentially as dangerous as noise from jet engines,' according to new University of Leicester study

http://www2.le.ac.uk/offices/press/...ccording-to-new-university-of-leicester-study



A thread on head-fi about the EMF pollution caused by headphones:

Health issues associated with prolonged headphones use due to EMF pollution?

http://www.head-fi.org/t/473894/hea...prolonged-headphones-use-due-to-emf-pollution



The original manuscript on the below is not directly related to headphones (but it can be related to magnets and electromagnetic radiation caused by headphones/iems):

Health risks of electromagnetic fields. Part I: Evaluation and assessment of electric and magnetic fields.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15018215?dopt=Abstract



An article about safe listening:

Researchers Recommend Safe Listening Levels for Apple iPod

http://phys.org/news80304823.html



A lot of useful information including iem's and health by ClieOS:

IEMs and Health

http://www.head-fi.org/a/basic-guide-to-in-ear-canalphones



An article about the PMP's and hearing health:

Personal Music Players & Hearing

http://ec.europa.eu/health/opinions/en/hearing-loss-personal-music-player-mp3/index.htm#6



As the title on the below says it:

IMPORTANT: Audio quality is a huge protection to your hearing

http://www.head-fi.org/t/720813/important-audio-quality-is-a-huge-protection-to-your-hearing



Protecting your hearing in very noisy environments (earplugs):

High-Fidelity Hearing Protection

http://www.etymotic.com/hp/erme.html

Don't wear HP's while on traffic! :

Injuries to Headphone-Wearing Pedestrians Struck by Cars and Trains More Than Triple Since 2004

http://umm.edu/news-and-events/news...y-cars-and-trains-more-than-triple-since-2004




A short article about headphone history and the current state of its use by people:

How Headphones Changed the World

http://m.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/05/how-headphones-changed-the-world/257830/



LINKS to the valuable posts inside this thread:

In-attentional Blindness by @Tyll Hertsens
Quote from Tyll's post:
"Probably worth mentioning the issues related to inattentional blindness caused by headphones.
People get killed every month by walking out in front of trains with headphones on.
That's not to mention cars.
Please be aware of the danger of walking around with headphones on and not paying attention to your surroundings."


Caution while using Hearring Protection by @Morlizer
Quote from Morlizer's post:
"When using hearing protection in a noisy environment be sure to not take it off. Our hearing adapts to loud noise if it increases gradually. If you use hearing protection and take them off in a noisy environment you could hurt your ears more than if you were not wearing them due to the sudden change in noise."

Practicing Safe Sound: Hardware and Software Pitfalls by @McClelland

Quote from McClelland's post:
"USB BUGS: Don't Get Bitten"



Source for the drawing: http://www.dangerousdecibels.org/education/information-center/decibel-exposure-time-guidelines/


"Safe Listening!"

Hearing health matters! Protect your ears by keeping the volume in check and taking breaks. Even the best audio gear is useless without good hearing. Let’s remind each other. Safe Listening!

 

[ryhawk52]

Hearing health matters! Protect your ears by keeping the volume in check and taking breaks. Even the best audio gear is useless without good hearing. Let’s remind each other. Safe Listening!

Thanks. Just looked through a lot of that. However, I guess my question is (which I don't think any of that addressed): Could more detail be WORSE for your ears, BECAUSE it's more detailed? Like not volume, but just detail? For example again, when I used the Ananda, I could hear more, it's amazing. But then my ears hurt weirdly. And it wasn't louder. Is that just me? Maybe it's pressure, high notes, etc? Nothing in these posts really addresses that (although I couldn't access the NYT one)

 

[Baycode]

Thanks. Just looked through a lot of that. However, I guess my question is (which I don't think any of that addressed): Could more detail be WORSE for your ears, BECAUSE it's more detailed? Like not volume, but just detail? For example again, when I used the Ananda, I could hear more, it's amazing. But then my ears hurt weirdly. And it wasn't louder. Is that just me? Maybe it's pressure, high notes, etc? Nothing in these posts really addresses that (although I couldn't access the NYT one)

From my experience, high frequencies (boosted by the recording or the headphone itself) causes ringing in my ears. The higher the volume the issue arises more. But for your situation it is very hard to predict the main cause. Because tinnitus may occur from many different causes...

 

[ryhawk52]

From my experience, high frequencies (boosted by the recording or the headphone itself) causes ringing in my ears. The higher the volume the issue arises more. But for your situation it is very hard to predict the main cause. Because tinnitus may occur from many different causes...

Helpful, appreciate it. Yeah it's obviously a lot of things. Could be pressure too—from the clamp force, or even from a more closed back. I'm not sure. But it is weird how it seems for tinnitus, it's always just about volume. Obviously that's number 1. But it seems a lot more complex

 

[Raketen]

Newer here. I don't listen above 85—for sure. And yet, sometimes, with maybe certain headphones (Ananda?), afterwards, for a couple days, my left ear kinda just feels weird. And rings if I push it closed

Question is: Is it actually more above decibels? OR can certain frequency response graphs, or just tuning of headphones, react weird to certain ears? Again, the Ananda's maybe did that to me. But I was also listening to more music than normal (again not loud).

Thanks for any help! I love the Anandas, but would rather keep ear health IF certain headphones can do something like this...

