[Mouseman]

Are the super popular Tronsmart Apollo Bold TWS IEMs still worth it? Article by @Aerosphere

https://www.headfonia.com/tronsmart-apollo-bold-review/

Good review. Unfortunately, the company seems to no longer actively support this product. I'd be interested to know if they told Headfonia anything contrary. They have only done one firmware update in quite a while that didn't add any features, and as you noted they haven't even added the ability to do custom EQs. That's very disappointing because they sought feedback here when it was first released, then never really executed any of it. These buds had a lot of promise, but I feel pretty burned by the purchase.

 

[100Pipers]

Picked up the P17's yesterday in London (they sound as good, if not better, as has been widely reported), got Selfridges to reduce a tenner as they where the display unit so paid £339. Went there to buy the rha truecontrol which they have reduced to £199 from £249. Great place to try tws and they have most of the more expensive ones like bose, b&o, klipsch, noble and of course b&w.

 

[jant71]

Syllable already did that years ago with the D9X. i recently changed the battery on my Sabbat E12, and also tried to change the battery of my Tronsmart Onyx Ace. The repair guy told me that currently it's easier to find battery replacement for TWS like those E12 (and other non-stem ďesign), well at least in my country.

that PQ earbuds seem to use molded battery, which i assume can't be opened without ruining the housing.

so for now, if i want longevity on my TWS, i would stick to the non-stem design

More for battery life than battery longevity. Pretty sure that would be the right way to pursue if you are a manufacturer. More about the not having to put in the case and wait by just attaching fresh batteries instantly. Some, but less, want the device to last more than 5 years and swap batteries out after 2 or 2.5 years and keep going. More often they will just want to by the new tech by that time. Those who get bored or are in the hobby compelled to try the new stuff and the keep up with the Jones' type who need to have the latest thing to be with the in crowd. They really outnumber the Longevity crowd so I don't blame them going that way. Not that they did anything really right. More hours straight before needing to swap and sound good and attach a bit more sturdily like push and slight twist with a slotted design. Stem design was also easier. No reason it can't be done with no stem with better design ability than the PQ people or their OEM.

 

[VICosPhi]

Sony WF-1000XM4 will likely have LDAC!!

Lots of technology in such small buds. LDAC, bone conduction to detect when you begin to speak, beam-forming microphones for better audio, 8 hours of advertised battery life with ANC, Speech detection to pause, lower music volume, DSEE engine for better EQ, wind detection when running, IPX4 rating etc. I am gonna try these out for sure...

 

[helmutcheese]

I imagine due to being an official Bluetooth device it has to support SBC, so that would be some battery life as above LDAC+ANC = 8 hours and LDAC - ANC = 12 hours by my reading.

 

[dweaver]

My suspicion in 12 hrs will be SBC or AAC and no NC. I imagine LDAC will kill the battery much like DSEE did on the XM3. Hope I am wrong but that's my suspicion.

 

[helmutcheese]

Yes 12 hours is definitely with no ANC but I cannot remember if they stated that was with LDAC or not but they did not mention other codec support and dropped all AptX etc in the big bother to these (the WH-1000XM4 headphones), I had the XM3's and was not very impressed.

 

[miserybeforethemusic]

Ok, so I caved...Azla's reputation precedes them; couldn't pass up seeing what their TWS offering was capable of. Was already ordering a couple books from the 'Zon, so tossed these in as well. Should be "crystal" clear from the photo, but the size I rolled the dice on were Medium. They are also available in all the in-between sizes from SSS up to L (on MTMT as well, if Amazon ever runs out of stock). I believe the lack of larger sizing past this point would be a reflection of the Korean market; perhaps there's not much demand for anything larger.





