[ttran946]

I finally got to my other planar phones (Hifiman He-6, X V2, Ether C Flow 1.1, ZMF Blackwood SE, Smeggy Thunderpants, Mayflower V3, T20RP MK III) and to my Elears and my Th-900, (have owned LCD-2 and Monolith M1060 with all mods applied, Stax Sr-007 MK I and Sr-001 driven by SRM-717, AKG K-1000 and Sennheiser 800s and happily got rid of them). It was quite an experience. I also tried the Mayflower foam vent hole block mod.

To make the story short if I had to keep only one for life in an exotic island it would still be the T60 with ZMF pads or to save money the stock T20RP MK III.

1)They play all genres with the exception of electronic, beautifully (meaning the trade between fun and resolution is perfect for me)
2) Will handle any DSP software better than anything else.
3) Reliability, head, and shoulders above hideously expensive flagships, will last forever.
4) Price.
5) Common sense engineering no-nonsense Focal Technology (I will explain this in another post)
6) Can be fine tuned through a huge variety of mods, many of which are easily performed.
7) Can be vastly improved (soon I will show you how)
8) Better comfort than many flagships.
9) On the negative side "Why Fostex has not done so all along and send everybody either home or back to the design board,
and drive the prices back down to where they ought to be???.

I can't wait to hear your more detailed description of your mods.

Which ZMF pads did you end up with? I actually just took my ZMF pads back off and replaced it with the stock pads. The ZMFs are so comfy, but I thought they really degraded the sound quality quite a bit. I had to open up all the bass vents and even had to take out the stock baffle ring that came in the headphones in order to reduce the bass to a point where it wasn't boomy and uncontrolled, although even with this is sounded a little uncontrolled. I also felt like the overall sound quality in terms of resolution and precision was decreased by moving the driver so far away from my ear with the ZMF. I feel like fostex wanted these to be detailed with good resolution for the price range and they knew they had to put the driver as close to your ear as possible to achieve this with the small driver. I was considering trying to add some cotton to the inside of the cups to use with the pads to try to get the bass situation under control. I really wish I liked the sound with the pads more as they look amazing and are like pillows. That being said, if you have a big head the clamping is much stronger because of the thicker pads which could make these uncomfortable for some. I don't know if I could recommend the ZMF pads without figuring out some additional mods to retain sound quality with them.

 

[kintsaki]

FQUOTE="ttran946, post: 14642158, member: 456448"]I can't wait to hear your more detailed description of your mods.

Which ZMF pads did you end up with? I actually just took my ZMF pads back off and replaced it with the stock pads. The ZMFs are so comfy, but I thought they really degraded the sound quality quite a bit. I had to open up all the bass vents and even had to take out the stock baffle ring that came in the headphones in order to reduce the bass to a point where it wasn't boomy and uncontrolled, although even with this is sounded a little uncontrolled. I also felt like the overall sound quality in terms of resolution and precision was decreased by moving the driver so far away from my ear with the ZMF. I feel like Fostex wanted these to be detailed with good resolution for the price range and they knew they had to put the driver as close to your ear as possible to achieve this with the small driver. I was considering trying to add some cotton to the inside of the cups to use with the pads to try to get the bass situation under control. I really wish I liked the sound with the pads more as they look amazing and are like pillows. That being said, if you have a big head the clamping is much stronger because of the thicker pads which could make these uncomfortable for some. I don't know if I could recommend the ZMF pads without figuring out some additional mods to retain sound quality with them.[/QUOTE]

I am beginning to suspect that something may be wrong here. I say this because you may be the only one that finds the bass totally
out of control and bleeding into the mids. I have all the ZMF pads and none of them is causing problems, not even when
used on the T20 RP MkIII. Could it be that your ears are not going all the way inside the pads next to the driver? ZMF pads
increase both soundstage and bass. Is this your only pair? could it be damaged? Your complaints are not in agreement with
your review on the 2nd week you had them when you wrote it. But because you like the Hifiman there is also the possibility you
listen differently than me. Hifiman has a model of the week in their effort to figure out how to get the midrange right and they keep
trying. Many people like them and it is very natural that these people would not like the Fostex.

