[MatW]

I'm enjoying this conversation. There is a headfi thread called let's talk metal, where I would like to see conversations like these, but it's only used to drop links to albums.

 

[genck]

It means the pinnacle has been reached, everyone found their headphones and it's all about the music now.i don't see a problem.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

I enjoy the robotic sound of tech death albums. I don't think it would work at all without all the compression. Epitaph was recorded note by note and then patched together and it sounds spectacular to me. I think most of modern techy stuff is punched in to death or recorded at half speed, but I personally dig how it inhumanely clean it sounds. But yeah I get where're you're coming from. I dig dynamic range and rawer feel, but not necessarily in metal.

I can respect that. And I do like some tech death, but when it sounds so digital it takes me out of it. But I think that's a personal taste as well. Like, I'm one of those mutants who actually likes the garbage production from Artery Eruption and Mortician but I definitely wouldn't point to either of them as "good" in any sense. Slam/brutal is a huge chunk of my listening, and whew lad are these albums generally rough in the production, but I'd be lying if I said I didn't love most of them.

When I get asked what albums have good production, I'll usually point at something like Negura Bunget, Ulcerate, Agalloch. Soen's "Lotus" is just goddamn pretty to my ears. Rivers of Nihil's "Where the Owls..." also absolutely ticks the boxes for me, same with Fleshgod's "King."

But again, personal taste. I suppose if the production choices aid in the music rather than holding it back, that's good. Paysage D'Hiver wouldn't sound right if it wasn't razor thin.

More on topic, of course, I do miss my LCD-3/cma800i combo. That's metal nirvana (to my ears)

 

[vonBaron]

Please, when you receive the VC, could you post impressions using with different metal genres? And also a comparison with the D8000 (and, from memory, with the RAD 0). Thanks.

I loan VC form a friend and they are quite simillar to D8000, big bass and slam, very meaty midrange, smooth highs, very good soundstage, very fast HP. In fact i like them more than RAD-0 that i had, VC has more air, better soundstage and waaaaay better comfort, they are quite heavy but weight distribution is great.
Buy better cable is a must, ZMF OFC cable is poor, i use WyWires Platinum and it's way better, more air, better soundstage, more micro and macro detali.
For some upper midrange in VC can be a problem, it's a little shouty.
Still they are TOTL closed back HP for metal!

 

[Terriero]

I loan VC form a friend and they are quite simillar to D8000, big bass and slam, very meaty midrange, smooth highs, very good soundstage, very fast HP. In fact i like them more than RAD-0 that i had, VC has more air, better soundstage and waaaaay better comfort, they are quite heavy but weight distribution is great.
Buy better cable is a must, ZMF OFC cable is poor, i use WyWires Platinum and it's way better, more air, better soundstage, more micro and macro detali.
For some upper midrange in VC can be a problem, it's a little shouty.
Still they are TOTL closed back HP for metal!

Thank you very much for your answer... Now you are waiting eagerly for your VCs...

- The most important thing for me is if the VCs are forgiving with bad studio productions. I don't mean the format, almost all my music is in FLAC format, I mean bands like "The Sins of the beloved", "Tristania" or "Summoning" that I love and never enjoyed properly. I've always listened with poorly headphones (included with players, for example) and when I listened them with DT 1990 Pro I could enjoy and then I wonder if there are more headphones (that cost less than 2500 €) that do well with bad produced metal. I'm thinking in a Kennerton Magni, now that they are on sale. With my HD 800 I rarely listen to metal because all of you know that is a trully unforgiven can.

- Also I want to know if the VCs are a good multigenre headphones.

I can't understand why always the cables included are a bad match for the HPs... Maybe brands like ZMF could cooperate with Forza and include their cables with the cans.

By the way, so pretty that version of the VC.

 

[vonBaron]

I think they are, you can change sound by swapping pads. From very warm to neutral.

They are very good for different music.

Stock zmf cable are nice for start .

 

[burningv]

I used to think like you. Nowadays, with the high-end equipment, I find myself not enjoying the older, raw recordings as much as I used to. A shame to some degree, but not all the old stuff is poorly recorded, and there are so many great new releases every week, that I don't even get around to the classics anymore.

But hey, to each his own, esp. when it comes to preferences in metal genres and recording styles.

I think the problem here is that you identify the production in those raw recordings as a flaw, but that's exactly what most find appealing, and I certainly wouldn't have them any other way. If I wanted squeaky clean recordings, I'd listen to another genre. Some of the albums that you listed sound overproduced, sterile, and don't embody the spirit of Metal at all. As for Andy Sneap, I don't like his production because it's just too clean. Thrash is supposed to be fast, dirty, and raw like that one night stand you had with a hooker.

I think you fell into the trap like some people here and bought expensive gear that reveal too much of the recordings that you never really enjoyed in the first place. For me it's the complete opposite, especially went it comes to expensive headphones that are neutral as they capture more of the recording, have great sound separation, tone, speed, all of which make the listening experience more pleasant and effortless when compared to a low tier of coloured headphones where everything sounds like a jumbled muddy mess. But hey YMMV.

