[Chs177]

Hey guys, some questions

1) do they need an amp?
2) How are they for gaming?
3 do they have good mids? And how is detail?

Hey,
1) Yes
2) Don't care at all because I'm not playing at all
3) Yes, sure. Details are fantastic for closed back headphones but with good DAC and amp.
 
Happy NY!

 

[Sweetmeat]

TWrek you could be right, 1/8 might be correct, certainly more desirable than 1/4. But NewAvGuy is banned here for a reason. Still, I believe lowest impedance is the best, that's why I like Burson amps at 1 ohm. But others will disagree.
 
Gamingmusiclove, why would you spend $700 on a set of headphones and not give them a good amp? Here's an introduction, it claims 1/10 impedance is best:
 
http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/ultimate-headphone-guide-articles-what-headphone-amplifier-and-why-do-i-need-one
 
I would never waste a really nice set of headphones on gaming. But the TH600 has addressed the lack of midrange inherent in its predecessors. If you want really good midrange you will need to install the Lawton dampening kit. Detail is good maybe too good, since there are a lot of mods aimed at reducing treble.

 

[Gamingmusiclove]

TWrek you could be right, 1/8 might be correct, certainly more desirable than 1/4. But NewAvGuy is banned here for a reason. Still, I believe lowest impedance is the best, that's why I like Burson amps at 1 ohm. But others will disagree.

Gamingmusiclove, why would you spend $700 on a set of headphones and not give them a good amp? Here's an introduction, it claims 1/10 impedance is best:

http://www.innerfidelity.com/content/ultimate-headphone-guide-articles-what-headphone-amplifier-and-why-do-i-need-one

I would never waste a really nice set of headphones on gaming. But the TH600 has addressed the lack of midrange inherent in its predecessors. If you want really good midrange you will need to install the Lawton dampening kit. Detail is good maybe too good, since there are a lot of mods aimed at reducing treble.

You might misunderstood me. This will be allrounder headphones. I want to use them for all my needs, and may be my final upgrade. Gaming is just one of the things i will use them for.

Also, i would obviously give them an amp (need recs on this one). Just that the los impedance sounded weird for me. Right now, im looking for a headphone with the best mids in the sub-600$ range. There are many other things im taking in count but mids, detail and (if possible) soundstage.

 

[Sweetmeat]

TH600 aren't known for mids, they are known for deep bass and fun U shaped FR. For this price you could buy an ortho like HE-500 for under $600. I love my orthos and they are a beast with mids.
 
Unfortunately the orthos may not be loud enough unamped from a portable or computer, if that's what you need. Personally I believe the TH600s have plenty of mids especially after the Lawton mod. And I didn't mean to imply they should never be played unamped from a portable or computer. The TH600s still sound great, just not as great.

 

[The Life]

Hey guys, some questions

1) do they need an amp?
2) How are they for gaming?
3 do they have good mids? And how is detail?

1) No. They have an impedance of 25 ohms and a sensitivity of 94 db/whatever. You could double the impedance and stil not "need" an amp.
2) I use them for gaming and they are great. They are relatively open for a closed-back hp and have a spacious sound, precise placement, and great detail retrieval, which makes for great "3d" sound, especially in FPSs.
3) Yes and no. The mids are further back than the highs and lows but they are, in and of themselves, very good.

 

[Gamingmusiclove]

TH600 aren't known for mids, they are known for deep bass and fun U shaped FR. For this price you could buy an ortho like HE-500 for under $600. I love my orthos and they are a beast with mids.

Unfortunately the orthos may not be loud enough unamped from a portable or computer, if that's what you need. Personally I believe the TH600s have plenty of mids especially after the Lawton mod. And I didn't mean to imply they should never be played unamped from a portable or computer. The TH600s still sound great, just not as great.

I was thinking to buy something like a he400i with an asgard 2. I asked the amp queston because i don't know if they are exactly needed. Either way, thanks

 

[plakat]

The fact that the iphone 6 has so many apps running in the background does not make it the ideal player, there is a distortion when too much it running in the background (in this respect, that's why Android players are better when made by Astell and Kern and Sony etc, since they allow apps to be forces closed permanently).

 
Actually its the other way round, iOS is much stricter with background activity (i.e. suspending not-foreground apps) than Android. Nevertheless neither should have problems unless they are really strained. And you'll hear that loud and clear by skipping/clicks, its not subtle.
 

  TWrek you could be right, 1/8 might be correct, certainly more desirable than 1/4. But NewAvGuy is banned here for a reason. Still, I believe lowest impedance is the best, that's why I like Burson amps at 1 ohm. But others will disagree.

 
Yes, 1/8 is the rule of thumb. Still it depends a lot on the headphone in question, some are voiced for higher output impedance (like Beyerdynamic), some just don't mind due to their rather flat impedance curve (magnetostats being the extreme in that regard) and just loose power (i.e. an unnecessarily large part of the total amp output is burned in its output impedance).
 
