Focal Clear headphones
Feb 17, 2018 at 12:19 PM Post #2,611 of 12,543
I have the same problem with the Clear. Something sounds supressed / sucked out which makes me want to turn up the volume.

The Focal Utopia (with high-end cables) has a more balanced sound overall.
 
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Feb 17, 2018 at 3:24 PM Post #2,613 of 12,543
Feb 17, 2018 at 4:41 PM Post #2,614 of 12,543
Feb 17, 2018 at 5:03 PM Post #2,615 of 12,543
Yes but amp is next on my list to work on. Been thinking about building the Kevin Gilmore design balanced amp...
Thanks,
I have a Jot and HD650 and I'm looking for something to complement my HD650 so I'm trying to gather impressions.
Does the Utopia sound bright/strident or lean from the Jot? For reference I find the HD800 a little lean and Bright.
 
Feb 17, 2018 at 6:47 PM Post #2,616 of 12,543
Thanks,
I have a Jot and HD650 and I'm looking for something to complement my HD650 so I'm trying to gather impressions.
Does the Utopia sound bright/strident or lean from the Jot? For reference I find the HD800 a little lean and Bright.

First, I would point you to my Clear (and stock HD800) impressions here as a reference point.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/focal-clear-headphones.861727/page-63#post-13904828
  • My impression for stock HD800 is also that it's little lean and bright (but not painful).
  • Utopia has more body: Not as much as the Clear but more than HD800/HD600 (sorry, I haven't heard the HD650).
  • Utopia's treble hasn't bothered me: Narrower soundstage and relative balance with respect to the rest of the spectrum makes it very pleasing. I'm hearing the right amount of sparkle from steel string guitars, violins, flutes, etc.
  • Both Clear and Utopia has a way of bringing instruments closer to you in a very intimate setting.
  • Compared to my HD600 (stock with stock cable terminated with 4-pin XLR), Utopia is more lively, engaging, and it has less glare from the presence region (in addition to all the above).
  • My modded HD800 (pseudo-SDR using Shure olive, DIY anaxilus mod, stock cable with 4-pin XLR) comes very close to Utopia. In fact, I think the bass digs deeper with better definition. A different presentation from Focal sound though.

One issue that I have with Jotunheim is that the usable volume range is very narrow with my setup. I prefer the high gain setting and I can only use 8-9 o'clock. Clear was worse.

Hope this gives some data point for you!
 
Feb 17, 2018 at 7:54 PM Post #2,617 of 12,543
First, I would point you to my Clear (and stock HD800) impressions here as a reference point.
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/focal-clear-headphones.861727/page-63#post-13904828
  • My impression for stock HD800 is also that it's little lean and bright (but not painful).
  • Utopia has more body: Not as much as the Clear but more than HD800/HD600 (sorry, I haven't heard the HD650).
  • Utopia's treble hasn't bothered me: Narrower soundstage and relative balance with respect to the rest of the spectrum makes it very pleasing. I'm hearing the right amount of sparkle from steel string guitars, violins, flutes, etc.
  • Both Clear and Utopia has a way of bringing instruments closer to you in a very intimate setting.
  • Compared to my HD600 (stock with stock cable terminated with 4-pin XLR), Utopia is more lively, engaging, and it has less glare from the presence region (in addition to all the above).
  • My modded HD800 (pseudo-SDR using Shure olive, DIY anaxilus mod, stock cable with 4-pin XLR) comes very close to Utopia. In fact, I think the bass digs deeper with better definition. A different presentation from Focal sound though.

One issue that I have with Jotunheim is that the usable volume range is very narrow with my setup. I prefer the high gain setting and I can only use 8-9 o'clock. Clear was worse.

Hope this gives some data point for you!

Thank you very much for such a detailed response. It is exactly the type of information I was looking for. Very Helpful!
 