Here they are pictured on the ADV M5 and they're honestly fantastic bedfellows. I was somewhat surprised to find their tip surface is a lot tackier than your typical silicone or foam tips, which I imagine is to help with grip inside your ear (which it does insanely well), but the tradeoff is that it'll grip onto whatever dust/hair/lint is floating around the air (or in your ear) until you clean it back off. If this becomes a chronic problem, you could always lick your thumb/forefinger and just wipe the surface of the tip prior to insertion. As always, good ear hygiene is a must with any TWS and can mitigate leaving "friends" on the eartip surface long-term.

Sound-wise, the M5 were already temperamental enough with tips as they really don't seem to like anything with a nozzle that protrudes too much. This is for two reasons:
1. The upper midrange begins to smear and become very sibilant. Anything that produces a more horn-like shape does not suit the M5 well, including the EPro TW00, which up until this point were my favorite tips
2. These fit inside the case more than easily. Due to the more rigid nature of the shroud, you do have to give the M5 a bit more of a tap when putting them in the case, but they will fit afterwards and do make contact with the charging pins. Same goes for the CX400BT and Melomania Touch, which I also tested for case compatibility.

And oh, what a difference in sound they make. Azla's full-size tips (the Sedna, not the XELASTEC) seem to perform a lot of cleanup for those TWS that have a slightly looser bass signature. In the case of the M5, which had a prominent, yet compartmentalized bass (not loose), it seemed to take the bass energy and give it more punch without sacrificing the overall intensity. Perhaps these are the tips the M5 were supposed to have all along, though might have been too expensive to include. The overall shape between the Azla Crystal TWS and ADV's flatter tips have a lot in common regarding shape and nozzle protrusion.



They even do fantastically with the CX400BT, which I have had a beast of a time trying to find aftermarket tips that permitted a good seal, didn't completely mess up the midrange tonality, and even performs a little bit of a treble lift. Unfortunately, I find the CX400BT's treble tuning is already pretty rolled off and the Crystal can't perform miracles, but I do find things neutralize enough just from the tip swap to make these plenty enjoyable for vocal-dominant tracks. They did admirably with The Erised's Desire EP, though I'll readily admit that the M5's extra bass weight (and added control, thanks to the tips) completely upstages the CX400BT on this sort of content:



Finally, I gave them a spin with the Melomania Touch. While they're very temperamental inside the MT's case, the tradeoff with in-ear comfort more than make up for it. Overall change to sound signature is probably the least different over stock compared to any other TWS I've tried with the Crystal, though perhaps there's a slight boost in bass clarity, especially with the upright bass in Track 2 of the EP I linked above. In this case, that's not really a bad thing. If the stock bass signature was too much for you, though, I'm afraid the Crystal isn't going to fix that enough to make a difference.



All in all, I think the Senda Crystal are a fantastic alternative set of tips for the ADV M5 (and the only aftermarket tip I've been able to recommend for the M5 so far), a suitable alternative over the stock tips for the CX400BT, and a comfort/fit upgrade (just not a big sound quality one) for the MT. At their current price of $25 for two pairs, however, don't buy until you're absolutely confident in what size you need. Even I was apprehensive at ordering the Medium, but they seem to be the perfect fit in my ears.

 

[miserybeforethemusic]

Still no Between Pro, still another vague "it'll get there when it gets there" email. I've given Status the ultimatum to either get me a working tracking number by the end of the week or lose the sale entirely.

I have been more than patient, but these guys have to be off their rocker to believe they can string financial backers along indefinitely, making a promise to ship by date X, having date X blow by, and making no meaningful attempt to update their backers when it happens. This is the "beg for forgiveness" model of sales, allowing for complete logistical ineptidute (and that's me being polite, to be perfectly honest), and shouldn't be permitted for any company of any size.

Suffice to say at this point I don't know if you guys are ever going to get a Between Pro review from me since I don't know if I'm ever receiving the product. I can only warn others to avoid backing the project until Status massively corrects course. If you ordered after April, I highly encourage you to cancel and look elsewhere.