What kind of music are you listening to? are you a musician? do you like the Senns? what is behind them in the line to your source
( amp, DAC, purifier) are you optically or USB connected to the source, there are so many parameters,
how often to do you attend live performances?
Have you read my post on how to listen to the music and the other 9 or 10 clips that this man made on how to listen to the music?
I don't know what to say, there was another member here and we became friends that did not like the T60 but he did not have such
a serious problem with the bass. The most probable thing is bad drivers but even this, I have yet to see a Fostex fail and every day
I hear of failures on the other guys. I just don't know what is causing the problem with the bass.

Mr.Speakers, Smeggy, Zack (ZMF), Mod house (Argon), Mayflower, LFF, Talos all started a successful business using RP's not to mention
Headfonia that is raving about them, even though they sell Audigy and Hifiman (can't make money from a 150 $ set).

As far as my feature mods are concerned you will not like them because they will retain the RP (regular phase) singature of the
Fostex which is absolutely what made them famous and popular and no other manufacturer has tried to duplicate
(more on that at a later post).

 

[ttran946]

FQUOTE="ttran946, post: 14642158, member: 456448"]I can't wait to hear your more detailed description of your mods.

Which ZMF pads did you end up with? I actually just took my ZMF pads back off and replaced it with the stock pads. The ZMFs are so comfy, but I thought they really degraded the sound quality quite a bit. I had to open up all the bass vents and even had to take out the stock baffle ring that came in the headphones in order to reduce the bass to a point where it wasn't boomy and uncontrolled, although even with this is sounded a little uncontrolled. I also felt like the overall sound quality in terms of resolution and precision was decreased by moving the driver so far away from my ear with the ZMF. I feel like Fostex wanted these to be detailed with good resolution for the price range and they knew they had to put the driver as close to your ear as possible to achieve this with the small driver. I was considering trying to add some cotton to the inside of the cups to use with the pads to try to get the bass situation under control. I really wish I liked the sound with the pads more as they look amazing and are like pillows. That being said, if you have a big head the clamping is much stronger because of the thicker pads which could make these uncomfortable for some. I don't know if I could recommend the ZMF pads without figuring out some additional mods to retain sound quality with them.

I am beginning to suspect that something may be wrong here. I say this because you may be the only one that finds the bass totally
out of control and bleeding into the mids. I have all the ZMF pads and none of them is causing problems, not even when
used on the T20 RP MkIII. Could it be that your ears are not going all the way inside the pads next to the driver? ZMF pads
increase both soundstage and bass. Is this your only pair? could it be damaged? Your complaints are not in agreement with
your review on the 2nd week you had them when you wrote it. But because you like the Hifiman there is also the possibility you
listen differently than me. Hifiman has a model of the week in their effort to figure out how to get the midrange right and they keep
trying. Many people like them and it is very natural that these people would not like the Fostex.

What kind of music are you listening to? are you a musician? do you like the Senns? what is behind them in the line to your source
( amp, DAC, purifier) are you optically or USB connected to the source, there are so many parameters,
how often to do you attend live performances?
Have you read my post on how to listen to the music and the other 9 or 10 clips that this man made on how to listen to the music?
I don't know what to say, there was another member here and we became friends that did not like the T60 but he did not have such
a serious problem with the bass. The most probable thing is bad drivers but even this, I have yet to see a Fostex fail and every day
I hear of failures on the other guys. I just don't know what is causing the problem with the bass.

Mr.Speakers, Smeggy, Zack (ZMF), Mod house (Argon), Mayflower, LFF, Talos all started a successful business using RP's not to mention
Headfonia that is raving about them, even though they sell Audigy and Hifiman (can't make money from a 150 $ set).