Feb 17, 2018 at 10:26 PM Post #2,619 of 12,543
I am interested in the Clear would love to hear about your thoughts about Edition X V2 VS Clear as I also own a HeXv2.

Okay, I did an hour-long comparison between the Focal Clear and the Edition X V2, with maybe 40 hours of burn-in on the Clear and at least 200 hours of burn-in on the Edition X. All music was played off a hard drive (ripped from my personal CD collection) at 44.1 kHZ, except Diana Krall, which was played through Tidal at 44.1 kHZ.
  • Amps/DACs used: iFi iCan Pro & LKS MH-DA004, RME ADI-2 Pro as both amp & DAC (each track was listened to twice, once with each set of amp/DAC to eliminate bias)
    • Balanced inputs were used for both amps/DACs.
    • Cables used: Focal-issued balanced cable (for Clear), Charleston Cable Company OCC balanced cable (for Edition X V2)
  • Tracks listened to & results of comparison:
    • Bach Cello Suites, Yo Yo Ma -- Suite for solo cello No.1 in G major, BWV 1007 | Prelude
      • The resolution with the Clear is amazing -- I can hear the bow and string hitting the bridge of Yo Yo Ma's cello, which I've never heard before. So many details!
      • The Edition X is less resolving. Its soundstage is slightly better.
        • WINNER: CLEAR
    • A Toda La Gusta, Afro-Cuban All Stars | Amor Verdadero
      • The resolution with the Clear is better than the Edition X. But the Clear's soundstage makes the music sound like it is right around my head, not in front of me.
      • There's a lot going on in this track. All of the musicians are laid out clearly in space by the Edition X and its amazing soundstage, which is projected forward in front of me. The Clear can't compete.
        • WINNER: EDITION X
    • Forever Blue, Chris Isaak | Somebody's Crying
      • The Clear recreates the track very well with nice resolution, but I am definitely aware that I am listening through headphones.
      • With the Edition X, the track sounds as if Chris Isaak is singing right to me -- a very intimate and focused soundstage. More like speakers at a concert than headphones on my head.
        • WINNER: EDITION X
    • Bach Orchestral Suite No. 3 in D Major, English Chamber Orchestra | BWV 1068: Air
      • Both headphones resolve equally well.
      • The Edition X's soundstage is slightly better, but not significantly so.
        • WINNER: TIE
    • Love Scenes, Diana Krall | I Miss You So
      • The Clear's attention to micro-detail is so intense on this track that it's distracting. Krall's voice is incredibly clear, and is enunciated better than with the Edition X. Each bass string pluck can be heard individually. However, it feels more like a collection of sounds than an integrated song.
      • The Edition X does not resolve as well, but pulls ahead with its amazing soundstage. A much more enjoyable listen.
        • WINNER: EDITION X
    • Money Jungle, Duke Ellington and Charles Mingus | Very Special
      • The Clear's attention to micro-detail brings the bass and piano into intensely sharp focus. Very analytical feel to this track through the Clear.
      • The Edition X makes listening to this track much more enjoyable. Again, less resolving, but so much easier to listen to.
        • WINNER: EDITION X
Truly, the Clear's powers of resolution and clarity are amazing. If you want to hear every nuance (and I mean every single one) of a piece of music, the Clear is right up your alley.
But if you want to just enjoy the music and can accept less resolution in exchange for a great soundstage, then the Edition X is made for you.

I hope this is helpful. Please let me know if you need clarification on anything I've written.
 
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Feb 17, 2018 at 11:41 PM Post #2,620 of 12,543
Another point of reference in case someone wanted a comparison between Focal Clear and Edition X; I wrote this up in the HEX thread a while back, and I've now expanded on my thoughts a little bit:

Tonality/presentation: The HEX sounds more spacious/airy, laid-back, smooth, and effortless. Clear has a dense, upfront, energetic, and dynamic presentation. I'll come back to this later.

