Aug 2, 2021 at 1:47 PM Post #35,731 of 70,135
I know, it's pricey. I just didn't want the steel because of scratches. Hopefully, I have them this week. Grabbed the Nuratrue buds too. Testing them out today.
Your addiction is impressive. Step 1 is admitting you have a problem. I am of course projecting. Interested in your impressions on the Nuras. The wired BT were interesting to me but it seemed like there were a lotta complaints.
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 1:48 PM Post #35,732 of 70,135
I know, it's pricey. I just didn't want the steel because of scratches. Hopefully, I have them this week. Grabbed the Nuratrue buds too. Testing them out today.
Your addiction is impressive. Step 1 is admitting you have a problem. I am of course projecting. Interested in your impressions on the Nuras. The wired BT were interesting to me but it seemed like there were a lotta complaints.
Are those the mw08s I spy? Do share impressions on sq.
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 1:53 PM Post #35,733 of 70,135
Your addiction is impressive. Step 1 is admitting you have a problem. I am of course projecting. Interested in your impressions on the Nuras. The wired BT were interesting to me but it seemed like there were a lotta complaints.
Seriously. I've got a problem. Tech keeps getting better, then GAS kicks in. The ANC on the Nuras here at home while my father-in-law is singing some song he's trying to learn about 30 feet away from me is working well while I crank some Maiden. Whew. Sound is full, deep bass after you run their personalized sound. Soundstage is wide. You have to raise the volume on an iPhone all the was to get them loud. Fit is great. Using the included foam tips. They're very light and I don't notice they're in. Case is cheap plastic and small. No wireless charging but they're USB-C. I loved the Nuraloops, but these lack all the problems of the Loops and IMO, way better. I'll run them all day and report back if I run into any issues.
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 1:55 PM Post #35,734 of 70,135
Are those the mw08s I spy? Do share impressions on sq.
I don't notice much, if any difference between them and the regular 08. But I do love the case, wireless charging and the feel of the new sapphire shell. Oh, and the included foam tips help with a much better fit in my ears. They may even help with why I'm noticing a difference in sound, yet I'm sure there's no diff between the 08 and 08S. I've got the Nuras and the MW08S on deck all day.
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 2:19 PM Post #35,735 of 70,135
Your addiction is impressive. Step 1 is admitting you have a problem. I am of course projecting. Interested in your impressions on the Nuras. The wired BT were interesting to me but it seemed like there were a lotta complaints.
Apparently the NuraTrue also use the Qualcomm QCC5124 chip which I'm currently listening to on the Monster and as @erockg mentioned you need to crank the volume but for me not all the way up.
ANC is solid, not top tier but very useful. Sound is wide with big quality bass, borderline basshead levels but not a cheap consumer type of bass if it makes sense.
Resolution is above average. Not the best but not bad at all and highs after tweaking are perfect from me as I like sparkle but very sensitive to brightness.
Mind you this is for the Monster since it's the same cheap (and oddly very similar housing shape) I'm suspecting the characteristics have some common ground.

EDIT: I'm not too familiar with the tech and how the chips are being implemented but based on my casual experience with some TWS that have the same chips the sounds signature without tweaking was fairly similar so just take what I say with a big grain of salt! :D
 
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Aug 2, 2021 at 3:11 PM Post #35,736 of 70,135
Just got the following email update from Status. If anybody is still waiting for their shipment, this might be of use:

Screenshot_20210802-120917.jpg
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 3:37 PM Post #35,737 of 70,135
yeah, as nice foams are, in sweaty situations like sports, either i have to take it off and wash them after each exercise, or better not using it altogether.
By the way, do you still have those X12 rubber sleeves from the package? Those are quite nice for sport. We have to take them off when putting it back to the case, but sure a lot easier to take off and clean compared to foams
Yes I still have them...somewhere but I never used them, primarily because they have to be removed for charging as you mentioned and also because they didn't improve the fit much for me, unlike the foams. I seem to remember they were a bit fiddly too.
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 4:51 PM Post #35,738 of 70,135
Cleaned Sony tips are sticking on my Gbuds Pro really well. Just did a 5K run and the GBuds work awesome. They have very little footfall noise, the screens allow me to have ANC on with little to no wind noise almost zero fiddling once in ear, only had to adjust one bud after finishing the 5K due to excess sweat or in that ear.