 

[Terriero]

I think the problem here is that you identify the production in those raw recordings as a flaw, but that's exactly what most find appealing, and I certainly wouldn't have them any other way. If I wanted squeaky clean recordings, I'd listen to another genre. Some of the albums that you listed sound overproduced, sterile, and don't embody the spirit of Metal at all. As for Andy Sneap, I don't like his production because it's just too clean. Thrash is supposed to be fast, dirty, and raw like that one night stand you had with a hooker.

I think you fell into the trap like some people here and bought expensive gear that reveal too much of the recordings that you never really enjoyed in the first place. For me it's the complete opposite, especially went it comes to expensive headphones that are neutral as they capture more of the recording, have great sound separation, tone, speed, all of which make the listening experience more pleasant and effortless when compared to a low tier of coloured headphones where everything sounds like a jumbled muddy mess. But hey YMMV.

I never think that I can enjoy certain albums with high end headphones, but now I realize that is possible. When I start to listen this album, I love the beggining grunt and the kind of production it has, but with low end headphones (or garbage iems) the album sounds "like a jumbled muddy mess" (like you described perfectly) with high end cans (like DT 1990 Pro) I detected certain nuances in the songs (that I perfectly know) and it was incredible.

 

[magicscreen]

The best of the worst productions this:
Black Sabbath - Trashed
"When the band heard the final product, they were horrified at the muffled mix. "

 

[Vruksha]

I think the problem here is that you identify the production in those raw recordings as a flaw, but that's exactly what most find appealing, and I certainly wouldn't have them any other way. If I wanted squeaky clean recordings, I'd listen to another genre. Some of the albums that you listed sound overproduced, sterile, and don't embody the spirit of Metal at all. As for Andy Sneap, I don't like his production because it's just too clean. Thrash is supposed to be fast, dirty, and raw like that one night stand you had with a hooker.

I think you fell into the trap like some people here and bought expensive gear that reveal too much of the recordings that you never really enjoyed in the first place. For me it's the complete opposite, especially went it comes to expensive headphones that are neutral as they capture more of the recording, have great sound separation, tone, speed, all of which make the listening experience more pleasant and effortless when compared to a low tier of coloured headphones where everything sounds like a jumbled muddy mess. But hey YMMV.

I find raw recordings better over most of the clean stuff today, Bloodincantation, Tombmold, Malignant Altar, Necrot.. these bands have been putting out some really good sounding albums lately.
They sound like real humans playing.
Can you name some well produced albums that's raw but you can hear all the instruments well. Example Piece of mind, it's a perfect album imo.

 

[SomeGuyDude]

I find raw recordings better over most of the clean stuff today, Bloodincantation, Tombmold, Malignant Altar, Necrot.. these bands have been putting out some really good sounding albums lately.
They sound like real humans playing.
Can you name some well produced albums that's raw but you can hear all the instruments well. Example Piece of mind, it's a perfect album imo.

God yes. All of these. Nectrot and Tomb Mold are top tier.

 

[vonBaron]

So now my TOP 3 metal HP are
1. AB-1266
2. Final D8000
3. ZMF Verite C

 

[Trance_Gott]

The best produced metal albums I've heard are

Metallica - The Black Album
Exodus - Exhibit B
Necrophagist - Epitaph
any Meshuggah album since Destroy Erase Improve
Fear Factory - Demanufacture
Any Steven Wilson produced Opeth album, but I guess Blackwater Park
Nevermore - Dead Heart in a Dead World
Spawn of Possesion - Incurso
Symphony X - The Oddysey
Periphery is very well produced, although not my cup of tea.
Nile - At The Gate of Sethu
Death - Symbolic, The Sound of Perseverance
Morbid Angel - Covenant

There's loads, but those come to my mind immediately.

All classic black metal albums are pretty goddamn awful sounding, as was intended. New stuff like Mgla sounds ppgood though.

Hearing now
Exodus - Exhibit B
with the Abyss 1266 Phi TC holy crap!
The Black Album is also amazing great soundstage.
Epitah speed speed speed and TC gives you every plankton detail here.

 

[tommir]

Just got back my VC form @vonBaron. Didn't have enough time for listening before I sent them to him, so this was my night . I connected them to 2 amps, changed pads and checked with 3 different cables, ZMF one, WyWires form @vonBaron and LCD-4 Cardas stock. For me - just the best closed back headphones for metal music. The're very pad and cable sensitive. I found hybrid pads best for me, they add some hights. If you prefer more balanced soung just go with stock ones. As was mentioned stock ZMF cable is a good starter, but balanced one. The other is very poor. With WyWires the sound is more clean and detailed, soundstage looks wider but the midbas seems to be reduced, upper mids are more harsh. With Cardas sound os more smooth ans bass also reduced if I compare to stock one. I think good silver or gold pated silver can be a good pari for VC and I will try one in the future, that's for sure.

 

[Terriero]

@tommir very creative your profile photo. Congrats And thanks so much for your VC valoration for metal.