Bass: HEX has more quantity, but both pairs are close to my definition of neutral. Clear seemed to have tighter cleaner bass with more perceived impact/attack. HEX seemed rounder and more textured which contributes to the sense of laid-back presentation that HEX v2 gives off. HEX seemed to do better with 'audiophile' style acoustic jazz and classical, whereas the Clears fared better with rock, electronic, and other fast-paced genres.

Mids: HEX definitely has a smoother rounded presentation to it with a decent dosage of warmth. Clears sounded subjectively more 'neutral' and 'transparent'. Small nuances were more apparent on the Clears (though still clearly audible with the HEX, it's just that the Clears push those micro-details more upfront). Vocals and instruments sounded more 'clear' and 'life-like' with the Clears, whereas the HEX made them sound more seductive and 'organic'.

Treble: More quantity on the Clears, leading to a brighter presentation. More fatiguing in the long run, but probably lent a hand to the greater perceived sense of details. Didn't have an issue with sibilance or excessive peaks however. With the HEX, there's still enough sparkle to keep things exciting-ish, but is definitely not as extended as the Clear.

Soundstage/imaging/separation: HEX has a larger soundstage in all directions. There's more space between each instrument, allowing them to 'breathe'. In comparison, the Clears have a denser presentation in the sense that there's less space between the instruments, although separation and imaging were still top notch. The Clear's headstage is a lot more upfront, making every instrument and voice sound much closer to you than the HEX. Someone mentioned that the HEX v2 presented itself closer to a 2ch stereo setup than a typical pair of headphones, and I'm inclined to agree. You're further away from the stage, and allows for the music to 'breathe' before reaching you. I don't know, it's hard to describe lol. I like it though. I wonder if this contributes to the softer edge to the music that HEX v2 exhibits.

Attack/dynamics: Clear wins. Clear is a punchier pair of cans. More fatiguing too though; can't have it both ways. HEX is softer/rounder sounding and more laidback. Leading edges on the HEX with guitar plucks and bass strums seems muted in comparison to the Clear. You'll get more of a toe-tapping factor with the Clear whereas with the HEX, I find that it makes me loosen up and let the music wash over me. Again, hard to describe. I think it has to do with the soundstage.

Other remarks: Both have excellent tone density, coming from the HD800 which could sound stretched out and thin at times. There's a sense of hugeness with the HEX though; with the large soundstage along with the thicker presentation, it makes the music seem big somehow. With the Clear, it has a more typical headphone soundstage, so everything sounds more compacted and you realize you're listening to headphones at all times.


For my tastes, I prefer the HEX v2 due to the 'longterm satisfying soundsig'. I also greatly prefer the soundstage presentation of the HEX but YMMV. Those that listen to 4-man rock groups, chamber music, modern pop, etc. might not care for the soundstage, and even prefer a more upfront presentation due to the immediacy of the sound. Not me though.

But those that find the HEX v2 not engaging enough due to the rounded softer nature of its presentation would do well to try the Clears. Alternatively, those who think that the HEX sound a bit too romantic or smooth in the mids should also give the Clears a chance. 'Vivid" and "transparent" are words I would use to describe the Clears.
 
Feb 18, 2018 at 12:01 AM Post #2,621 of 12,543
Another point of reference in case someone wanted a comparison between Focal Clear and Edition X; I wrote this up in the HEX thread a while back, and I've now expanded on my thoughts a little bit:

Tonality/presentation: The HEX sounds more spacious/airy, laid-back, smooth, and effortless. Clear has a dense, upfront, energetic, and dynamic presentation. I'll come back to this later.

Bass: HEX has more quantity, but both pairs are close to my definition of neutral. Clear seemed to have tighter cleaner bass with more perceived impact/attack. HEX seemed rounder and more textured which contributes to the sense of laid-back presentation that HEX v2 gives off. HEX seemed to do better with 'audiophile' style acoustic jazz and classical, whereas the Clears fared better with rock, electronic, and other fast-paced genres.

