[davidmiya]

Hmm, I think you guys might be right. Just to see how loud it was I asked my dad to try the phones at my listening level. He said, "whoa, I haven't listened to music this loud since the 80s." When HE thinks it's loud, it must be pretty damn loud. I think it might be safer to take it down about 50-60%. Come to think about it, when I started doing head-fi stuff about a year ago, I had the volume pot usually around 20%. Now it's up near 50%. Yeah, it's only been a year so it's probably not resulting in excessive hearing loss. I think I can still save my hearing down the road if I turn it back down now.

 

[KR...]

Quote:

Originally posted by davidmiya Hmm, I think you guys might be right. Just to see how loud it was I asked my dad to try the phones at my listening level. He said, "whoa, I haven't listened to music this loud since the 80s." When HE thinks it's loud, it must be pretty damn loud. I think it might be safer to take it down about 50-60%. Come to think about it, when I started doing head-fi stuff about a year ago, I had the volume pot usually around 20%. Now it's up near 50%. Yeah, it's only been a year so it's probably not resulting in excessive hearing loss. I think I can still save my hearing down the road if I turn it back down now.

Good for you, 25% if more than enough, unless you have a super loud amp, which you do then maybe 20%. Your ears will adjust and you will be just fine and you will also will be able to listen to music for longer periods of time.

 

[davidmiya]

I just got my Silver Dragon Cable today. I'm kinda upset that it didn't arrive yesterday for our little meet because it really opened up the midrange and increased the detail by a factor or 2 or 3. It feels like the detail is approaching the Stax Omega level of detail, but not quite there.

 

[ServinginEcuador]

I wonder if the bass break up at high volume is due to the lack of sufficient drive voltage that the Omega II demands? Kevin Gilmore designed his amps to give more oomph to the Omegas and such by adding a bit more voltage.

To give a breakdown of how high it goes, here's a list:
SRM-006t - 300v
SRM-007t - 340v
SRM-313 - 350v
KGSS - 400v
Blue Hawaii - 450v

But, the weird thing is that the SRM-717 is also rated at 450v RMS output, making it equal to the Weebl in drive voltage. I wonder if, when pushed hard, something in that amp just can't put out the drive needed to push the cans hard enough. I know KG's amps use a TON of current source transistors, so maybe he designed them to have a considerable amount more drive for those hard demands like you gave the Stax amp.

 

[Vertigo-1]

Well, I think the point is, nobody should ever HAVE to push headphones to such high volume levels. I found it pretty funny when David asked me yesterday if I had ever gotten the Omega II's bass to clip. I mean, that is just SCARY volume levels if you can manage to get the Omega II's bass to clip.

 

[ServinginEcuador]

Vertigo-1,

I don't think you can clip the cans, just the amp driving them. I think Kevin posted alsewhere that it takes more than 580v on the membrane in order to make the voltages shift and the membrane clip. He uses some Koss amp that runs right about 580v of drive voltage on the membrane, and he says it drives the Omegas so loud it isn't funny. If he can push them with that much voltage, I doubt anything else will clip the cans.

See his posts in the thread about Nik's Egmont Signature amp for more complete details. He stated all the above, but more eloquently and succinctly.

 

[Snake]

Quote:

Originally posted by ServinginEcuador I wonder if the bass break up at high volume is due to the lack of sufficient drive voltage that the Omega II demands? Kevin Gilmore designed his amps to give more oomph to the Omegas and such by adding a bit more voltage. To give a breakdown of how high it goes, here's a list: SRM-006t - 300v SRM-007t - 340v SRM-313 - 350v KGSS - 400v Blue Hawaii - 450v But, the weird thing is that the SRM-717 is also rated at 450v RMS output, making it equal to the Weebl in drive voltage. I wonder if, when pushed hard, something in that amp just can't put out the drive needed to push the cans hard enough. I know KG's amps use a TON of current source transistors, so maybe he designed them to have a considerable amount more drive for those hard demands like you gave the Stax amp.

Now that's interesting. My 14S is rated at 400V max - they've reduced the output since then? And, are Omega's truly that hard to drive?! Wow, I really must wonder about what the Stax design team were thinking when they created a can that their amps have a (subtle) problem with.

