Going fully Wireless IEMs. Too soon? Or are we there yet?

[howdy]

Dangit!

After I wrote the above I just pulled the trigger on the XM3, because I can try them ASAP with BestBuy curbside pickup when we also go to pick up a corsair mouse same day, and if I don't like it then I can return it locally ASAP, and get a refund before my next credit card statement prints in 2 weeks.

I mostly want the perfect total wireless with a transparency mode (ANC is nice but not mandatory). I can compare their pros and cons to the GBuds+ (slight grainy highs with treble-oriented transparency mode), Jabra 75t (better sounding EQ'd, and transparency mode with fuller frequency), as well as my APP (best transparency and ANC mode, but cheaper sound and come loose more easily), and MTW (great all around sound and fit, except need louder transparency mode).

My MTW and N6P have the best sound, with very different flavors, and if N6P had a transparency mode or MTW had louder transparency mode I'd be done looking and would alternate between both of these the most. However, the N6P are the least comfortable out of the MTW, Jabra, or GBuds (APP feel loose and itchy). I still like the Pamu Scroll that remind me of the MTW but not quite and with less features (no transparency or EQ).

I just hope I don't have the connection issues with sound and the app that I had with WF-SP800N, and that they stay in my ears and are not too big, and that the sound good...

Make sure to give some time, these will grow on you. When I first bought the XM3 I didn't like them either and thought I wasn't getting a seal but I was. I have to mention that I am using Spinfits onine now and for most of the time of use. These are still my favorite of the 7 I own. Don't try to push them deep just put in and give a little downward turn and good to go.

 

[voicemaster]

Curious to know what you think of them. I tried them in my N6s and found them comfortable at first, but uncomfortable after a while listening. I still have them hanging around somewhere but haven't put them on in a while...

It is very comfortable and I am using it for 4 hours straight as I type this. I can use silicone tips on my N6P, but after an hour or so, the build up pressure start to hurt my ear. That's why i really love this tip.

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Got them updated - had to disconnect them from iPhone BT and close the app, then start over. It was nice to already have the software installed and set up from the WF-SP800N that went back.

The fit is a little better than with the WF-SP800N - the SP800 would not seal when using the ear hooks, and if I removed the hooks I could get a seal but they couldn't go in deep enough without the hooks to stay sealed for long. In the past 40 minutes they are still in as tight with the largest tips as when I started (the 3rd largest of the 4 sets didn't seal as well).

The tips are more of a "torpedo shape" than mushroom or olive shape, and so you don't really know how well sealed they are in regards to security or retention until you gently tug on them and they don't move. With the SP800 I could have a seal for passive noise blocking and ANC, but a gentle tug or push on them would cause them to fall out.

(1) The sound with music is about what I remember from the SP800 - not bad, and without the slight dulled or plasticky treble sound of the APP, or metallic sound of the Gbuds+ that can be sometimes sibilant. (What I meant about APP is that cymbal strikes aren't as crisp nor float in the air but sound like a plastic drumstick not wood, and dampen out faster, and trumpets have less bite, while Gbuds+ took it too far the other way).

The highs are smooth, and the bass is similar to my burned in Jabra 75t which after burn-in are not nearly as boomy like they were out of the box (out the box the Jabra were "Woah!"). The mids are more full than the Gbuds+, more like the Jabra 75t. The sound is slightly behind the MTW, and maybe as good as a properly EQ'd Jabra 75t.

(2) ANC is very good, and about what I experience from my APP (which would fall out almost as easily as when using the SP800 without hooks if they get bumped or touched.)

(3) Ambient has more hiss than the GBuds+ and less than the Jabra 75t, but offers a full-frequency option and not just voice-targeted ambient or transparency. I find if I turn Ambient down from 20 to 17 the hiss is much better without losing too much ambient pass through. The ambient at that settings is only slightly louder than the MTW, which is what I was looking for.

(4) They are about as comfortable as my N6P, which means tight in the ear canals if I want a seal - I may not be able to tolerate them for more than 1-2 hours at a time without a little discomfort, but right now at about 40 minutes I'm getting a slight headache from neck tension and want to take them out. I can wear the MTW, Jabra, or Samsung for hours on end with no discomfort.

So, I'm going to rest my ears, and come back to try other tips since they are set up and ready to go.