 

[Luchyres]

I'm very excited to buy the Tour Pro Plus, having really liked the JBL Club Pro+, but alas, after I add them to my cart and click to go to my cart I'm consistently redirected to eu.jbl.com

https://www.jbl.com/headphones/TOUR-PRO-TWS-.html?dwvar_TOUR-PRO-TWS-_color=Black-AM-Current


If anyone spots them on Amazon or elsewhere, let me know

 

[Luchyres]

I'm very excited to buy the Tour Pro Plus, having really liked the JBL Club Pro+, but alas, after I add them to my cart and click to go to my cart I'm consistently redirected to eu.jbl.com

https://www.jbl.com/headphones/TOUR-PRO-TWS-.html?dwvar_TOUR-PRO-TWS-_color=Black-AM-Current


If anyone spots them on Amazon or elsewhere, let me know

Well, after posting, I was inspired to try again, and after the eu redirect, I re-selected USA as my home country and voila

Ordering! Head's up to any of you who were keeping an eyes out for these that they're looking like they're avail to ship.

 

[DJ XtAzY]

Ok, so I caved...Azla's reputation precedes them; couldn't pass up seeing what their TWS offering was capable of. Was already ordering a couple books from the 'Zon, so tossed these in as well. Should be "crystal" clear from the photo, but the size I rolled the dice on were Medium. They are also available in all the in-between sizes from SSS up to L (on MTMT as well, if Amazon ever runs out of stock). I believe the lack of larger sizing past this point would be a reflection of the Korean market; perhaps there's not much demand for anything larger.





Here they are pictured on the ADV M5 and they're honestly fantastic bedfellows. I was somewhat surprised to find their tip surface is a lot tackier than your typical silicone or foam tips, which I imagine is to help with grip inside your ear (which it does insanely well), but the tradeoff is that it'll grip onto whatever dust/hair/lint is floating around the air (or in your ear) until you clean it back off. If this becomes a chronic problem, you could always lick your thumb/forefinger and just wipe the surface of the tip prior to insertion. As always, good ear hygiene is a must with any TWS and can mitigate leaving "friends" on the eartip surface long-term.

Sound-wise, the M5 were already temperamental enough with tips as they really don't seem to like anything with a nozzle that protrudes too much. This is for two reasons:
1. The upper midrange begins to smear and become very sibilant. Anything that produces a more horn-like shape does not suit the M5 well, including the EPro TW00, which up until this point were my favorite tips
2. These fit inside the case more than easily. Due to the more rigid nature of the shroud, you do have to give the M5 a bit more of a tap when putting them in the case, but they will fit afterwards and do make contact with the charging pins. Same goes for the CX400BT and Melomania Touch, which I also tested for case compatibility.

And oh, what a difference in sound they make. Azla's full-size tips (the Sedna, not the XELASTEC) seem to perform a lot of cleanup for those TWS that have a slightly looser bass signature. In the case of the M5, which had a prominent, yet compartmentalized bass (not loose), it seemed to take the bass energy and give it more punch without sacrificing the overall intensity. Perhaps these are the tips the M5 were supposed to have all along, though might have been too expensive to include. The overall shape between the Azla Crystal TWS and ADV's flatter tips have a lot in common regarding shape and nozzle protrusion.



They even do fantastically with the CX400BT, which I have had a beast of a time trying to find aftermarket tips that permitted a good seal, didn't completely mess up the midrange tonality, and even performs a little bit of a treble lift. Unfortunately, I find the CX400BT's treble tuning is already pretty rolled off and the Crystal can't perform miracles, but I do find things neutralize enough just from the tip swap to make these plenty enjoyable for vocal-dominant tracks. They did admirably with The Erised's Desire EP, though I'll readily admit that the M5's extra bass weight (and added control, thanks to the tips) completely upstages the CX400BT on this sort of content:



Finally, I gave them a spin with the Melomania Touch. While they're very temperamental inside the MT's case, the tradeoff with in-ear comfort more than make up for it. Overall change to sound signature is probably the least different over stock compared to any other TWS I've tried with the Crystal, though perhaps there's a slight boost in bass clarity, especially with the upright bass in Track 2 of the EP I linked above. In this case, that's not really a bad thing. If the stock bass signature was too much for you, though, I'm afraid the Crystal isn't going to fix that enough to make a difference.



