@Yanto , it is good to research for a headphone purchase. However, you will never learn the nuances of a headphone without listening to it. At some point, ‘idea’ has to become ‘actuality’. I suggest that you get the Sennheiser HD-600. After a time, if you like them, you can possibly upgrade cables / do Custom Cans UK modifications. If you do not like the HD-600, it can be sold readily.
@Yanto , it is good to research for a headphone purchase. However, you will never learn the nuances of a headphone without listening to it. At some point, ‘idea’ has to become ‘actuality’. I suggest that you get the Sennheiser HD-600. After a time, if you like them, you can possibly upgrade cables / do Custom Cans UK modifications. If you do not like the HD-600, it can be sold readily.
You’re right I’ve definitely overthought this. I know here that the HD600 resells very easily. As you say I need to listen. And I can’t do that without buying it. So time to buy. Thanks.
You’re right I’ve definitely overthought this. I know here that the HD600 resells very easily. As you say I need to listen. And I can’t do that without buying it. So time to buy. Thanks.
This is where my confusion comes in. I’ve been informed in other places that of my two options, the Sundara handles classical including full symphonies much better than the HD600, which is better with more intimate pieces. But in your experience the HD600 handles it just fine.
Also I have been told that my cheap little set up (IFi Zen DAC v2 and Zen Can stack), is not really good enough for the HD600 but would suit the Sundara better. So is the reason that you find that the HD600 is good with full orchestral music because your system is far better? Interesting
I never tried the Sundara, but I have the Susvara and I prefer HD800 and HD600 with a wide margin. As for the setup, I agree that HD600 is a tricky headphone. Many listeners dismiss it as muffled and boring because they match it with low-end gear. It needs a powerful amp to shine, the same kind of amp you’d pick for the HD800.
This is where my confusion comes in. I’ve been informed in other places that of my two options, the Sundara handles classical including full symphonies much better than the HD600, which is better with more intimate pieces. But in your experience the HD600 handles it just fine.
Also I have been told that my cheap little set up (IFi Zen DAC v2 and Zen Can stack), is not really good enough for the HD600 but would suit the Sundara better. So is the reason that you find that the HD600 is good with full orchestral music because your system is far better? Interesting
I can totally appreciate and understand what you’re saying. But from my point of view, my Zen stack is a month old. Yes it was only £200. But I’m not looking to change it any time soon. It actually sounds pretty good with most genres with my SR325x. I was just hoping to find another headphone that improves my classical listening and in particular orchestral symphonies.
So if pairing the Sundara or HD600 with my current set up isn’t going to work then I guess neither are the headphone I’m looking for unfortunately.
I can totally appreciate and understand what you’re saying. But from my point of view, my Zen stack is a month old. Yes it was only £200. But I’m not looking to change it any time soon. It actually sounds pretty good with most genres with my SR325x. I was just hoping to find another headphone that improves my classical listening and in particular orchestral symphonies.
So if pairing the Sundara or HD600 with my current set up isn’t going to work then I guess neither are the headphone I’m looking for unfortunately.
Oh it’s awesome that you are reading scores whilst listening! I have only recently learned to read music, but only for playing guitar purposes.
So if only listening to say full symphonies, is the separation and detail good enough, or can the HD600 get muddled in faster, full orchestral sections? Because this is the issue I find at times with my Grado. And I want to avoid that.
The bass response is not so important to me especially as you know in classical. But looking at a comparison of FR graphs the HD600 seems to be very similar to my Grado in that respect and I find it ample for my taste in Classic Rock and Prog.