Make sure to give some time, these will grow on you. When I first bought the XM3 I didn't like them either and thought I wasn't getting a seal but I was. I have to mention that I am using Spinfits onine now and for most of the time of use. These are still my favorite of the 7 I own. Don't try to push them deep just put in and give a little downward turn and good to go.

I want to like them, but if the software is going to be this buggy then I'm not sure I can do that. I got the same crap as with the WF-SP800N.

I put them into my ears, heard "battery fully charged" and then watched a video on Facebook, but after 1 minute I paused to talk to someone. I found the ambient sound was set to 20/20 with voice emphasis (more hissy and thin sounding). So I went into the Sony app and changed ambient back to 17/20 and full range ambient for whenever I'm at "home". I went back to the Facebook video and hit play, and the sound was gone. This all over a 3-4 minute period, with full battery.

I am using an iPhone 11 Pro Max with iOS 13.5.1 and Sony firmware updated last night. Both on the latest firmware.

I checked the the Bluetooth settings and XM3 were still connected, but the app said I wasn't connected. I hit the "connect button" in the app and it says "Cannot connect".

Went into iTunes to double check, and also can't hear anything. So, just as with the WF-SP800N I took them out of my ears and put back in the case, then took them back out and put them back into my ears. They started working again.

I returned the WF-SP800N partly because I said I need to trust my BT TWS to be there for me when I need hands free operation, and so far the WF-1000XM3 have let me down in the first 24 hours. If I have to delete the Sony app and unpair the WF-1000XM3 and start over from scratch I wont be happy. Sure, I'll do the process over again, once if needed, but not on a regular basis like I did with the SP800N.

While typing this listening to Madison Beer "Dead" I thought the sound is nice, but I had THREE 1/2 second audio dropouts with the phone 18" away from my head and XM3 before I could finish this post. The behavior and sound is a lot like the WF-SP800N, with slightly less bass - all they have going for them is that they fit a l But ittle better than the SP800 when I took the ear hooks off those, but without the water resistance.

So, if this happens again I'll unpair the XM3, delete the Sony app, reinstall the app, repair the XM3, and set up my ear shape and adaptive audio control again. But I'm already expecting a fail.

 

[webvan]

I'm waiting for a review sample of the MTW2 but the person that was working in it was furloughed. I didn't try the LP2 because they looked like they would stick out even worse than the Sony WF-SP800N or WF-1000XM3. I can more easily return the XM3 if I don't like them, at the local Best Buy.

Yes the LP2 stick out a bit but they've got wings so they don't fall out like the XM3 as soon as you get moving.

I finally received the Bomaker SiFi II and first impressions are excellent ! For a start they stay put in my ears as I was hoping due to their "meatier" size that allows them to have some contact points inside the ears, unlike the SiFi I (or the SSKs or M5s) that are so tiny that they just float around or "pop out" if you do manage to tuck them in somehow. I can yawn and chew and the seal does not get broken, will have to test them while rindoor my indoor bike to see how that goes. I used the L size "flat" tips and the isolation is great. I'll need more listening but the sound is very pleasing out of the box, good imaging, balanced spectrum, decently pumping bass, nothing annoying for sure.
A few niggles :
- the case is hard slippery plastic, unlike the rubbery feel of the SiFi I case and it's larger too
- they are indeed hard to get out of the case, again due to the lack of rubber on the buds, it's hard plastic
- yes the touch buttons are super sensitive, touch the side of the bud and the music gets paused. I was fine with the actual buttons of the SiFi I.

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

3 hours of continuous usage for you tube videos and music has taken both WF-1000XM3 buds to 50% charge, so in track for the 6 hours promised.

I’m typing as I’m listening to Tidal lossless streaming and I get intermittent audio dropouts every once in a while when I’m typing, and then it’s better after a short burst of dropouts. I haven’t seen that with any other BT earphone I’ve tried - only noticed it with Sony XM3 and SP800N.

 

[RobinFood]

3 hours of continuous usage for you tube videos and music has taken both WF-1000XM3 buds to 50% charge, so in track for the 6 hours promised.

I’m typing as I’m listening to Tidal lossless streaming and I get intermittent audio dropouts every once in a while when I’m typing, and then it’s better after a short burst of dropouts. I haven’t seen that with any other BT earphone I’ve tried - only noticed it with Sony XM3 and SP800N.

