[Thetaburn]

Phase noise measurements are the most important measurement for an external clock.
I wouldn’t recommend buying speakers without knowing ohm, sensitivity, frequency response.
If a company makes a product it’s not my job as the consumer to figure out its performance.
If they were reputable they would publish it.
I can’t recommend LHY to anyone anymore for the same reason. Even though many here love them, they removed their phase noise measurements because they could not guarantee that it was a correct.

Which entry model Master Clock can you recommend?

 

[m-i-c-k-e-y]

Many here have good experiences w/ LHY OCK-1

 

[Dandion]

The Gustard c16 clock is almost half the cost of c18. Anyone here experienced the c16 clock with the r26 using LAN only without ddc?
Daniel.

 

[camrector]

Which entry model Master Clock can you recommend?

Any measured at -110dBc @1hz is where I would start.

 

[duas2noites]

a 75ohm bnc cable connector is compatible with gustard r26?

 

[BShaw]

a 75ohm bnc cable connector is compatible with gustard r26?

No, 50ohm. Less of them in the wild….

 

[Thetaburn]

Any measured at -110dBc @1hz is where I would start.

On AliExpress, all sellers of the OCK-1 are "advertising" -100dBc @1hz.
This is incorrect?

 

[shogo33]

In the video, it says the difference doesnt show as much through the youtube than real life. For me, the after xc1 clock was better. Piano sounded more real in life.

Yeah.. a good musical test is to listen to the realism of high hats and piano. The tone and decay are where to pay attention at. Using the U18 DDC with its internal Accusilicon clock and external LHY-8 connected, I can easily switch between the two during tracks and hear the differences. The difference is subtle, but for me worth having it in the chain. Later down the track I would probably upgrade to a better clock say one from AfterDark with verified phase noise measurements.

 

[shogo33]

Phase noise measurements are the most important measurement for an external clock.
If a company makes a product it’s not my job as the consumer to figure out its performance.
If they were reputable they would publish it.
I can’t recommend LHY to anyone anymore for the same reason. Even though many here love them, they removed their phase noise measurements because they could not guarantee that it was a correct.

I was a bit gutted to hear about this, but hey, i thought it was too good to be true having a cheap clock with measurements close to the C18 gustard clock.

 

[Jake2]

On AliExpress, all sellers of the OCK-1 are "advertising" -100dBc @1hz.
This is incorrect?

Those specs, not surprisingly, haven't been updated to remove any claimed phase noise stats to match rhe official distributor, Beatechnik who removed any claimed phase noise specs for the two LHY clocks after some independent testing of an OCK-1 unit was found to be well below this. Too expensive to individually test every unit to guarantee specs with a certificate as per Afterdark or Cybershaft, apparently (I'll take em at their word this would've pushed prices up a lot) though a few of us wondered about why a middle road of sample based QA wasn't employed so they could continue to claim X spec but no certs...

https://www.beatechnik.com/lhy-audio-ock-1

Certainty as to <-110db / 1 hz offset phase noise doesn't come cheap. Min USD1,500 for such an Afterdark or Gustard clock (C18, as no spec for the C16 IIRC).

 

[camrector]

On AliExpress, all sellers of the OCK-1 are "advertising" -100dBc @1hz.
This is incorrect?

Yeah.
Well some were correct and some weren’t. The clocks are second hand from various cell towers etc etc. Some performed as expected but many others performed much much lower. Instead of individually testing each device individually, LHY removed the measurements from their page.
These things are all made in a factory and LHY just puts their logo on it. Doubt LHY has stepped foot on the factory floor. They brand and market.

 

[Jake2]

These things are all made in a factory and LHY just puts their logo on it. Doubt LHY has stepped foot on the factory floor. They brand and market.

I’m not sure this last bit is necessarily true* (there was some ref I’ll see if I can find to LHY build), but what is accepted is there was no QA of the oscillators they were sourcing to ensure they all met claimed spec…

*Though the appearance of cheaper AliX units certainly makes one wonder!

 

[Thetaburn]

Yeah.
Well some were correct and some weren’t. The clocks are second hand from various cell towers etc etc. Some performed as expected but many others performed much much lower. Instead of individually testing each device individually, LHY removed the measurements from their page.
These things are all made in a factory and LHY just puts their logo on it. Doubt LHY has stepped foot on the factory floor. They brand and market.

Good information, and thanks for looking out for the community.
For what it's worth, I ask one of the Aliexpress sellers about the QA issue. Their answer was 'We will test it before shipping it out'.

Ultimately, it's ~350 USD gamble. If there are zero SQ improvements or degradation, I could return within 30 days and lose money on shipping.
The certified quality clocks at over 1500 USD, are too pricey as they cost more than the DAC, I am trying to upgrade.

 

[Jake2]

I’m not sure this last bit is necessarily true* (there was some ref I’ll see if I can find to LHY build), but what is accepted is there was no QA of the oscillators they were sourcing to ensure they all met claimed spec…

*Though the appearance of cheaper AliX units certainly makes one wonder!

UPDATE - I knew I'd read it somewhere, couldn't recall where, but I see on each LHY product page on the Beatechnik website they say:

• (LHY is a) Subsidiary brand of Jay's Audio. Crafted and built at the same high quality for Audiophiles
• Designed and hand-built by highly skilled electronics crews by LHY Audio

Still not quite sure how so many units end up on AliX though.

After buying the OCK-1 from Beatechnik I bought the SW-8 and then later the OCK-2 from this AliX vendor that others have bought from: Gzbotolave Store - it was a lot cheaper than buying direct from Beatechnik for these more expensive items, especially if you get an AliX sale.

Reason I have three LHY units is after my really good experience with the OCK-1 (even allowing for phase-gate unfolding a few months later, which was certainly very disappointing as the claimed -110db spec was definitely a big part of its appeal and bragging rights) I got the SW-8 based on some very good reviews (Srajan from 6Moons and the Alpha Audio guys, no claimed PN spec) and then most recently the OCK-2 solely because of glowing user reviews here at Headfi (also no claimed PN spec by this time). The latter two share the same milled aluminium enclosure and high quality power supply sections - they're beautifully built second only in my system to my Denafrips Athena. The OCK-1 is a rather agricultural by comparison. But they've all made satisfying improvements to my system at price points I could justify.

All that said I totally respect anyone else's call to steer clear based on lack of QA/guaranteed spec of their oscillators' phase noise and their egregious claiming of a spec they couldn't back up.

Good information, and thanks for looking out for the community.
For what it's worth, I ask one of the Aliexpress sellers about the QA issue. Their answer was 'We will test it before shipping it out'.

Ultimately, it's ~350 USD gamble. If there are zero SQ improvements or degradation, I could return within 30 days and lose money on shipping.
The certified quality clocks at over 1500 USD, are too pricey as they cost more than the DAC, I am trying to upgrade.

Interesting/slightly amusing the AliX seller's QA response. You should ask for a phase noise plot or where they source them from! But even if you get given a plot, who's to say which unit it relates to.

I'm with you re cost, I'd have never have considered a USD1.5k clock, but now I've had a taste of what better oscillators can do even at the cheaper end of things (incl btw with the Douk U2 pro DDC with standard vs Crystek 957 oscillators) I'm hooked and have succumbed to upgraditis twice already. The next master clock upgrade, if/when it happens, will be an expensive one seeking certainty of a definite performance jump to a <-117db Afterdark or Cybershaft at ~USD3k+.

 

[Brummle]

No, 50ohm. Less of them in the wild….

A shame manufacturers use bnc over f.ex. sma coaxial, which is a lot better in terms of frequency