As far as my feature mods are concerned you will not like them because they will retain the RP (regular phase) singature of the
Fostex which is absolutely what made them famous and popular and no other manufacturer has tried to duplicate
(more on that at a later post).[/QUOTE]


I disagree with you pretty much entirely. You seem to keep assuming I don't have experience (offering your videos haha, which I did watch just to amuse myself) but your assumption is wrong. I pretty much have ran every genre through these cans for extended hours of listening thus far. I compared them specifically to HiFi man because they are the same price and both planar. I have other headphones/monitors/speakers to reference as well.

You also seem to assume that I don't like them. Which I do. The bass is in control without any mods (or with the bass vent mod) it just doesn't have the volume and detail as I would like. I want others to know if that is what they are looking for to shop somewhere else.

I am saying ZMF degrades the overall sound quality as I hear it. You are getting offended as if you are making money off of the sales haha. That is my experience, as you know everyone hears and perceives differently. When I am saying it is out of control I am basing it on other head to head comparisons coming through my same rig. I know when precision and accuracy is lost when I make a change compared to when I have not in every post I have made and that is what I am reporting hearing. Honestly some of the mods you recommended like the Mayflower ring is a blatantly terrible suggestions as any fool can hear how poorly it sounds afterwards. I am waiting to see if someone else chimes in on this mod at which point I could stand to be corrected if someone somehow would find that pleasurable despite what I am sure is actually a measurable loss in sound quality. The additional suggestion of pealing the gray part off of the back of the ring suggest you don't even understand how the mod works, as it pretty much only has to do with the bass vents.

It's important to report my experience even if it is negative as not doing so is exactly how you get run away gloat fests on forums about headphones and people spending money on unnecessary mods that only hinder their sound quality or buying a pair of cans they don't like because they only see the good side of things. I like to weight the negatives with the positives when I do a review of something which I think I have done fairly in every post. No need to to my experience personally though, as it is just like my opinion...man.

 

[kintsaki]

I disagree with you pretty much entirely. You seem to keep assuming I don't have experience (offering your videos haha, which I did watch just to amuse myself) but your assumption is wrong. I pretty much have ran every genre through these cans for extended hours of listening thus far. I compared them specifically to HiFi man because they are the same price and both planar. I have other headphones/monitors/speakers to reference as well.

You also seem to assume that I don't like them. Which I do. The bass is in control without any mods (or with the bass vent mod) it just doesn't have the volume and detail as I would like. I want others to know if that is what they are looking for to shop somewhere else.

I am saying ZMF degrades the overall sound quality as I hear it. You are getting offended as if you are making money off of the sales haha. That is my experience, as you know everyone hears and perceives differently. When I am saying it is out of control I am basing it on other head to head comparisons coming through my same rig. I know when precision and accuracy is lost when I make a change compared to when I have not in every post I have made and that is what I am reporting hearing. Honestly some of the mods you recommended like the Mayflower ring is a blatantly terrible suggestions as any fool can hear how poorly it sounds afterwards. I am waiting to see if someone else chimes in on this mod at which point I could stand to be corrected if someone somehow would find that pleasurable despite what I am sure is actually a measurable loss in sound quality. The additional suggestion of pealing the gray part off of the back of the ring suggest you don't even understand how the mod works, as it pretty much only has to do with the bass vents.

It's important to report my experience even if it is negative as not doing so is exactly how you get run away gloat fests on forums about headphones and people spending money on unnecessary mods that only hinder their sound quality or buying a pair of cans they don't like because they only see the good side of things. I like to weight the negatives with the positives when I do a review of something which I think I have done fairly in every post. No need to to my experience personally though, as it is just like my opinion...man.

I am very sorry that my last post has upset you/offended you/patronized you or whatever. Frankly. And I really want to apologize to you and to try to correct this.
I have agreed, liked and congratulated you for your previous posts. I even said that I learned from you and I became confident on your mod that you suggested that is cheap and easy for everyone to perform and does not require the ZMF pads, would really work (unfortunately I failed to state that I tried it and did confirm your findings, sorry for that).

I like you believe that statements are just opinions, and it just so happens that I agree with most of your opinions. In additions like you, I want to help people avoid spending money on touted products and find cheaper and better ways to enjoy music. In fact, I am losing money when I speak against flagship products that I own and I want to sell here in head-fi. And you know that I am rich and I don't and can't make money by promoting Fostex RP's, Mayflower 10 dolar rings, or ZMF pads.

