[Thenewguy007]

  I must be blind - what material is used for this mod? Out of what did you cut these circles?

Basically any $5.00 roll of foam shelf liner.
They sell them in the kitchen/closest accessory areas in Wal-Mart, Target,, Home Depot, Osh etc...

 

Just cut a small circle of it to fit inside the rubber piece surrounding the driver & put the earpads back on.
There is no downside to the musical spectrum in this.

 

[Thenewguy007]

 
I know the TH 900 has well extended treble, but painful? The HD 800 is the headphone between the two of them that I thought was almost universally excepted to be very bright, whereas the 900 is just bright. I sometimes think that having slightly older hearing is beneficial in that I assume some treble sensitivity is gone. It would be interesting if impractical to have a poll taken in the HD 800 TH900 threads where people voted if the treble was bright/harsh to them and include their age. Sounds dumb I'm sure, but I find myself wondering about age when I read comments about these things.

 
 

Honestly, I think amp/source plays a big factor in whether you will these 2 headphones bright or not. The TH900 sounded bright out of my Sony UDA-1 whereas the HD800 sounded great and could be played loudly with no fatigue. On the Master 11, I found the complete opposite. HD800 bright and TH900 sounding just right.

It's all about synergy in your gear and personal preferences.

 
 
Well the HD800 does have piercing highs as well, just not to the extent of the Fostex TH-900 (or the Beyerdynamics T1).
It's more of an annoyance on the HD800. While on the TH900, it can be so bad for me that female vocals, cymbal crashes & other high pitched instruments can sound straight up painful.
 
I also ran this through a Violectric V200 amp, which signature is considered smooth & on the warm side of neutral.

 

[LSD25]

The sibilance on HD800 never really bothered me, it sounded slightly harsh when I first got them but a little eq-ing fixed it. Ended up doing anax mod too and it was completely gone.
TH900 on the other hand was just piercing at first and I couldn't stand it, had to do heavy EQ to fix it. But over time I guess I got used to the sound signature and it sounds a lot better now, glad I didn't return them.
 
Depends on the recordings too, some sound just plain aweful on TH900 so I switch over to HD800 for them. Its similar with movies too, some movies sound a lot better on 900 than on 800, I noticed it while watching the new Mad Max.
 
Its nice to be able to switch between the two headphones though, they make an excellent pair. Might go for a third kind in future, or get a different amp instead.

 

[fuzzybaffy]

 ^ Yup. Despite the praise I had of the TH-900 the first day I got them, they aren't without their faults, too. Which is why I definitely see myself owning a pair of HD-800 and AKG K812 along with the TH-900 in the future. 
 
Not in the immediate future (

), but in the future nonetheless. 

 

[Mortalcoil]

 
It just got painful to listen to some songs. It made me preferring the HD800 for the majority of songs.
 
It got so bad that I thought why not just do the shelf liner mod.
http://www.head-fi.org/t/631594/fostex-th600-dynamic-headphones/2400#post_11109568
I cut two small circles & put them above the driver & put back the earpads. Took less than 2 minutes for all that.
 
 
 

 
With all due respect TNG007 I cant for the life of me understand how you find the 900 sibilant.  LOL spend a day or two with a Grado 125.
 
IMO (and this is not directed at you) I find it insane that everyone and his brother has some sort of mod for any number of headphones.  Everything from Mac Tac to Persian Carpet to dental floss.
 
I think most of these mods are dreamt up by people who have no idea what the hell they are doing and are merely looking for some sort of recognition, we should name such a thing "Anaxilusism" perhaps.
 
This mod using shelf liner looks as if its designed to castrate or neuter the hell out of the 900.  Placing such a thick piece of material in front of the driver seems insane to me.
 
I am sure the designers at Fostex never had this in mind.
 
Like I said THG007 this rant isn't directed at you but mostly to all the Anax wannabees who dream up these garbage mods.  Like I said earlier when terms such as bright, strident, and sssssssssibilant are thrown around when referring to the 900 I will never understand.
 
Perhaps its a "Synergy" thing lol.
 
The 800 of course is a different story to some degree its a beast that needs some reeling in at times but the 900 is a kind Mistress that needs no such taming IMO. 
 
A little EQ if you like, an amp switch up or a DAC swap maybe yes but not a balls to the wall sound change.
 
These are merely my opinions, not meant to get anyone's shorts in a knot

 

[Mortalcoil]

   ^ Yup. Despite the praise I had of the TH-900 the first day I got them, they aren't without their faults, too. Which is why I definitely see myself owning a pair of HD-800 and AKG K812 along with the TH-900 in the future. 
 
Not in the immediate future (

), but in the future nonetheless. 

Give them some time FB.
 
Oh and strike the 812 off the list ....lol talk about "shortcomings"

 

[stjj89]

 
IMO (and this is not directed at you) I find it insane that everyone and his brother has some sort of mod for any number of headphones.  Everything from Mac Tac to Persian Carpet to dental floss.
 