It was raining a smidge and zero fear since these are IPX7 rated.
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 7:24 PM Post #35,739 of 70,135
Reminds me of the original shaped earbud with that incredibly wide and round shape that never really fit in the ear. And the fabric is like the fabric from the original earbuds that never quite fit in your ear AND constantly came off. Like the ones they gave everyone in computer class in 2002
1627946683647.png
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 7:58 PM Post #35,740 of 70,135
Reminds me of the original shaped earbud with that incredibly wide and round shape that never really fit in the ear. And the fabric is like the fabric from the original earbuds that never quite fit in your ear AND constantly came off. Like the ones they gave everyone in computer class in 2002
1627946683647.png
Game has changed a bit since then and those shells seem really wide. I can safely say those Smabat M2s Pro plop right into my ear and leave absolutely no pressure points. Anywhere. If it weren't for the cable, I wouldn't even know it's there. As for the foams, again, zero pressure points or friction and I still get some pretty good bass and sub-bass.

And these are some of my larger shells, too. They're seriously some fantastic bang-for-buck performers. Based on your past experience, I don't blame you, but might be worth reconsidering.
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 8:01 PM Post #35,741 of 70,135
SBC vs AptX tests:

Many note low sound quality and lack of high frequencies when using the standard SBC Bluetooth codec, which is supported by all headphones and other Bluetooth devices. A common recommendation to get better sound quality is to buy devices and headphones with aptX or LDAC codecs supported. These codecs require licensing fees, so devices with them are more expensive.

It turns out that the low quality of SBC is caused by artificial limitations of all current Bluetooth stacks and headphones' configuration, and this limitation can be circumvented on any existing devices.
Everyone interested in Bluetooth audio, please take part in high-bitrate SBC compatibility testing on various headphones, receivers, stereo systems, or automotive head units.
If the vast majority of devices work with high bitrates, I will make a patch for Android and send it to AOSP and third-party ROMs, and high quality Bluetooth audio will be available to everyone on any headphones and smartphones, regardless of codecs with licensing fees.


Short technical information about SBC codec


A2DP specification v1.2, which was active from 2007 to 2015, requires all decoders to work correctly with bitrates up to 512 kbps:
The decoder of the SNK shall support all possible bitpool values that do not result in the excess of the maximum bit rate. This profile limits the available maximum bit rate to 320kb/s for mono, and 512kb/s for two-channel modes.
In the new version of the specification there is no bitrate limitation. It is assumed that modern headphones released after 2015 with EDR can support bitrates up to 730 kbps.

For some reason, all currently tested Bluetooth stacks (Linux (PulseAudio), Android, Blackberry and macOS) have artificial restrictions of maximum bitpool parameter, which directly affects the maximum bitrate. But this is not the biggest problem, almost all headphones also limit the maximum bitpool value to 53.
As I've already seen in my tests, most devices work fine on a modified Bluetooth stack with a bitrate of 507 kbps, without interrupts and crackling. But such a bitrate will never be negotiated under normal conditions, with stock Bluetooth stacks.

How to test on a PC
High bitrate SBC headphone compatibility test is the easiest to perform on the PC with a Bluetooth adapter. I've prepared Ubuntu image with a modified Bluetooth stack, which can be run as in a virtual machine (by connecting Bluetooth adapter as a USB device inside the virtual machine, it also works with the adapters built into the laptops) or by booting from the USB flash drive. This image uses the following profile: Dual Channel, 8 bands, 16 blocks, Loudness, bitpool 2..41, 44.1 kHz, which provides 485 kbps bitrate.