Mmmmmmm.....kinda hard to answer, all depends on your ears and your ability to separate. It's not muddled......just.....closer. Hard to describe. There isn't any bleed between sections, there just isn't air between them if that makes any sense. And if you have a zen stack, that's fine for the HD600 (assuming you have a zen can amp and are not just going straight out of the Zen dac). You seem very new to the hobby so I wouldn't go all out and get everything at once. Get one thing (in this case headphones) and just spend time with it before moving on to other spots in your chain (or even another set of cans). Anyhow, best of luck! I will say.....I've never met a classical music lover that ever thought the HD600 was BAD, just that other options better suited their needs. They have a beautiful sound, are pretty reference, and if you're willing to sacrifice stage and bass extension I don't think you'll be disappointed. It'll be a night and day difference between those and the Grados (btw....you mentioned you suffer from tinnitus? I'd really not continue to use the harsh top end grados if it's bad)
Mmmmmmm.....kinda hard to answer, all depends on your ears and your ability to separate. It's not muddled......just.....closer. Hard to describe. There isn't any bleed between sections, there just isn't air between them if that makes any sense. And if you have a zen stack, that's fine for the HD600 (assuming you have a zen can amp and are not just going straight out of the Zen dac). You seem very new to the hobby so I wouldn't go all out and get everything at once. Get one thing (in this case headphones) and just spend time with it before moving on to other spots in your chain (or even another set of cans). Anyhow, best of luck! I will say.....I've never met a classical music lover that ever thought the HD600 was BAD, just that other options better suited their needs. They have a beautiful sound, are pretty reference, and if you're willing to sacrifice stage and bass extension I don't think you'll be disappointed. It'll be a night and day difference between those and the Grados (btw....you mentioned you suffer from tinnitus? I'd really not continue to use the harsh top end grados if it's bad)
You’re right I am indeed very new to listening with headphones. Most of my listening would normally be done with speakers (Kef LS50W2), but I’m waiting for our new house to be finished at the moment so unable to use them.
I guess I’ve only been using headphones for 3 months. Hence my complete lack of knowledge and understanding. I know what I want to hear, but not necessarily how to describe it and achieve it.
I have the Zen DAC v2 and Zen Can stack.
Grado are very good on most of my listening, it’s just orchestral where I’d like an improvement really. I don’t find them too bright as I mostly use G pads which temper the treble.
Bass extension is not an issue for me with the genres I listen to. The Grado don’t have it either yet the bass provided is ample for my taste. But if the soundstage is narrow on the HD600 does that mean that separation is lost? Thanks
Anyway I need to stop talking and buy something before I’m told off again!
You’re right I am indeed very new to listening with headphones. Most of my listening would normally be done with speakers (Kef LS50W2), but I’m waiting for our new house to be finished at the moment so unable to use them.
I guess I’ve only been using headphones for 3 months. Hence my complete lack of knowledge and understanding. I know what I want to hear, but not necessarily how to describe it and achieve it.
I have the Zen DAC v2 and Zen Can stack.
Grado are very good on most of my listening, it’s just orchestral where I’d like an improvement really. I don’t find them too bright as I mostly use G pads which temper the treble.
Bass extension is not an issue for me with the genres I listen to. The Grado don’t have it either yet the bass provided is ample for my taste. But if the soundstage is narrow on the HD600 does that mean that separation is lost? Thanks
Anyway I need to stop talking and buy something before I’m told off again!
600's are about timbre. - they are dead on. The 800/800S gives the the great soundstage, but they aren't as good in timbre. I'm pretty sure they were designed on a transformerless tube amp in part or whole, because compared to the 3 very highly respected SS amps I've heard them on - that deliver more current to them - don't sound nearly as good as on the kit Bottlehead Crack. Some of it is the even order harmonic distortion that adds warmth/sweetness - but I know classical played live by greats in 3 of the best Halls in the world. Explain it any way you like - those Senns are best on those sorts of amps.
Never heard the Zen can - stats look good - in particular the volts available at 300 ohms. I think given the undying popularity for classical lovers you ought get one - used with the blue 50's style headband should be available - you will need a new set of pads - tons of posts on that topic alone - all other options more $ and a long way up to get that timbre.
Never heard the Zen can - stats look good - in particular the volts available at 300 ohms. I think given the undying popularity for classical lovers you ought get one - used with the blue 50's style headband should be available - you will need a new set of pads - tons of posts on that topic alone - all other options more $ and a long way up to get that timbre.
No used available here. They do crop up from time to time but rarely and go extremely quick.
So it would have to be new. Equivalent to £279 delivered. No returns unless damaged.
Just have to bite the bullet and go for it. If the worst happens and I don’t like them they’ll sell on easily at not to much of a loss. Cheers
Quick update. I ended up buying a pair of 6 month old, mint condition Sennheiser HD660S for £215. Included were a pair of Dekoni Hybrid pads which I’m yet to try.
I’ve only had them 4 days yet and so far have listened to 28 albums (mostly classical). I’m using them balanced into my Ifi Zen Dac v2 and Zen Can stack.
Reviews of these seemed to vary between warm,veiled and lacking detail and soundstage to natural, balanced, well detailed and excellent imaging. Right now I’m in the second group. These are not veiled at all. Details are excellent as is imaging. Soundstage although not huge is actually very good. Instrument timbre seems very realistic. It’s engaging and good to listen to. All in all, and it’s early days, I’m really impressed.
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