[sgrossklass]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aryolkary http://www.swanspeaker.com/product/htm/view.asp?id=3

Cool, they got some meaningful measurements.

I'm not really an expert on speakers, but those look pretty good for "multimedia speakers". I think I've seen a waterfall plot for the Sony MDR-V6 here (these are done far too infrequently on cans, unfortunately), that might be interesting to compare.

EDIT: While we're at measurements, let me reiterate what Tyll Hertsens said re: the interpretation of the freq response measurements as done by Headroom: The equivalent of a flat response for a speaker would look like a line gently sloping down from +3...+4 dB in the bass (to compensate for the lack of visceral impact) to ~ -5 dB at 20 kHz (to account for damping of the higher freqs when the speakers are at a finite distance in a real room).

 

[Aryolkary]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgrossklass Frequency response is one area where headphones hold a noticeable advantage. Even the cheapo Philips SHP805 with its 40 mm drivers (not even with Nd magnets) can hit 40 Hz fairly well (37 Hz is still OK, too, but then they really drop off quickly), higher-end models with 50 mm drivers have even better bass extension (more limited by hearing than anything else, here the physical impact aspect comes into play). Besides, headphone drivers are wideband affairs that do not require crossovers. I still have two older Jamo floorstanders which cost us 300 DM (~170$) a piece, and those do not extend far below 45 Hz (how could they, with a 16 cm bass driver?), have a nasty resonance at ~150 Hz and highs distortion that isn't really funny anymore. (Not even the cheapest of my cans exhibit problems like that.) Besides, I always found them to be somewhat muffled sounding, and my room acoustics suck, too. The Jamo 707s that my parents use (~$1000 new, IIRC, bought used) are far better, but I find them to have a more extreme EQ than HD590s (mids yet more laid-back, yet brighter) that I don't like overly much anymore, besides the bass modes or rather the resulting resonance peaks (no, this is not an acoustically dead living room, and speaker placement in the corners is not ideal) tend to give me a headache. See why I'm using cans?

So a room with many things in the middle (regular bedroom with lots of things in the floor, etc etc.) will help colouring the sound. Would it colour more the high frequencies or the low frequencies? Would it have another effect besides that one?
The thing about speakers is you can move freely, and not have any weight on your head (never tried IEMs). Also you can leave them on for 2 or 3 hours when going to sleep and it won't damage your hearing like headphones would (IEMs in this case, as fullsize are impossible to sleep with if you move a lot, and sleep on your side). I suppose it comes to the use: music genre, neighbours, if it is critical listening or just backround, how loud (I read that speakers at very low volume won't show as much detail as at considerable normal volume), etc.
Well, I have sent a PM to Gluegun, the only guy I saw has the Swans M200 and has written reviews and posted in several forums, but he doesn't seem to visit here often. So, any comparison will be appreciated. Thanks

 

[Asr]

Well I don't know about headphones vs speakers in general, but I do know this: the AKG K271S retail for $200, and when the Yamaha YST-MS50 was in production it retailed for $150. The only pros the K271S have over my speakers are its trademark warm mids, and it does resolve some detail better than what I can hear from the speakers. Otherwise, they get beat down silly. My speakers give plenty of bass response (reaching down to somewhere between 30 and 35Hz with wads of oomph), and although some people might call it bright, the extension on the highs makes it sound much more non-limiting. The frequency response isn't completely flat, but it's a lot flatter than on the K271S, despite still sounding a bit warm (my initial impression when listening to them for the first time). Soundstage is also projected a lot better, and completely unlike the K271S, it handles every genre of music I've thrown at it with skill. Acoustic, classical/orchestral, electronica, trip-hop, jazz.

So I might have an isolated case, but there are still obviously exceptions.

 

[Aryolkary]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Asr Well I don't know about headphones vs speakers in general, but I do know this: the AKG K271S retail for $200, and when the Yamaha YST-MS50 was in production it retailed for $150. The only pros the K271S have over my speakers are its trademark warm mids, and it does resolve some detail better than what I can hear from the speakers. Otherwise, they get beat down silly. My speakers give plenty of bass response (reaching down to somewhere between 30 and 35Hz with wads of oomph), and although some people might call it bright, the extension on the highs makes it sound much more non-limiting. The frequency response isn't completely flat, but it's a lot flatter than on the K271S, despite still sounding a bit warm (my initial impression when listening to them for the first time). Soundstage is also projected a lot better, and completely unlike the K271S, it handles every genre of music I've thrown at it with skill. Acoustic, classical/orchestral, electronica, trip-hop, jazz. So I might have an isolated case, but there are still obviously exceptions.

Thanks for your comment. I find it useful to read that comparison.

 

[ZOKROX]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssingh0 not true, military technology that takes individualized measurements of each soldiers head, ear, canal, etc. and a computer processes the sound so that the sound waves hitting the ears mimic that of natural/speaker hearing. headroom had something about this too on their website, don't know if it's still there.