If you like I can continue to discuss with you here or via private message any issues you think we may disagree and share with you my plans for feature mods. English is not my native language and I tend to misinterprete some statements. Also at 66 with a plethora of project I am involved in (volontarily) I tend to miss or forget some of the things I read like the fact that in your review you clearly stated what source and amp you used. Perhaps all of this led me to believe that you don't like the T60, sorry again.
I suffer from bipolar disorder in an advanced stage and have 84% disability from Social Security and that does not help me either to be unemotional. My 2nd system at the age of
20 was state of the art and very expensive, I spent over a million dollars on this hobby so far, as a professor of EE and IT with a dissertation on DSP;s and experience in mastering reputable Greek music for CD's I have a tendency to assume I am talking as an expert to an audience that is less informed on the subject and maybe this did not help either and I assumed that you are in this category because of your few posts and your parialy filled profile, sorry again. However. as I always learn when I give speeches to such audiences I did state that I learned from you and I appreciated it. You may of course find all this in my profile to verify the sincerity of my apology to you and understand how and why my last post sounded offending.
Lastly, what I was trying to do in my last post I was trying to identify the reason why there was a difference of opinion on our perception of the bass on the T60 which it turns out that actually there was not any.
I really want to continue to discuss with you. I would like you to explain to me what is the way the vent port work and why you thought Daniels clip was funny, or my posting it was funny.

 

[kintsaki]

I would like to inform all of you that I did try the mod that ttran946 posted and improved the T60, and I found it correct.
Yes, you can use the stock pads, no need to buy the ZMF pads, and by blocking some vents with tape or preferably inserting small pieces of foam, no need to use the Mayflower ring foam, fine tune bass response to your own liking.

 

[DarkShinigami34]

I am now using the Fostex ET-RP2.5BL balanced cable and a 3.5mm balanced adapter for my iFi xDSD. Clean and controlled with greater separation. Tighter bass and a more airy sound. This is also with the angled hybrid Dekoni sheepskin pads.

 

[esauseesaw]

can you give us some instructions? Did you just spray the outside of the mechanism or did you also spray the inside?

Sorry to take so long to get back to this. Our main service engineer was unexpectedly sick for a few weeks, just as I posted about this. By the time he was back it had slipped my mind. I have now checked with him. No need to take the headphone apart, just a very small amount of Teflon lubricant applied to the pivot mechanism. It sits in the center of the arm/cup connection. I've attached some pictures to help with the explanation. Our engineer recommends applying the lubricant from the top, down into the socket. We dry it off any excess with compressed air but you can use a piece of paper towel or perhaps a cotton bud. I've also included a picture of the lubricant we use.

 

[esauseesaw]

I've attached some pictures to help with the explanation

- attempt no.2!.

 

[gr8soundz]

- attempt no.2!.

Thanks for posting pics. I got a similar size dropper bottle of dry teflon on Amazon for less than $3. You originally mentioned spray but I didn't want to deal with any overspray issues although it would likely penetrate better.

First tried using a q-tip to apply it but didn't work. Just tried the method you mentioned above and it worked for one earcup. I repeated adding two more drops on the other side but it still creaks/squeaks a bit.

Looks like I'll resume returning the T60rp soon. They are a step up (not a huge one though imo) above my T50rp mk3 but this creaking problem makes the T60rp unworthy of being double the price. Plus the mk3's flat pads aren't too big a problem for me and I know they're designed that way for a reason. The T60's pad are more comfy and both the highs and lows are a bit more extended and better controlled but having my ears further away from the drivers sounds like something is missing compared to the mk3. Hard for me to quantify or describe but the T60rp sound (by my ears) isn't quite what I was hoping for.

EDIT: I checked them again (over hour later) and no longer hear the same creaking on other earcup. I guess the lubricant, despite drying very quickly, was still working it's way through. Hope I don't have to do this ever again If I decide to keep the headphones.