I had similar issues on my phone with the xm3, but it is rock solid on my dap using AAC, not so solid on SBC though, and my Android phone doesn't do AAC.

Are you connecting in SBC or AAC?
Most people with iPhones seem to have it rock solid like my DAP on AAC.

I don't use the xm3 with my phone anymore, next upgrade I might go for an iPhone or a more music focused Android phone.

 

[FlowLikeWater]

3 hours of continuous usage for you tube videos and music has taken both WF-1000XM3 buds to 50% charge, so in track for the 6 hours promised.

I’m typing as I’m listening to Tidal lossless streaming and I get intermittent audio dropouts every once in a while when I’m typing, and then it’s better after a short burst of dropouts. I haven’t seen that with any other BT earphone I’ve tried - only noticed it with Sony XM3 and SP800N.

weird, i get similar behavior with nuarl n6 pro, intermittent dropouts in first 20 minutes of listening, but after that consistent connection

 

[bronco1015]

Thanks.
(1) I worry that I'd not be able to get over the size (thick and long), which was an issue for the WF-SP800N for me, and why I haven't tried the Liberty Pro 2 either. And,
(2) I do think if the WF-SP800N were trying to come out of my ears (without the wings) that the WF-1000XM3 will too. They were secure with the wings but with no seal, and the some of the reviews complained about them coming loose, and
(3) I did have Bluetooth cut outs with the WF-SP800N and some of the reviews complained about that too.

I think I need to think about it more.

Having had both the XM3 and l2P, my experience was that the L2P fit much better than the XM3. i think part of it was the way you slightly twist to gethem in place, as well as the nozzle being slightly angled differently than the XM3, plus they come with fins that i found very beneficial. i had the medium fins and smallest tips on IIRC. Only reason i got rid of them was because i got the N6P. But i kinda wish i'd kept them.

 

[bronco1015]

Using wavelet with my mtw2 and I am hearing static distortion. Is that normal? Any fixes? Very noticeable.

yeah it's common with a lot of presets. Regardless which TWE or headphone i use. i basicly only use treble booster and bright EQ settings with that app. If you have the Anbes 350 laying around still, try them on bright setting. For me it made a huge difference in the SQ. Same with my QC35. Already liked listening to both, but with that preset, they both get some welcome changes to their sound signatures.

 

[eiraku]

Having had both the XM3 and l2P, my experience was that the L2P fit much better than the XM3. i think part of it was the way you slightly twist to gethem in place, as well as the nozzle being slightly angled differently than the XM3, plus they come with fins that i found very beneficial. i had the medium fins and smallest tips on IIRC. Only reason i got rid of them was because i got the N6P. But i kinda wish i'd kept them.

I'm one of those people who have very little qualms with the fit of the L2Ps TBH. Sure they're kinda huge but they fit way better in my ears then my old TripFis did for sure.

The XM3s on the other hand, gave me TF10 fit PTSD... or at least the one I tested did. Granted, it was an in-store test and I didn't really get the chance to really tip roll so that's that.

On a other note, my dear ol' mom ended up getting herself a pair of APPs (as an upgrade from her previous Pamu Scrolls)... and they aren't bad at all TBH, at least with a cursory listen. A shame I only rock Androids myself though so compatibility is kinda sorta iffy (not to mention they cost a pretty penny).

 

[Dobrescu George]

I have posted my video review about the MW07 PLUS as well now!

I try my best to compare the GO vs the PLUS version, and I will also add a video about the MH40 wireless soon!

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

I had similar issues on my phone with the xm3, but it is rock solid on my dap using AAC, not so solid on SBC though, and my Android phone doesn't do AAC.

Are you connecting in SBC or AAC?
Most people with iPhones seem to have it rock solid like my DAP on AAC.

I don't use the xm3 with my phone anymore, next upgrade I might go for an iPhone or a more music focused Android phone.

I have my MacBook set to only use AAC, or AptX when available. My iPhone should only use AAC if the ear buds support that, but you can’t adjust the settings like with BT explorer on Macintosh. I’m going to try the XM3 on my MacBook Pro most of the day today, and tip roll too. I know my MTW connect to MacBook Pro with AptX, but I’m not sure what the XM3 will connect with.

weird, i get similar behavior with nuarl n6 pro, intermittent dropouts in first 20 minutes of listening, but after that consistent connection

My N6P don’t ever drop out, and all of my other BT wireless buds are rock solid. However, my first set of N6P had a left earbud that would not connect at all, broken right out of the box. Amazon got a replacement out to me within 3 days

Having had both the XM3 and l2P, my experience was that the L2P fit much better than the XM3. i think part of it was the way you slightly twist to gethem in place, as well as the nozzle being slightly angled differently than the XM3, plus they come with fins that i found very beneficial. i had the medium fins and smallest tips on IIRC. Only reason i got rid of them was because i got the N6P. But i kinda wish i'd kept them.