Mids: HEX definitely has a smoother rounded presentation to it with a decent dosage of warmth. Clears sounded subjectively more 'neutral' and 'transparent'. Small nuances were more apparent on the Clears (though still clearly audible with the HEX, it's just that the Clears push those micro-details more upfront). Vocals and instruments sounded more 'clear' and 'life-like' with the Clears, whereas the HEX made them sound more seductive and 'organic'.

Treble: More quantity on the Clears, leading to a brighter presentation. More fatiguing in the long run, but probably lent a hand to the greater perceived sense of details. Didn't have an issue with sibilance or excessive peaks however. With the HEX, there's still enough sparkle to keep things exciting-ish, but is definitely not as extended as the Clear.

Soundstage/imaging/separation: HEX has a larger soundstage in all directions. There's more space between each instrument, allowing them to 'breathe'. In comparison, the Clears have a denser presentation in the sense that there's less space between the instruments, although separation and imaging were still top notch. The Clear's headstage is a lot more upfront, making every instrument and voice sound much closer to you than the HEX. Someone mentioned that the HEX v2 presented itself closer to a 2ch stereo setup than a typical pair of headphones, and I'm inclined to agree. You're further away from the stage, and allows for the music to 'breathe' before reaching you. I don't know, it's hard to describe lol. I like it though. I wonder if this contributes to the softer edge to the music that HEX v2 exhibits.

Attack/dynamics: Clear wins. Clear is a punchier pair of cans. More fatiguing too though; can't have it both ways. HEX is softer/rounder sounding and more laidback. Leading edges on the HEX with guitar plucks and bass strums seems muted in comparison to the Clear. You'll get more of a toe-tapping factor with the Clear whereas with the HEX, I find that it makes me loosen up and let the music wash over me. Again, hard to describe. I think it has to do with the soundstage.

Other remarks: Both have excellent tone density, coming from the HD800 which could sound stretched out and thin at times. There's a sense of hugeness with the HEX though; with the large soundstage along with the thicker presentation, it makes the music seem big somehow. With the Clear, it has a more typical headphone soundstage, so everything sounds more compacted and you realize you're listening to headphones at all times.


For my tastes, I prefer the HEX v2 due to the 'longterm satisfying soundsig'. I also greatly prefer the soundstage presentation of the HEX but YMMV. Those that listen to 4-man rock groups, chamber music, modern pop, etc. might not care for the soundstage, and even prefer a more upfront presentation due to the immediacy of the sound. Not me though.

But those that find the HEX v2 not engaging enough due to the rounded softer nature of its presentation would do well to try the Clears. Alternatively, those who think that the HEX sound a bit too romantic or smooth in the mids should also give the Clears a chance. 'Vivid" and "transparent" are words I would use to describe the Clears.

We had some of the same observations, but you're much better at explaining the differences between the two than I am. Well done!
 
Feb 18, 2018 at 12:28 AM Post #2,622 of 12,543
Another point of reference in case someone wanted a comparison between Focal Clear and Edition X; I wrote this up in the HEX thread a while back, and I've now expanded on my thoughts a little bit:

Tonality/presentation: The HEX sounds more spacious/airy, laid-back, smooth, and effortless. Clear has a dense, upfront, energetic, and dynamic presentation. I'll come back to this later.

Bass: HEX has more quantity, but both pairs are close to my definition of neutral. Clear seemed to have tighter cleaner bass with more perceived impact/attack. HEX seemed rounder and more textured which contributes to the sense of laid-back presentation that HEX v2 gives off. HEX seemed to do better with 'audiophile' style acoustic jazz and classical, whereas the Clears fared better with rock, electronic, and other fast-paced genres.

Mids: HEX definitely has a smoother rounded presentation to it with a decent dosage of warmth. Clears sounded subjectively more 'neutral' and 'transparent'. Small nuances were more apparent on the Clears (though still clearly audible with the HEX, it's just that the Clears push those micro-details more upfront). Vocals and instruments sounded more 'clear' and 'life-like' with the Clears, whereas the HEX made them sound more seductive and 'organic'.