Why this is important: SBC 328k and 485k vs aptX
Contrary to popular belief of aptX sound quality, in some cases it can produce worse audio quality than SBC with a standard 328k bitrate.

SBC dynamically allocates quantization bits for frequency bands, acting on a "bottom-to-top" basis. If the whole bitrate was used for the lower and middle frequencies, the upper frequencies are "cut off" (silenced).
aptX quantizes frequency bands with the same number of bits constantly, which makes it a constant bitrate codec: 352 kbps for 44.1 kHz, 384 kbps for 48 kHz. It can't "transfer bits" to frequencies that are mostly needed in them. Unlike SBC, aptX will not "cut" frequencies, but will add quantization noise to them, reducing the dynamic range of audio, and sometimes introducing crackles. SBC, on the contrary, "eats the details" - discards the quietest areas.
On average, compared to SBC 328k, aptX makes less distortion in music with a wide frequency range, but on music with a narrow frequency range and a wide dynamic range SBC 328k sometimes wins.

Let us consider a special case, a piano recording. Here's a spectrogram:


The most energy lies in the 0-4 kHz frequencies, and lasts up to 10 kHz.
The spectrogram of the file aptX file looks like this:


Here is SBC 328k:


It can be seen that the SBC 328k periodically completely cut off the range above 16 kHz, and used all available bitrates for ranges below this value. However, aptX introduced more distortions into the frequency spectrum audible by the human ear, which can be seen on the subtracted original spectrogram from the aptX spectrogram (the brighter, the more distortion):


While the SBC 328k has introduced less distortion the signal in the range from 0 to 10 kHz, and the rest has been сut:


Bitrate 485k for SBC was enough to save the entire frequency range, without cutting off the bands.


SBC 485k on this audio sample is much better than aptX in the range of 0-15 kHz, and with a smaller but still noticeable difference - at 15-22 kHz (the darker, the less distortion):


Switching to a high-bitrate SBC, you will get a sound superior to aptX most of the time, on any headphones.

Full post: https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/...y-on-headphones-without-aptx-or-ldac.3832615/
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 10:51 PM Post #35,742 of 70,135
SBC vs AptX tests:

Many note low sound quality and lack of high frequencies when using the standard SBC Bluetooth codec, which is supported by all headphones and other Bluetooth devices. A common recommendation to get better sound quality is to buy devices and headphones with aptX or LDAC codecs supported. These codecs require licensing fees, so devices with them are more expensive.

It turns out that the low quality of SBC is caused by artificial limitations of all current Bluetooth stacks and headphones' configuration, and this limitation can be circumvented on any existing devices.
Everyone interested in Bluetooth audio, please take part in high-bitrate SBC compatibility testing on various headphones, receivers, stereo systems, or automotive head units.
If the vast majority of devices work with high bitrates, I will make a patch for Android and send it to AOSP and third-party ROMs, and high quality Bluetooth audio will be available to everyone on any headphones and smartphones, regardless of codecs with licensing fees.


Short technical information about SBC codec


A2DP specification v1.2, which was active from 2007 to 2015, requires all decoders to work correctly with bitrates up to 512 kbps:

In the new version of the specification there is no bitrate limitation. It is assumed that modern headphones released after 2015 with EDR can support bitrates up to 730 kbps.

For some reason, all currently tested Bluetooth stacks (Linux (PulseAudio), Android, Blackberry and macOS) have artificial restrictions of maximum bitpool parameter, which directly affects the maximum bitrate. But this is not the biggest problem, almost all headphones also limit the maximum bitpool value to 53.
As I've already seen in my tests, most devices work fine on a modified Bluetooth stack with a bitrate of 507 kbps, without interrupts and crackling. But such a bitrate will never be negotiated under normal conditions, with stock Bluetooth stacks.

How to test on a PC
High bitrate SBC headphone compatibility test is the easiest to perform on the PC with a Bluetooth adapter. I've prepared Ubuntu image with a modified Bluetooth stack, which can be run as in a virtual machine (by connecting Bluetooth adapter as a USB device inside the virtual machine, it also works with the adapters built into the laptops) or by booting from the USB flash drive. This image uses the following profile: Dual Channel, 8 bands, 16 blocks, Loudness, bitpool 2..41, 44.1 kHz, which provides 485 kbps bitrate.