I think most of these mods are dreamt up by people who have no idea what the hell they are doing and are merely looking for some sort of recognition, we should name such a thing "Anaxilusism" perhaps.
 
This mod using shelf liner looks as if its designed to castrate or neuter the hell out of the 900.  Placing such a thick piece of material in front of the driver seems insane to me.
 
I am sure the designers at Fostex never had this in mind.

 
I haven't designed mods myself, but I've performed extensive mods on my HE-400, HE-560, and TH900, and have owned a modded T50RP (ZMF), and disagree.
 
On the contrary, I think most modders are doing what the engineers behind the headphones do themselves when they design the enclosure of the headphone--play around with materials, chamber dimensions, and other parameters until they achieved the desired tuning of the headphone. While not all modders have access to the sophisticated equipment headphone engineers use to tune equipment, they are pretty much performing the same process with their ears. Moreover, modders don't have to worry if their mods can be reproduced reliable in a factory at scale, or about the costs of the materials involved, so they can potentially better results with tuning than the headphones manufacturers.
 
The shelf-liner mod actually works really well with my HE-560. If it truly was sonically superior, it is entire conceivable that the Fostex Engineers decided not to do something like that for aesthetic or durability purposes.

 

[Sonic Defender]

Seriously, I listen to electronica, trap, DNB, glitch, rock, jazz, and I listen loud. I perceive strong treble with the TH 900, but it is not sibilant or painful. Now it is possible for somebody to be very sensitive to certain frequencies so I suppose if this were the case those individuals could perceive the TH 900 as painful due to this.
 
I do think that objectively the TH 900 can't be characterized as painful, generally speaking; however there are enough people who do post feeling that it is not soft or smooth treble either. As many of you have also done, I have read about the HD 800 for years now, literally thousands of posts, and almost the same for the TH 900. It is almost universally accepted that the HD 800 is very hot in the treble and seemingly that the TH 900 isn't that far off. It doesn't bother me so maybe I could try the HD 800?

 

[pervysage]

 
Give them some time FB.
 
Oh and strike the 812 off the list ....lol talk about "shortcomings"

 
I haven't heard the 812 but from hearing about it I'd say it's more on the HD800 spectrum side of the flagships (as in too similar to be worth buying and having both of them).
 
I already have an HD800 and TH900 and the new ETHER C has been super tempting for a "middle-man" headphone between the 2 that I already own.

 

[Mortalcoil]

 
I haven't designed mods myself, but I've performed extensive mods on my HE-400, HE-560, and TH900, and have owned a modded T50RP (ZMF), and disagree.
 
On the contrary, I think most modders are doing what the engineers behind the headphones do themselves when they design the enclosure of the headphone--play around with materials, chamber dimensions, and other parameters until they achieved the desired tuning of the headphone. While not all modders have access to the sophisticated equipment headphone engineers use to tune equipment, they are pretty much performing the same process with their ears. Moreover, modders don't have to worry if their mods can be reproduced reliable in a factory at scale, or about the costs of the materials involved, so they can potentially better results with tuning than the headphones manufacturers.
 
The shelf-liner mod actually works really well with my HE-560. If it truly was sonically superior, it is entire conceivable that the Fostex Engineers decided not to do something like that for aesthetic or durability purposes.

 
Nothing wrong with a modding community IMO.
 
And I fully understand the desire to experiment but to blindly label all of these mods (some of which are developed by a 16 year old in his parents garage) as "good" or "a game changer" is crazy.
 
It boils down to blind enthusiasm.  As you mentioned stjj89 if the headphone designer meant it to be there it would be there especially in the top tier we are referring to.
 
When any change is made in sound recreation another area in that recreation also changes and not always for the better. 
 
I still believe in Magic Stones though lol

 

[Sonic Defender]

   
I haven't designed mods myself, but I've performed extensive mods on my HE-400, HE-560, and TH900, and have owned a modded T50RP (ZMF), and disagree.
 
On the contrary, I think most modders are doing what the engineers behind the headphones do themselves when they design the enclosure of the headphone--play around with materials, chamber dimensions, and other parameters until they achieved the desired tuning of the headphone. While not all modders have access to the sophisticated equipment headphone engineers use to tune equipment, they are pretty much performing the same process with their ears. Moreover, modders don't have to worry if their mods can be reproduced reliable in a factory at scale, or about the costs of the materials involved, so they can potentially better results with tuning than the headphones manufacturers.
 
The shelf-liner mod actually works really well with my HE-560. If it truly was sonically superior, it is entire conceivable that the Fostex Engineers decided not to do something like that for aesthetic or durability purposes.

I concur, at least theoretically I can concur. I used to feel that much of this modding was likely a bunch of self-deluding people mostly having fun. While I'm sure some mods are ineffective, others might be actually negative, there is reason to believe that some mods are actually very effective. As you said, a great deal of the tuning after the driver is selected is dampening of the driver, the chamber and the interactions of the two. So to me it stands to reason that a person could achieve effective sound dampening simply by ear and with common materials. Ultimately the final designs are tuned by ears in conjunction with measurement devices and computer modelling. I won't assume all mods are good, but it makes perfect sense to me that some could be.​

 

[stjj89]

   
Nothing wrong with a modding community IMO.
 