Thanks. Just looked through a lot of that. However, I guess my question is (which I don't think any of that addressed): Could more detail be WORSE for your ears, BECAUSE it's more detailed? Like not volume, but just detail? For example again, when I used the Ananda, I could hear more, it's amazing. But then my ears hurt weirdly. And it wasn't louder. Is that just me? Maybe it's pressure, high notes, etc? Nothing in these posts really addresses that (although I couldn't access the NYT one)

Helpful, appreciate it. Yeah it's obviously a lot of things. Could be pressure too—from the clamp force, or even from a more closed back. I'm not sure. But it is weird how it seems for tinnitus, it's always just about volume. Obviously that's number 1. But it seems a lot more complex

The ringing is a tinnitus-like symptom, though it seems like you might also be describing auditory fatigue ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auditory_fatigue ) which according to that Wiki can become hearing damage, particularly if not given sufficient recovery time. If this is a recurring problem it's probably worth changing your habits, and might be worth talking to a doctor/audiologist, if that's an option for you.

Am not particularly knowledgable or remotely qualified on this subject of hearing health (or headphones/audio for that matter ), but for the question of "detail vs volume", some possibly related things:

I believe "detail", to a significant extent, is volume - more precisely volume of the recorded sound's frequencies which contain "details", relative to the rest of the headphone's frequency response- a headphone is generally considered "detailed" because it is relatively louder at these frequencies - so, sort of definitionally, if you are listening to a headphone and noticing it is more detailed than another headphone, it's because you are hearing those frequencies at a louder volume- Although it is posssible the other less-detailed headphone is just as loud at those frequencies, but there is a masking effect due to the overall frequency response and/or how that causes you to adjust volume- and AFAIK I am oversimplifying here - different sounds have different "detail" freqencies, and there are other aspects which might impact this to varying degrees of subtlety (including in terms of the individual listener, headphone performance & physical characteristics, and music mixing practices or psychoacoustic effects etc..)

I can only speak to myself, but I've noticed I tend to set my volume according to the loudness of certain frequency ranges. Listening to different headphones but setting volume this way, it could be that you are exposing your ears to louder volumes at frequencies where it is less noticable- IIRC (from the Fletcher-Munson curves) "detail" and "air" frequencies above 5khz are ones we are generally less sensitive to, and at subbass frequencies (where planars like Ananda tend to have pretty good extension) we might not even be able to hear or feel how loud it really is, especially with open back cans (but even if we do not percieve its loudness, it can still affect our hearing https://www.science.org/content/article/sounds-you-cant-hear-can-still-hurt-your-ears )

For instance if I have a tendency to set my volume using the range around 2khz (roughly "vocal presence' range, IIRC), the Ananda has a peak at 8-9khz, that's almost 10dB louder than 2khz (contrasted with something like a portapro, where it actually a decrease) at a frequency that I might not even notice is particularly loud. https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/hifiman/ananda/

(an experiment that might be helpful for future listening sessions- though not if you are risking hearing fatigue damage from that headphone or your current listening habits- would be to set your volume as you normally would, then without adjusting overall volume use EQ to decrease the levels of those high range detail and low end subbass frequencies and see if the issue still arises)

 

[ryhawk52]

The ringing is a tinnitus-like symptom, though it seems like you might also be describing auditory fatigue ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auditory_fatigue ) which according to that Wiki can become hearing damage, particularly if not given sufficient recovery time. If this is a recurring problem it's probably worth changing your habits, and might be worth talking to a doctor/audiologist, if that's an option for you.

Am not particularly knowledgable or remotely qualified on this subject of hearing health (or headphones/audio for that matter ), but for the question of "detail vs volume", some possibly related things:

I believe "detail", to a significant extent, is volume - more precisely volume of the recorded sound's frequencies which contain "details", relative to the rest of the headphone's frequency response- a headphone is generally considered "detailed" because it is relatively louder at these frequencies - so, sort of definitionally, if you are listening to a headphone and noticing it is more detailed than another headphone, it's because you are hearing those frequencies at a louder volume- Although it is posssible the other less-detailed headphone is just as loud at those frequencies, but there is a masking effect due to the overall frequency response and/or how that causes you to adjust volume- and AFAIK I am oversimplifying here - different sounds have different "detail" freqencies, and there are other aspects which might impact this to varying degrees of subtlety (including in terms of the individual listener, headphone performance & physical characteristics, and music mixing practices or psychoacoustic effects etc..)

I can only speak to myself, but I've noticed I tend to set my volume according to the loudness of certain frequency ranges. Listening to different headphones but setting volume this way, it could be that you are exposing your ears to louder volumes at frequencies where it is less noticable- IIRC (from the Fletcher-Munson curves) "detail" and "air" frequencies above 5khz are ones we are generally less sensitive to, and at subbass frequencies (where planars like Ananda tend to have pretty good extension) we might not even be able to hear or feel how loud it really is, especially with open back cans (but even if we do not percieve its loudness, it can still affect our hearing https://www.science.org/content/article/sounds-you-cant-hear-can-still-hurt-your-ears )

For instance if I have a tendency to set my volume using the range around 2khz (roughly "vocal presence' range, IIRC), the Ananda has a peak at 8-9khz, that's almost 10dB louder than 2khz (contrasted with something like a portapro, where it actually a decrease) at a frequency that I might not even notice is particularly loud. https://diyaudioheaven.wordpress.com/headphones/measurements/hifiman/ananda/

(an experiment that might be helpful for future listening sessions- though not if you are risking hearing fatigue damage from that headphone or your current listening habits- would be to set your volume as you normally would, then without adjusting overall volume use EQ to decrease the levels of those high range detail and low end subbass frequencies and see if the issue still arises)

Wow, that was incredibly helpful. And that finally makes sense. That's almost certainly it (or a big part of it). Especially with the Ananda, and then it being open back, it's probably I am listening "louder" than I realize due to those details and such. Interesting. I'm going to give my ears a few days (sadly). But then I may try your recommendation. Appreciate it