[earerror]

Just listen to the HD650's with an amp like mine, and you'll be happy. 

 

[SP Wild]

 
Quote:

We do hear differently...from this trumpet player's perspective the HD800s hit the nail on the head. Makes me know re-think the LCD-2. Ah heck, I can always sell them if they don't work with my ears.

Its funny you should say that.  I always imagined that a acoustic nylon string classical guitarist would pick a HD650 and a acoustic steel string guitarist would definitely go with a K701 - I used to practice on both types of guitars.  But yeah, what instrument you play will also influence this as well.
 
P.S. except the LCD2 would crap on both for both kinds of guitars.

 

[warp08]

Both of these cans (including the HD600 many consider superior to the 650s) immensely benefit from quality recabling, but that is not cheaply done.  The HD800, in addition to that can keep up with source, amping and IC improvements farther than its lesser brethren.  That said, aside from detail, sound stage (especially in fully balanced config) and comfort, I consider the HD600 to be an overall more balanced SS baseline for what it's worth, at least to my ears.
 

 

[MacedonianHero]

Quote:

 
 
 
P.S. except the LCD2 would crap on both for both kinds of guitars.

So do the T1s (for rock/metal).

 

[Roger Strummer]

Quote:

Its funny you should say that.  I always imagined that a acoustic nylon string classical guitarist would pick a HD650 and a acoustic steel string guitarist would definitely go with a K701 - I used to practice on both types of guitars.  But yeah, what instrument you play will also influence this as well.
 
P.S. except the LCD2 would crap on both for both guitars.

As a guitarist (acoustic and electric, not classical), I have yet to listen something better than the 800 for guitars (for me anyways). Actually I thought that guitars was not one of the 650's strengths. And if we focus on electrical guitars, the 650 tame them too much in comparison, particularly for genres like metal.
 
Seeing as the consensus lately has been that the 800 is great for classical, I sometimes feel crazy, but one of the main reasons the 800 are my favorite is their performance with metal, particularly progressive metal and power metal. 

 

[MacedonianHero]

Quote:

 
Seeing as the consensus lately has been that the 800 is great for classical, I sometimes feel crazy, but one of the main reasons the 800 are my favorite is their performance with metal, particularly progressive metal and power metal. 

They (HD800s) are especially good for Prog Rock too...Pink Floyd, Rush, Genesis, etc...

 

[Roger Strummer]

Quote:

They (HD800s) are especially good for Prog Rock too...Pink Floyd, Rush, Genesis, etc...

Now you're talking about the good stuff! 

 
I have found that the 800 shine more the more complex to reproduce the music is. For example Rhapsody of Fire or Dream Theater when at some moments there are a lot of things happening at very high speeds, the 800 shine on those. But I can see, from my brief hearing of the T1, how for something like Scorpions or The Doors they can be very good (to say the least).

 

[LAMark]

As usual, Uncle Erik's advice here is very good (or does that just mean I tend to agree with him?). I have both the 650 (w/ Equinox cable) and the 800, but after listening to the 800 I have not gone back to the 650 at all. It does not take careful listening to hear the quantum leap the 800s make in detail, sound stage, and (important to me) comfort. No more headaches from the 650 death grip! True, there are some recordings that seem a bit bright on the 800 and the 650 tones them down a bit. But I believe it's just that-the 650 tames the inherent brightness. Still keeping them, and perhaps I should do a more methodical comparison. But every time I put on the 800s and start listening I don't want to take them off.

 

[SP Wild]

Quote:

As a guitarist (acoustic and electric, not classical), I have yet to listen something better than the 800 for guitars (for me anyways). Actually I thought that guitars was not one of the 650's strengths. And if we focus on electrical guitars, the 650 tame them too much in comparison, particularly for genres like metal.
 
Seeing as the consensus lately has been that the 800 is great for classical, I sometimes feel crazy, but one of the main reasons the 800 are my favorite is their performance with metal, particularly progressive metal and power metal. 

Yup agreed,  The comment with the HD650 is specifically related to Nylon strings, which the K701 cannot do, which the HD800 can, because it has a full midrange, better than HD650 (sounded like LCD2 midrange from memory), without killing the "air", which the HD650's truly "slow" treble reponse does, creating that "veil" and "mud" - the actual treble levels are OK - it's the speed, or transient of the treble - that everyone is complaining about.

 

[Mr.Sneis]

I think you'll end up spending a ton more money to get the lauded amazing sound from the hd800.  If you get the 650's now you can build up to the hd800 later and then realize just how much better they are.
 
I can't see myself going back though after hearing the hd800, even on a less than stellar setup.

 

[Stoney]

There is no question there are many advantages to the 800... which is why I am so bummed about the damage they (the several units I heard) do to voices and to listening... very fatiguing.  
 