I've had good results driving the T90 and the T1 with the A2 using its 100Ohm output impedance setting, most other headphones do better with near-0 values. The Fostex is rather simple in that regard while some in-ears with multiple BA-drivers can be a disaster with high-output-impedance amps.

 

[Sweetmeat]

plakat you are right about IEMs, my TG334s sound like crap when driven by my HiFiMan HM-801 at 8 ohms out. Turns out it is much better driven by my iBasso DX90 at .25 ohms out. Here is the TG334 impedance curve:

 
When driven by a high impedance source, the TG334 FR assumes the shape of the impedance curve, in this case an extreme bump at 2-4 KHz. However the TH600 has a much smoother impedance curve and is much more tolerant of high impedance sources.
 
http://www.innerfidelity.com/images/FostexTH600.pdf

 

[DizzyD]

Guys
 
I recently auditioned the Sony Z7 and really like the pads on it. Besides Lawton angle pads, are there any other alternatives out them to replace TH600 ones to a fuller ones? 
 
Thanks

 

[Sweetmeat]

I hear Stax SR-007 pads work well, plus they are no more expensive than Lawton.

 

[zolkis]

I tried to make the 007 pads work on the TH900 in vain. They so sound more open but the bass is gone. I also tried other pads. I also tried the Lawton mod and discarded it in the end. Thick pads like Audeze don't work, they make the sound hollow, dark and muddy. I don't know the Lawton pads, but they are the thick type, bad omen for me. The best and cheapest solution was to order replacement pads for the TH600 (same as the TH900, order from local dealer), and do the mods I described earlier in the TH900 thread:
- replace the stock pad foam with carbon foam; this makes the biggest change;
- replace the foam dampers with 5 mm 100% wool felt dampers, 73/48 mm; depending on the felt make, this makes the mids wonderful and the bass with more body
- halve the polyfill amount in the cups (for the TH900; I don't recommend that for the TH600).
This made the TH900 sound like a veil lifted off: deeper and more transparent bass, better microdynamics, much better midrange, same heights, big sound stage. A game over headphone.

 

[teofilrocks]

  I tried to make the 007 pads work on the TH900 in vain. They so sound more open but the bass is gone. I also tried other pads. I also tried the Lawton mod and discarded it in the end. Thick pads like Audeze don't work, they make the sound hollow, dark and muddy. I don't know the Lawton pads, but they are the thick type, bad omen for me. The best and cheapest solution was to order replacement pads for the TH600 (same as the TH900, order from local dealer), and do the mods I described earlier in the TH900 thread:
- replace the stock pad foam with carbon foam; this makes the biggest change;
- replace the foam dampers with 5 mm 100% wool felt dampers, 73/48 mm; depending on the felt make, this makes the mids wonderful and the bass with more body
- halve the polyfill amount in the cups (for the TH900; I don't recommend that for the TH600).
This made the TH900 sound like a veil lifted off: deeper and more transparent bass, better microdynamics, much better midrange, same heights, big sound stage. A game over headphone.

What didn't you like about the Lawton mod kit? I just picked up the TH600 with the HeadRoom sale, and I'm curious about the Lawton kit, as well as the angled pads. 

 

[zolkis]

What didn't you like about the Lawton mod kit? I just picked up the TH600 with the HeadRoom sale, and I'm curious about the Lawton kit, as well as the angled pads. 

 
The basic Lawton mod does work with the stock TH900, in taming the bass overhang, which is its primary objective, so you get what you pay for.
However, I felt it was suboptimal solution, less extended, with smaller sound stage and muffled to a certain extent when compared to my full mod.
In my experience angled pads in general just increase the V, or rather U frequency response of the stock TH900, and makes the sound more hollow. What I wanted was better midrange, so you could say my objective was different. Yet I also got a deeper, effortless bass and larger sound stage.
It is possible that the Lawton angle pads work well with the Lawton cups, I have not tried that combination.

 

[teofilrocks]

 
The basic Lawton mod does work with the stock TH900, in taming the bass overhang, which is its primary objective, so you get what you pay for.
However, I felt it was suboptimal solution, less extended, with smaller sound stage and muffled to a certain extent when compared to my full mod.
In my experience angled pads in general just increase the V, or rather U frequency response of the stock TH900, and makes the sound more hollow. What I wanted was better midrange, so you could say my objective was different. Yet I also got a deeper, effortless bass and larger sound stage.
It is possible that the Lawton angle pads work well with the Lawton cups, I have not tried that combination.

Hmm. Well, I doubt I'll want more treble and less mids. But I'll just have to wait until the TH600 comes in and see how I like it stock. Hopefully I'll be satisfied just the way it is and put any Lawton money into whatever my next dac/amp will be.

 

[zolkis]

Treble stays the same with all these mods. My term "extended" was likely the culprit, I meant less extended in the bass. Angled pads increase cave effect, make mids more distant, but treble stays the same. The wool felt dampers do actually slightly change the treble, it becomes less grainy, which you notice only in comparison. The increase in mids will make background instruments more noticeable, and in general improves voices, instruments, balance, everything. It won't become a Stax Omega, but better than the stock version.