[Dillan]

Are IEMs scooters

 

[fjrabon]

Haha

You heard it here first, th $4k headphones are > than the $200k speakers.

Welcome to the internet.

Not at all reading the actual words somebody wrote and then making a snarky comment.

Welcome to the Internet.

 

[raypin]

mmm......he didn't say that. Anyone with average comprehension skills knows that. Be that as it may, if Focal was able to somehow replicate the experience of listening to their speakers on a "mere" headphone, given the limitations of a "mere" headphone, I think that it would be an a huge positive for the Utopia. i look forward to receiving my Utopia in a couple of weeks and pass judgment on the claims of Focal.

 

[npdang]

  No headphone touches with a ten foot pole the enveloping, body rushing experience of speakers. There is no way possible. 
 
The headphone would have to: 
- have a soundstage 5 times more spacious than the HD800
- Come with a full body suite from head to toe to let your body of 65% water vibrate according to the frequencies played and at the specific parts of your body
- be practically weightless and unable to be felt while on your head
- wireless so you can hear it in any part of your room or house
so on and so on. 
 
4k buying you that experience makes a lot more sense. There is only so much a headphone can do. 4k is a bit much honestly but diminishing returns biatch 

 
I agree wholeheartedly... I've had a number of relatively modest speaker setups (Focal Diablo, Martin Duke, Dynaudio C1, etc.) and even staging and dynamic considerations aside, the resolution, tonal balance, etc. is noticeably better than any TOTL can that I've heard.  I think the biggest benefit of headphone setups is with the amps... it's absurdly easy to design high performing tube amps at low wattage, and relatively low cost.

 

[raypin]

mmm....In defense of headphones, the biggest advantage is you can take your music ANYWHERE. Whereas with speakers, you are stuck playing those in a fixed location. It is not just about SQ but the overall package. Cost is also a humongous advantage. For the price of a really good speakers setup, you can easily invest in a dozen headphone set-up, offering different experiences (planar vs. estats vs. dynamics vs. hybrids, not to mention the cost of properly treating a music room like hiring the services of a good acoustician, installation of thingamajigs to optimize the listening experience and so on). The options to tweak the sound are infinitely much easier to make than with a speakers set-up. Headphones are also much  easier to sell whereas speakers are not, making it easier for the enthusiast to take advantage of new technologies.Headphones are much more versatile. Very few people can afford a dedicated music room or any room for a proper speakers set-up. Want to play your 200K speakers set-up in a condo? Then prepare to earn the ire of your neighbor and condo association. More and more people are living in pigeon holes (a.k.a. condos) specially in supercrowded cities. So, space is at a huge premium. Speakers are just not practical to own and use anymore.

 

[up late]

bookshelf and compact floorstander speakers still are practical options for apartment style living, but i think that the thread is moving "off topic" now fwiw

 

[TSAVJason]

Focal Utopia & Sopra

 

[ubs28]

Are IEMs scooters

Not really. Not even high-end headphone like the HE-1000 have superfast decay's like IEM's. Balanced Armature IEM still sound the fastest according to my ears.

 

[gikigill]

 
Not really. Not even high-end headphone like the HE-1000 have superfast decay's like IEM's. Balanced Armature IEM still sound the fastest according to my ears.

Electrostats beat everything in decay.

 

[warrenpchi]

 

I wonder how the Utopia's would compare to Shure's KSE1500s, apart from the obvious soundstaging and sound isolation differences.

 
I heard the 1500. Not for me... Utopia's midrange is more organic and highs are much smoother.

 

Originally Posted by ubs28 /img/forum/go_quote.gif

Not even high-end headphone like the HE-1000 have superfast decay's like IEM's. Balanced Armature IEM still sound the fastest according to my ears.

Originally Posted by gikigill /img/forum/go_quote.gif
 
Electrostats beat everything in decay.

 
Here's the part where @HiFiGuy528 says "so that's why the KSE-1500 sounds so dead to me..."  

 

 

[npdang]

  mmm....In defense of headphones, the biggest advantage is you can take your music ANYWHERE. Whereas with speakers, you are stuck playing those in a fixed location. It is not just about SQ but the overall package. Cost is also a humongous advantage. For the price of a really good speakers setup, you can easily invest in a dozen headphone set-up, offering different experiences (planar vs. estats vs. dynamics vs. hybrids, not to mention the cost of properly treating a music room like hiring the services of a good acoustician, installation of thingamajigs to optimize the listening experience and so on). The options to tweak the sound are infinitely much easier to make than with a speakers set-up. Headphones are also much  easier to sell whereas speakers are not, making it easier for the enthusiast to take advantage of new technologies.Headphones are much more versatile. Very few people can afford a dedicated music room or any room for a proper speakers set-up. Want to play your 200K speakers set-up in a condo? Then prepare to earn the ire of your neighbor and condo association. More and more people are living in pigeon holes (a.k.a. condos) specially in supercrowded cities. So, space is at a huge premium. Speakers are just not practical to own and use anymore.

 
Totally agree.  Just speaking from a sound quality perspective however.  I think some people are perhaps a little too eager to say you can get the same level of performance in a relatively modest headphone setup as expensive speakers etc. and I just don't share that opinion at all.

 

[gikigill]

   
Here's the part where @HiFiGuy528 says "so that's why the KSE-1500 sounds so dead to me..."  

 

OT but I could never love any estat IEMs.

 

[npdang]

x2 but i won't be holding my breath

 
I own the Pioneers and I'm not too far from The Source AV, so hopefully I can provide some feedback.  I disliked many of the earlier Focal loudspeakers as they always sounded obviously colored and had a very strange sounding midrange.  However, I liked the Diablo enough to purchase a pair, and the Sopra No 1 was very impressive.  I hope the Utopia headphones follow these more recent product offerings... although I am somewhat skeptical that these are truly neutral headphones... JM Labs/Focal just doesn't seem to ever do neutral... lively, fast, ruthlessly revealing, fun, sure... but never neutral... especially if you ever have the chance to compare the Utopia loudspeaker line to anything from TAD, Vivid Audio, Tidal, etc. it becomes quite apparent Imho.  I'm also not completely sold yet on the high excursion motor design... while it does reduce harmonic distortion, that never really seemed to be an issue with most TOTL headphones to begin with... however, with a full-range driver such as a headphone, it may exacerbate issues with intermodulation distortion (a more offensive, and readily audible form of non-linear distortion).  Also, long voice coils tend to have significantly higher inductance, increasing inductance related distortion and reducing upper end extension/sensitivity.  But in any case, I think these look very promising especially as they are the only game in town (I believe) for a beryllium diaphragm driver and listening is always really the only reliable way to measure performance.  

 

[Duncan]

npdang I, and my M1s will await your opinions with bated breath

 

[up late]

yeah. what he said.