 

[mushin1989]

Hey all,

So I've been on the hunt for a DT 770 upgrade for half a damn year. It is a credit to those cans, because it hasn't been easy. I found a clear answer, however, in the T60 RPs...however, I had a pretty bad bass rattle with the refurbs I bought. I sent them back, and lo, they were out of stock everywhere (this is shortly after the Z Review).

So...I decide to put the whole hunt on the backburner by ordering the Argon MkIIIs. Three months come and go, and they get here, aaaand...

I swear they sound veiled. Muddy almost. Maybe something is wrong with my amp (Emotiva A-100) or ears or whathaveyou, but while they are impressive, I'm left somewhat underwhelmed. The main reason for this is because I remember the T60 RPs *still* being the best sounding headphones I've ever tried.

What did they do to these things? How do they sound so fantastic? And without any modding/pad replacement either. My wife gave them a listen (she is NOT an audio enthusiast of any kind and doesn't really care about headphones) and she was just set aback by what they did to her music.

Anyway, I'm pretty much 100% that I'm going back to the T60 RPs. Maybe its the power of murdered african trees, but wow.

 

[kintsaki]

Sorry to take so long to get back to this. Our main service engineer was unexpectedly sick for a few weeks, just as I posted about this. By the time he was back it had slipped my mind. I have now checked with him. No need to take the headphone apart, just a very small amount of Teflon lubricant applied to the pivot mechanism. It sits in the center of the arm/cup connection. I've attached some pictures to help with the explanation. Our engineer recommends applying the lubricant from the top, down into the socket. We dry it off any excess with compressed air but you can use a piece of paper towel or perhaps a cotton bud. I've also included a picture of the lubricant we use.

Thanks a lot for the detailed instructions, photos, and identification of the proper material to use.
I did fix mine 11 days ago (see my post) with "specialist wd40"
https://redirect.viglink.com/?forma...40specialist.com/products/silicone-lubricant/

and it is still in excellent shape with no sign of any cracking despite the fact I have been using it and abusing it all day long!

 

[kintsaki]

e

Hey all,

So I've been on the hunt for a DT 770 upgrade for half a damn year. It is a credit to those cans, because it hasn't been easy. I found a clear answer, however, in the T60 RPs...however, I had a pretty bad bass rattle with the refurbs I bought. I sent them back, and lo, they were out of stock everywhere (this is shortly after the Z Review).

So...I decide to put the whole hunt on the backburner by ordering the Argon MkIIIs. Three months come and go, and they get here, aaaand...

I swear they sound veiled. Muddy almost. Maybe something is wrong with my amp (Emotiva A-100) or ears or whathaveyou, but while they are impressive, I'm left somewhat underwhelmed. The main reason for this is because I remember the T60 RPs *still* being the best sounding headphones I've ever tried.

What did they do to these things? How do they sound so fantastic? And without any modding/pad replacement either. My wife gave them a listen (she is NOT an audio enthusiast of any kind and doesn't really care about headphones) and she was just set aback by what they did to her music.

Anyway, I'm pretty much 100% that I'm going back to the T60 RPs. Maybe its the power of murdered african trees, but wow.

I am very happy to hear you saying "the Argon is veiled". The Argon is the only variation of the Fostex I have not tried and I do not own and I was getting ready to order it to try it.
I do have tried all combinations of the others including all possible pads (stock and aftermarket) including the shallow ones which - like you, I find quite comfortable. I am also happy to hear your wife likes the T60 a lot because her opinion is unbiased whereas ours is affected by our knowledge on the subject which has a placebo effect on us.
I do have a Mayflower V3 which is the bass version and although the bass is heating harder, they are veiled. I did manage to remove most of the veil by playing with the baffle rings and retained the hard heating on the bass so now I believe that the V3 when fine-tuned it may sound quite similar to the Argon.
Once again let me stress that statements made here are only our opinions and not facts. We hear different and we have different tastes and we like different genres of music.
I like Katie Melua and she uses the DT 770 to record her performance...