Part of my concern over LP2 is how goofy they might look being that large. But, the XM3 don’t look too bad, so maybe I’ll try them if I return the XM3. If you search for all my posts on the WF-SP800N around May 21st you’ll see that size and fit was one issue but the software and firmware bugs are what pushed me over the edge.

I'm one of those people who have very little qualms with the fit of the L2Ps TBH. Sure they're kinda huge but they fit way better in my ears then my old TripFis did for sure.

The XM3s on the other hand, gave me TF10 fit PTSD... or at least the one I tested did. Granted, it was an in-store test and I didn't really get the chance to really tip roll so that's that.

On a other note, my dear ol' mom ended up getting herself a pair of APPs (as an upgrade from her previous Pamu Scrolls)... and they aren't bad at all TBH, at least with a cursory listen. A shame I only rock Androids myself though so compatibility is kinda sorta iffy (not to mention they cost a pretty penny).

I always had to wear the TF10 Pro flipped upside down on the opposite ears with the cable at the top and running over my ears. I actually still have them in a box under my bed with about 15-20 other IEM, as momentos of my early journey when I decided my Shure single and dual driver IEM in 2007 weren’t enough. The TF10Pro just had too much midrange suck out for my tastes back then.

And, as for the AirPods Pro, I don’t hate them. I’d rate them close to an 7.5 or 8/10, with anything over a 7/10 being good relative to other wireless, not wired. They don’t feel super secure in my ears due to a shallow fit with either the medium or large tips; where a deeper fit with the MTW and Jabra make me feel much more secure (GBuds+ insertion depth is in between those and the APP). But I’m looking for a 9 or a 10/10.

My Westone W80 on the Westone BT V2 cable are maybe a 9/10 for wireless due to great sound but lowered because the cable gets in the way and they don’t have transparency mode. I want something that sounds just as good, but without wires or bulk and an added transparency mode, and maybe also ANC - that would push it to a 10/10. Note - The Westone BT V1 cable doesn’t have enough juice to properly drive the W80, but it can drive the W40 thru W60 albeit with less detail and space than the V2.

[edited for typos, I hate autocorrect]

 

[jant71]

My Westone W80 on the Westone BT V2 cable are maybe a 9/10 for wireless due to great sound but lowered because the cable gets in the way and they don’t have transparency mode. I want something that sounds just as good, but without wires or bulk and an added transparency mode, and maybe also ANC - that would push it to a 10/10. Note - The Westone BT V1 cable doesn’t have enough juice to properly drive the W80, but it can drive the W40 thru W60 albeit with less detail and space than the V2.

[edited for typos, I hate autocorrect]

Once they fix that Shure TW1 and start reselling it seems that the sound and punch is quite good and it has "environment" mode.

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

Once they fix that Shure TW1 and start reselling it seems that the sound and punch is quite good and it has "environment" mode.

Yeah, and I’ve been trying to plant that little birdie in the ear of Westone about doing a true wireless behind the ear adapter, but right now everyone in the music department is furloughed due to the virus pandemic.

I haven’t heard great things about the MMCX true wireless adapters out there right now. And I still think that a behind the ear adapter will be a pain in the butt when you’re trying to lay down on a pillow or on your side.

 

[HeadphoneAddict]

HERE IS ANOTHER BIG GRIPE FOR WHEN WE HAVE OUR BT EARBUDS PAIRED WITH TWO OR MORE DEVICES.

You take the buds out of the case and put them in your ears to use with your phone, but they connect to your laptop in the other room. Unless it’s an apple BT earbud you can’t connect to them with your phone, until you go into the other room and disconnect them from the laptop first.

When will they allow all BT devices to automatically disconnect from one device when you manually connect from another?

I don’t have an issue with them automatically connecting to the last device, but I do have an issue when you can’t force it to connect to another device without having to either go out of range of the last device or go to the last device and disconnect.