And I fully understand the desire to experiment but to blindly label all of these mods (some of which are developed by a 16 year old in his parents garage) as "good" or "a game changer" is crazy.
 
It boils down to blind enthusiasm.  As you mentioned stjj89 if the headphone designer meant it to be there it would be there especially in the top tier we are referring to.
 
When any change is made in sound recreation another area in that recreation also changes and not always for the better. 
 
I still believe in Magic Stones though lol

 
 

  I concur, at least theoretically I can concur. I used to feel that much of this modding was likely a bunch of self-deluding people mostly having fun. While I'm sure some mods are ineffective, others might be actually negative, there is reason to believe that some mods are actually very effective. As you said, a great deal of the tuning after the driver is selected is dampening of the driver, the chamber and the interactions of the two. So to me it stands to reason that a person could achieve effective sound dampening simply by ear and with common materials. Ultimately the final designs are tuned by ears in conjunction with measurement devices and computer modelling. I won't assume all mods are good, but it makes perfect sense to me that some could be.​

 
Yeah, I wouldn't immediately assume mods are necessarily good, and be wary of the hype-train that is so often started here on head-fi (not just for mods). However, measurements and/or the impressions of fellow head-fiers can give you a good idea about whether the mods will yield better sound for you. If and when you finally do them, you should definitely judge the benefits for yourself
 

Originally Posted by Mortalcoil /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
...if the headphone designer meant it to be there it would be there especially in the top tier we are referring to.

 
This I actually disagree with. Like I was saying before, there are some tweaks that seem simple and obvious to modders that headphone manufacturers might not have put in there because of concerns over production techniques, consistency, or even aesthetics. The shelf-liner mod works well for a lot of headphones, but I can totally imagine that many manufacturers won't even consider such a mod because of how weird it looks. Another possibility is that the engineers just didn't think of it. Jerg's jergpad mods on the HiFiMAN HE400/HE500  are a great example of this--Dr. Fang actually incorporated his velour-top, peforated pleather design into the refreshed HiFiMAN lineup.

 

[Mortalcoil]

 
I haven't heard the 812 but from hearing about it I'd say it's more on the HD800 spectrum side of the flagships (as in too similar to be worth buying and having both of them).
 
I already have an HD800 and TH900 and the new ETHER C has been super tempting for a "middle-man" headphone between the 2 that I already own.

 
 
Agreed...If your going to jump in headfirst into something new especially after living with the 900 and 800 I would make it really special and shoot for something really exotic and sweet sounding (not the Ether though lol, you know something really worth having).
 
Choices are many ...I have been reading up on the new Pioneer SE-Master 1.  Interesting headphone, hand built in Japan by one man apparently.
 
I'm just learning about it myself but might be a promising prospect.

 

[Mortalcoil]

 
This I actually disagree with. Like I was saying before, there are some tweaks that seem simple and obvious to modders that headphone manufacturers might not have put in there because of concerns over production techniques, consistency, or even aesthetics. The shelf-liner mod works well for a lot of headphones, but I can totally imagine that many manufacturers won't even consider such a mod because of how weird it looks. Another possibility is that the engineers just didn't think of it. Jerg's jergpad mods on the HiFiMAN HE400/HE500  are a great example of this--Dr. Fang actually incorporated his velour-top, peforated pleather design into the refreshed HiFiMAN lineup.

 
However when you are dealing with the top tier in headphone tech and production I still don't feel its merely an oversight on the part of the manufacturer, more so that its not required or desirable in what type of sound they are striving for.
 
Its no biggie really, this type of discussion is what makes this community and hobby so interesting and fresh.
 
We can both agree at least that the 900 is one hell of a headphone.
 
Now let me get back to my Magic Stone placement.

 

[Thenewguy007]

  This mod using shelf liner looks as if its designed to castrate or neuter the hell out of the 900.  Placing such a thick piece of material in front of the driver seems insane to me.
 
I am sure the designers at Fostex never had this in mind.
 
Like I said THG007 this rant isn't directed at you but mostly to all the Anax wannabees who dream up these garbage mods.  Like I said earlier when terms such as bright, strident, and sssssssssibilant are thrown around when referring to the 900 I will never understand.

 
The shelf liner is 50% soft foam & 50% holes, so the sound goes through fine, I didn't notice the sound being veiled or lowered at all. It just dampens the highs.
 
As for what the designers had in mind, they probably had in mind using the nearly $2,000 headphones with equally expensive amplifiers & DAC sources.
I'm using equipment that is worth north of just a grand & the treble is not even close to being tamed on them.
 
It's not just this, other TOTL headphones have been reported to have the same troubles as well.
The HD700, K812, T1 etc.. Just unbearable (to my ears) to listen to spiky, high frequency sounds on them.
 
Only the dark headphones like the Audeze or some of the Hifiman don't seem to exhibit it.