Quote:

 If you're coming from the treble limited HD650s, that sound you hear is called "treble"....maybe you've missed it from your recordings because it's always been there and the HD800s are just bringing it out while the HD650s coloured it over and hid it away.

 
I never use any headphone as my reference.  Not even my speaker system, or even better ones, although they can get a lot closer to reality. They can help me become aware of how to listen to aspects of sound, of what is possible, but always second to acoustic jazz, vocals, chamber, and symphony.  
 
I'm a lover of live, unamplified voice and instruments.  I've heard unamplified kd lang from 8 feet away, unamplified Mariza from 3 feet away, unamplified Amanda McBroom from various seats.  No mics.  
 
Voices in the 800 do not sound at all like real voices.  And, I'm just picking one, obvious signal that highlights the, er, highlighted lower treble.  
 
However, it is easy for me to imagine some loving the 800 transparency, soundstage, etc, with instrumental music.  There is much to admire.  I just can't listen for long because that frequency range when reproduced with too much emphasis bothers me. Some might let it pass.  
 
The 650 rolls the top octave, softens transients, fails to fully define bass which is a tad slow, and doesn't flesh out the soundstage very well.  Upgraded cables and de-foaming helped.  However, it is a lovely listening experience.  The so-called forward mids are a tad more forward than my speakers or live, but most headphones have recessed midrange proper.  I find HD650d a refreshingly honest sounding phone, esp for the price.  
 
I am curious to hear the LCD2, or the refresh of the HD800 which I hope eventually will come. 

 

[ANDYACE]

Looking forward in getting my HD650.  I would expect the HD800 be a better phone and it's out of my price range.  I am upgrading from an HD535> HD555 and have been quite impressed over the years with Sennheiser's imaging and comfy feel.  I want to lie in bed at night and enjoy the music experience.  I hope the HD650 will give me that boost from the HD555. Which when coupled with a decent headphone amp, is very enjoyable to watch movies from my laptop and listen to music. Especially considering these phones were around $180AU, i consider an excellent price (and they are quite flexible for being 50ohms).  It is a big jump in price for the HD650 and I am not to sure if they r 4x better than the HD555, but I can't wait. Then there is the x3 jump to the HD800, plus a better headphone amp/dac.
 
 
 

 

[p a t r i c k]

Quote:

more detail means more fatigue

Well more detail does not mean more fatigue! Honest
 
Over emphasised and out of context detail gives fatigue.
 
Audio equipment that provides detail in context is the least fatiguing.
 
I love good neutral audio equipment because it lets the music happen, it doesn't impose some euphony excess upon it.

 

[ardilla]

HD800 is concert hall and a a dry white wine
 
HD650 is jazz club and a rich red wine
 
I have them both and don't know which to get rid of. Probably I'll keep them both....

 

[realmassy]

Quote:

There is no question there are many advantages to the 800... which is why I am so bummed about the damage they (the several units I heard) do to voices and to listening... very fatiguing.  
 
 
I never use any headphone as my reference.  Not even my speaker system, or even better ones, although they can get a lot closer to reality. They can help me become aware of how to listen to aspects of sound, of what is possible, but always second to acoustic jazz, vocals, chamber, and symphony.  
 
I'm a lover of live, unamplified voice and instruments.  I've heard unamplified kd lang from 8 feet away, unamplified Mariza from 3 feet away, unamplified Amanda McBroom from various seats.  No mics.  
 
Voices in the 800 do not sound at all like real voices.  And, I'm just picking one, obvious signal that highlights the, er, highlighted lower treble.  
 
However, it is easy for me to imagine some loving the 800 transparency, soundstage, etc, with instrumental music.  There is much to admire.  I just can't listen for long because that frequency range when reproduced with too much emphasis bothers me. Some might let it pass.  
 
The 650 rolls the top octave, softens transients, fails to fully define bass which is a tad slow, and doesn't flesh out the soundstage very well.  Upgraded cables and de-foaming helped.  However, it is a lovely listening experience.  The so-called forward mids are a tad more forward than my speakers or live, but most headphones have recessed midrange proper.  I find HD650d a refreshingly honest sounding phone, esp for the price.  
 
I am curious to hear the LCD2, or the refresh of the HD800 which I hope eventually will come. 

Nice post!
IMHO no high-end rig (especially headphones) will ever sound like a real event, as it lacks the physical bass impact.
When I listen to my music I just want to relax and enjoying it, and this is what the HD650s do better.
I never listened to the HD800 in a proper setup, but the relaxing, warm signature of the HD650 is perfect for me.
 
And to my ears, the way the HD650s presents the music, organic, blurry for someone, is much closer to a real event.
Listen to a live symphony, in a theatre, and you won't get the same level of detail that you get through headphones. Close your eyes, and you'll listen to a wall of sound, you won't get the same pinpoint accuracy you're used to. Channel separation, air between instruments? they don't exist in a live event! You'll be surprised..."My headphones sound better than this!!"