All in all, I think the Senda Crystal are a fantastic alternative set of tips for the ADV M5 (and the only aftermarket tip I've been able to recommend for the M5 so far), a suitable alternative over the stock tips for the CX400BT, and a comfort/fit upgrade (just not a big sound quality one) for the MT. At their current price of $25 for two pairs, however, don't buy until you're absolutely confident in what size you need. Even I was apprehensive at ordering the Medium, but they seem to be the perfect fit in my ears.

I haven't been keeping up in this thread, but what are your favorite tips for the MT's so far?

 

[miserybeforethemusic]

I haven't been keeping up in this thread, but what are your favorite tips for the MT's so far?

Either the Final TWS or EPro TW00. Both give a slightly different emphasis on the bass and lower midrange that I enjoy. Can't go wrong with either; get whatever's cheaper.

 

[bladefd]

Either the Final TWS or EPro TW00. Both give a slightly different emphasis on the bass and lower midrange that I enjoy. Can't go wrong with either; get whatever's cheaper.

Are both equally comfortable?

Looks like I would probably need Large for Final type e for tws or medium for EPro TW00. Latter is $5 cheaper on Amazon.

 

[CocaCola15]

Still no Between Pro, still another vague "it'll get there when it gets there" email. I've given Status the ultimatum to either get me a working tracking number by the end of the week or lose the sale entirely.

I have been more than patient, but these guys have to be off their rocker to believe they can string financial backers along indefinitely, making a promise to ship by date X, having date X blow by, and making no meaningful attempt to update their backers when it happens. This is the "beg for forgiveness" model of sales, allowing for complete logistical ineptidute (and that's me being polite, to be perfectly honest), and shouldn't be permitted for any company of any size.

Suffice to say at this point I don't know if you guys are ever going to get a Between Pro review from me since I don't know if I'm ever receiving the product. I can only warn others to avoid backing the project until Status massively corrects course. If you ordered after April, I highly encourage you to cancel and look elsewhere.

Understand your annoyance, completely. Oddly enough, when I came on to check out HF tonight, I had the BPs in my ears and find them sublime, using the large OEM tips. I was an early buyer, $79, as I had mentioned. Damn, though, they just sound soooo nice. Not very specific, I know. But when I compare them to the two sets of CAs Ihave (MT and M1+), they just sound, well, more balanced. No EQ required. Listening to Amazon Music HD on an LG V30, a mix of female vocalists, mostly jazz, and the BPs are knocking me out.

Now, I also have the Status BT-1 on-ear TW phones, which I love and find and amazing value at $49, which is what I paid at the time. I think the Status folks got in over their heads here, but in the end, I think they are worth the wait. No ANC (I can hear the NBA playoffs in the background, time to mute the TV). I am no expert/audiophile, but I have owned a s-load of IEMs in my time, and the BPs make me happy. I would just hang on, not give up. After all, most of those on this thread have plenty of other TW phones to pass the time. Hang in there, I guess is my message. I want someone to tell me I am out to lunch on this pair of TW phones.

The other thing is, check the comments on Indiegogo. A lot of po'd people, no doubt about it. But almost everyone who ends up getting them is more than happy. Not the HF crowd in terms of experience and knowledge, but most are very happy. And there are several youtube reviewers who are on the bandwagon. That's not necessarily a definitive thing, but it is pretty consistent across reviewers. Issue is, can they compete with much more expensive TW phones? I have owned a few, the Sony M3, the Senns, Jabras, Nuarl and a few others, all gone. Keeping the BPs.