Why this is important: SBC 328k and 485k vs aptX
Contrary to popular belief of aptX sound quality, in some cases it can produce worse audio quality than SBC with a standard 328k bitrate.

SBC dynamically allocates quantization bits for frequency bands, acting on a "bottom-to-top" basis. If the whole bitrate was used for the lower and middle frequencies, the upper frequencies are "cut off" (silenced).
aptX quantizes frequency bands with the same number of bits constantly, which makes it a constant bitrate codec: 352 kbps for 44.1 kHz, 384 kbps for 48 kHz. It can't "transfer bits" to frequencies that are mostly needed in them. Unlike SBC, aptX will not "cut" frequencies, but will add quantization noise to them, reducing the dynamic range of audio, and sometimes introducing crackles. SBC, on the contrary, "eats the details" - discards the quietest areas.
On average, compared to SBC 328k, aptX makes less distortion in music with a wide frequency range, but on music with a narrow frequency range and a wide dynamic range SBC 328k sometimes wins.

Let us consider a special case, a piano recording. Here's a spectrogram:


The most energy lies in the 0-4 kHz frequencies, and lasts up to 10 kHz.
The spectrogram of the file aptX file looks like this:


Here is SBC 328k:


It can be seen that the SBC 328k periodically completely cut off the range above 16 kHz, and used all available bitrates for ranges below this value. However, aptX introduced more distortions into the frequency spectrum audible by the human ear, which can be seen on the subtracted original spectrogram from the aptX spectrogram (the brighter, the more distortion):


While the SBC 328k has introduced less distortion the signal in the range from 0 to 10 kHz, and the rest has been сut:


Bitrate 485k for SBC was enough to save the entire frequency range, without cutting off the bands.


SBC 485k on this audio sample is much better than aptX in the range of 0-15 kHz, and with a smaller but still noticeable difference - at 15-22 kHz (the darker, the less distortion):


Switching to a high-bitrate SBC, you will get a sound superior to aptX most of the time, on any headphones.

Full post: https://forum.xda-developers.com/t/...y-on-headphones-without-aptx-or-ldac.3832615/
 
Aug 2, 2021 at 11:00 PM Post #35,743 of 70,135
For those of you who have the Lypertek Pureplay Z7; which bluetooth codec is it running on for you? I know it supports Aptx Adaptive, but there doesn't seem to be many references as to whether or not it is compatible with regular aptx (which my phone does support). If the Z7s can run on regular aptx, I am a happy camper! Cheers
 
Aug 3, 2021 at 1:46 AM Post #35,744 of 70,135
For those of you who have the Lypertek Pureplay Z7; which bluetooth codec is it running on for you? I know it supports Aptx Adaptive, but there doesn't seem to be many references as to whether or not it is compatible with regular aptx (which my phone does support). If the Z7s can run on regular aptx, I am a happy camper! Cheers
Apparently AptX Adaptive is backwards compatible with AptX and AptX-HD: https://www.aptx.com/aptx-adaptive

Unfortunately I don't have anything AptX to connect to, so I don't know which codec(s) the Z7 uses. I'd really like to know to get an idea of what kind of latency to expect, because I'm eyeing the Fiio BTA30 (or it's successor) to connect to my TV audio. It would be great to pull back the curtain and see what's going on behind the scenes.
 
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Aug 3, 2021 at 1:52 AM Post #35,745 of 70,135
These look interesting. 149 on Amazon today and I’ve got 113 in points. The form factor looks awful though. Looks like sq should be stellar. Does Samsung implement aptx adaptive?
Form factor is not stellar, the buds stick out a bit. I guess that's the trade off for a triple driver setup. Not sure about Samsung supporting AptX Adaptive. I'm using AAC on Apple and they sound amazing.
 

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