 

[Tuberoller]

I'm still waiting for a KGSS to use with the OmegaII that I have on hand but I gotta say I'm still puzzled at the whole electrostat thing. Maybe not,I can see how someone who does'nt a have great speaker rig as a reference would think that the Stax are accurate and would like them a lot. I do think they are great phones and that the Stax amps are OK but the bass is so far from what could ever be called accurate I don't think I could ever really fall in love with a Stax system. Like I said,I do understand why lots of folks love them and I would never insult their choices, but electrostats(loudspeakers or headphones) are simply not how God intended audio to be reproduced(that's an analogy,don't take it literally).

Stax do sound very good in the upper frequencies and perhaps "better" than an average dynamic headphone system but "better" does not always equate to accurate. How does a tube lovin',vinyl spinnin' guy like me get the nerve to espouse accuracy over enjoyment? I don't have the nerve and I fully support the efforts of the Stax lovers among us to strive for the sound they enjoy best. I don't like it when the Stax lovers beat us all over the head with "Only Stax get it right" and "Stax are the best" and "you gotta have a KGSS(built by a special builder using skills and a special circuit passed down from the heavens)". That stuff is silly. I like Stax and Grinch's Stax system was indeed killer,but let's keep it realistic guys.

 

[TimSchirmer]

Oh yeah, I forgot. Using 400$ dynamics with a 2000$ amp is the ONLY way to get good headphone reproduction

If you want euphonically colored presentation with boomy impactful bass, then stax arent the answer. If you want transparency and speed with excellent air and phase shifts stax are where its at.

Edit: Tuberoller, I suggest you try them with analog. I really fell in love with the 4040 setup when it was connected to my turntable i had at the time.

 

[Tuberoller]

I was a Stax dealer for a full two years and I've heard Stax with every format there is,including Reel-to-reel and any vinyl rig I could get my hands on(lots). I never said Dynamics was the only way to get good sound reproduction and went out of my way to state that we all have differeing opinions. You know what mine are and they have remained consistent.

 

[Edwood]

Hearing the Omega II's at the last SoCal meet left me underwhelmed by their bass "accuracy". Far from it. I found it boomy and sloppy.

I will reserve final judgement until I hear it with a KGSS or Blue Hawaii.

-Ed

 

[boodi]

Edwood your avatar is kinda weird - i wouldn't imagine you could also change headphones ..


thanks for free lot of loaughs

 

[Canman]

Quote:

Originally posted by Edwood Hearing the Omega II's at the last SoCal meet left me underwhelmed by their bass "accuracy". Far from it. I found it boomy and sloppy. I will reserve final judgement until I hear it with a KGSS or Blue Hawaii.

Ed, Omega II bass is really sloppy until it warms up. It is surely not a headphone for everyone but when the Omega is awake I find nothing sloppy about it. I recommend giving it a second chance.

 

[pigmode]

I love Vert's Omega II system, and if another amp can improve on it, I'd love that even more. I know many disagree, but to my ears the Omegas have a very natural quality to them. If I had not recently taken on an exorbitantly costly new hobby/ lifestyle, I'd have the Staxs here right now.

I don't look too critically at bass when using headphones--it only needs to be good enough and not get in the way. The physics are just not there. The Senn mid-bass hump, however, will corrupt your sense of what certain recordings should sound like.

Edit:
BTW, we really only had one big meet here, and that was the 1st, hosted by Jeremy. It was a great experience, and we did not have an environment that was too distractive.

I have hosted a few get togethers, 1 to 2 persons only, and very music oriented with great and productive discussion sessions as well. The Hawaii community is small.

I'll call for another meet when I return from my trip, Apr 8.

 

[Hirsch]

Quote:

Originally posted by Canman Ed, Omega II bass is really sloppy until it warms up. It is surely not a headphone for everyone but when the Omega is awake I find nothing sloppy about it. I recommend giving it a second chance.

Canman is understating this, IMO. His Omega II's woke up at the last DC meet. They were decent but unimpressive for about six hours (new cans at that time), but after being on all day suddenly came to life. The difference was one of the most dramatic changes I have ever heard in audio. "sloppy" could be descriptive of the early going, but there is nothing sloppy about that headphone once it is fully charged and broken in.

I was hoping to be able to escape buying a pair, based on early results, but will probably spring for a pair sooner or later, after a taste of what they can do. They aren't going to replace my dynamic cans, though.