HYPERSONIC SOUND "speakers" are "LIKE" headphones thread:

http://www6.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=150367

Techical paper on microwave sound:

http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:m...ve+sound&hl=en

"New" Hypersonic Sound "speakers" are "like" headphones article:

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/te...5-19-hss_x.htm


************************************************** *****
ATC HYPERSONIC SOUND "SPEAKERS":

http://www.atcsd.com/

http://www.m-media.com/store/index6.php

http://www.popsci.com/popsci/bown/20...768450,00.html

http://www.acoustics.org/press/133rd/2pea.html

http://www.boingboing.net/2005/06/26...sound_dev.html

http://forums.museophile.net/story/2003/3/29/211210/163

http://www.popularmechanics.com/tech...o/1279591.html

http://www.datafilter.com/mc/microwaveHearing.html

 

[markl]

Apples and oranges, but IMO, even moderately-priced speakers (say $1000-$1200) will crush any headphones. Better bass, soundstaging, realism, musicality, you name it.

 

[discord]

Speakers have more of the bass that you can just feel. That's why I like them more than headphones sometimes.

 

[Sovkiller]

Both have their own strenghs and flaws, and I use them for different purposes, it is true that you need really a nice space and be seated at the sweet spot to get the right soundstage and performance from speakers, but hey when you are there, voila!!!!! you cna share them wiht friends, while talking, drinking etc....and there are other factors to consdier also, distance, acoustic treatments, reflections from the walls etc...
But the same way you can't listen them at 3AM in the morning, and when you need a really critical listening, heaphones are very handy, as the drivers are closer to the ears and are less prone to distractions, they do not need a sweet spot and no need of real state to get the best out of them, so my solution is, I use both depending on the ocassion, and try to get a decent setup on both worlds depending on the budget, and conditions of the enviroment....

 

[stewtheking]

Hasn't this been done to death in countless threads?

Headphones and speakers are different.
Headphones and speakers have different good/bad qualities.
Many people here prefer headphones because this is a headphone forum.
Many people here prefer speakers, because they enjoy them more.

Use your ears, my friend, and listen all you can, then you can decide where your preference lies.

 

[Aryolkary]

Quote:

Originally Posted by stewtheking Hasn't this been done to death in countless threads? Headphones and speakers are different. Headphones and speakers have different good/bad qualities. Many people here prefer headphones because this is a headphone forum. Many people here prefer speakers, because they enjoy them more. Use your ears, my friend, and listen all you can, then you can decide where your preference lies.

I wish I could listen and compare, but living in Argentina is really a limiting thing when it comes to different manufacturers, high end, etc. Anyway my biggest concern was about the Swans M200, how good they are, since I have read they are so "great" and wanted to see if that's just exaggeration.

 

[Aryolkary]

Quote:

Originally Posted by stewtheking Hasn't this been done to death in countless threads? Headphones and speakers are different. Headphones and speakers have different good/bad qualities. Many people here prefer headphones because this is a headphone forum. Many people here prefer speakers, because they enjoy them more. Use your ears, my friend, and listen all you can, then you can decide where your preference lies.

I wish I could listen and compare, but living in Argentina is really a limiting thing when it comes to different manufacturers, high end, etc. Anyway my biggest concern was about the Swans M200, how good they are, since I have read they are so "great" and wanted to see if that's just exaggeration.

 

[Aryolkary]

Quote:

Originally Posted by stewtheking Hasn't this been done to death in countless threads? Headphones and speakers are different. Headphones and speakers have different good/bad qualities. Many people here prefer headphones because this is a headphone forum. Many people here prefer speakers, because they enjoy them more. Use your ears, my friend, and listen all you can, then you can decide where your preference lies.

I wish I could listen and compare, but living in Argentina is really a limiting thing when it comes to different manufacturers, high end, etc. Anyway my biggest concern was about the Swans M200, how good they are, since I have read they are so "great" and wanted to see if that's just exaggeration.

 

[PhilS]

I agree that this is sort of like comparing apples and oranges, but on a dollar for dollar basis, I can see why people might say some headphones might be more economical. For example, I paid $37 for my Sennheiser PX-100 phones. I don't think I could find a new set of speakers for $37 that would sound that good.

 

[morphsci]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ojnihs ... Now, as of this moment, due to my being in college and being on a college budget, I look towards headphones to satisfy my musical thirst. But once I get out of college and hit the real world, I'm going to start fading out the headphones and moving towards a speaker setup ....

I wouldn't get rid of the phones, maybe put them in storage until you need them again when the sound of little feet pattering about the house make headphones the primary transducer and the speakers are relegated to duty when no one else is in the house (or when you are playing Christmas music

)

Anyway, I agree with those who advocate the realism and impact you get with speakers that you only obtain glimpses of with headphones.