 

[Asahi Templar]

Hey all,

So I've been on the hunt for a DT 770 upgrade for half a damn year. It is a credit to those cans, because it hasn't been easy. I found a clear answer, however, in the T60 RPs...however, I had a pretty bad bass rattle with the refurbs I bought. I sent them back, and lo, they were out of stock everywhere (this is shortly after the Z Review).

So...I decide to put the whole hunt on the backburner by ordering the Argon MkIIIs. Three months come and go, and they get here, aaaand...

I swear they sound veiled. Muddy almost. Maybe something is wrong with my amp (Emotiva A-100) or ears or whathaveyou, but while they are impressive, I'm left somewhat underwhelmed. The main reason for this is because I remember the T60 RPs *still* being the best sounding headphones I've ever tried.

What did they do to these things? How do they sound so fantastic? And without any modding/pad replacement either. My wife gave them a listen (she is NOT an audio enthusiast of any kind and doesn't really care about headphones) and she was just set aback by what they did to her music.

Anyway, I'm pretty much 100% that I'm going back to the T60 RPs. Maybe its the power of murdered african trees, but wow.

I am trying hard not to rebuy the T60 lol. I sold mine to buy one of the HE560 v2s from Adorama and wish I had not. The 560 sounded amazing with EQ but it was extremely uncomfortable to me, and still didnt have the guitar magic the T60RP had.

Now I have a Sennheiser 660 S which is an amazing headphone, but I miss my T60. I think I just prefer Planars to dynamic, even an amazing dynamic just isnt as enjoyable for me.

The T60s are something special, they stand up to headphones a lot more expensive than them and other than the annoying creaking, its a great experience out the box with no EQ or mods.

I definately recommend them for anyone who likes a little bit brighter headphone.

The clarity is outstanding.

 

[mushin1989]

e

I am very happy to hear you saying "the Argon is veiled". The Argon is the only variation of the Fostex I have not tried and I do not own and I was getting ready to order it to try it.
I do have tried all combinations of the others including all possible pads (stock and aftermarket) including the shallow ones which - like you, I find quite comfortable. I am also happy to hear your wife likes the T60 a lot because her opinion is unbiased whereas ours is affected by our knowledge on the subject which has a placebo effect on us.
I do have a Mayflower V3 which is the bass version and although the bass is heating harder, they are veiled. I did manage to remove most of the veil by playing with the baffle rings and retained the hard heating on the bass so now I believe that the V3 when fine-tuned it may sound quite similar to the Argon.
Once again let me stress that statements made here are only our opinions and not facts. We hear different and we have different tastes and we like different genres of music.
I like Katie Melua and she uses the DT 770 to record her performance...

The DT 770s are great, no two ways about it. You just don't get the 'sparkle', the controlled bass, the mids of those modded planar T50s. While the Argon sounds like a notable upgrade to the DT770, however, it is still reminicent of the DT 770. The T60 RP, however, just has a clarity that is outstanding. It is closer, yes, but this adds to that sense of clarity. I find that I, in general, want clear audio more than anything else, especially the excellent reproduction of vocals without completely ignoring the low end. That's the T60 -- once you hear clear sounding speakers or headphones, going to veiled equipment, even if only slightly veiled, is difficult.

 

[mushin1989]

I am trying hard not to rebuy the T60 lol. I sold mine to buy one of the HE560 v2s from Adorama and wish I had not. The 560 sounded amazing with EQ but it was extremely uncomfortable to me, and still didnt have the guitar magic the T60RP had.

Now I have a Sennheiser 660 S which is an amazing headphone, but I miss my T60. I think I just prefer Planars to dynamic, even an amazing dynamic just isnt as enjoyable for me.

The T60s are something special, they stand up to headphones a lot more expensive than them and other than the annoying creaking, its a great experience out the box with no EQ or mods.

I definately recommend them for anyone who likes a little bit brighter headphone.

The clarity is outstanding.

I just rebought it. eBay was selling some B-Stock with a full warranty for $240. Using their 15% off coupon today, I knocked it down to $203. Will never get a price that good again without significant time/luck. The Argons are likely to be going up for sale to someone they are more suited for.