Treble: More quantity on the Clears, leading to a brighter presentation. More fatiguing in the long run, but probably lent a hand to the greater perceived sense of details. Didn't have an issue with sibilance or excessive peaks however. With the HEX, there's still enough sparkle to keep things exciting-ish, but is definitely not as extended as the Clear.

Soundstage/imaging/separation: HEX has a larger soundstage in all directions. There's more space between each instrument, allowing them to 'breathe'. In comparison, the Clears have a denser presentation in the sense that there's less space between the instruments, although separation and imaging were still top notch. The Clear's headstage is a lot more upfront, making every instrument and voice sound much closer to you than the HEX. Someone mentioned that the HEX v2 presented itself closer to a 2ch stereo setup than a typical pair of headphones, and I'm inclined to agree. You're further away from the stage, and allows for the music to 'breathe' before reaching you. I don't know, it's hard to describe lol. I like it though. I wonder if this contributes to the softer edge to the music that HEX v2 exhibits.

Attack/dynamics: Clear wins. Clear is a punchier pair of cans. More fatiguing too though; can't have it both ways. HEX is softer/rounder sounding and more laidback. Leading edges on the HEX with guitar plucks and bass strums seems muted in comparison to the Clear. You'll get more of a toe-tapping factor with the Clear whereas with the HEX, I find that it makes me loosen up and let the music wash over me. Again, hard to describe. I think it has to do with the soundstage.

Other remarks: Both have excellent tone density, coming from the HD800 which could sound stretched out and thin at times. There's a sense of hugeness with the HEX though; with the large soundstage along with the thicker presentation, it makes the music seem big somehow. With the Clear, it has a more typical headphone soundstage, so everything sounds more compacted and you realize you're listening to headphones at all times.


For my tastes, I prefer the HEX v2 due to the 'longterm satisfying soundsig'. I also greatly prefer the soundstage presentation of the HEX but YMMV. Those that listen to 4-man rock groups, chamber music, modern pop, etc. might not care for the soundstage, and even prefer a more upfront presentation due to the immediacy of the sound. Not me though.

But those that find the HEX v2 not engaging enough due to the rounded softer nature of its presentation would do well to try the Clears. Alternatively, those who think that the HEX sound a bit too romantic or smooth in the mids should also give the Clears a chance. 'Vivid" and "transparent" are words I would use to describe the Clears.
I've heard HEK, not the HEX, but the they both have the rather large spaced diaphragms and has that large sounding presence, spaciousness. HEX must be pretty laid-back if you consider Clear can get fatiguing. I didn't find that it is that type of sig, I find plenty of headphone that would be considered bright with harshness, and can't say Clear is one them, but like I've stated, the 9k or higher is there still. HEK does it similarly with the 9k, but both do not sound a like at all. Yes, Clear has the tight dynamics, but not the type of sounds with much textures. For me personally, treble is the area that can cause fatigue if the chances to hit the treble energy more with a wider band. This probably depends on quantity of treble which depends on how significant the lift and bandwidth is.
 
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Feb 18, 2018 at 9:56 AM Post #2,624 of 12,543
Count me in the Camp that don’t find the Clear harsh or fatiguing; I literally can listen to them for hours on end. I may be a closet “detailhead,” but everything from Bach sonatas to Lynyrd Skynyrd. Every finger pluck, bow upon the strings, or hearing the difference between a bass drum pedal or a mallet strike.
 
Feb 18, 2018 at 9:56 AM Post #2,625 of 12,543
Tyll has launched the focal utopia off the wall of fame and put the focal clear in its place,I rest my case


For some, Tylll can be a valuable resource but speaking for myself, Tyll isn't the final arbiter of my headphones preferences. I prefer to determine that for myself.

Seriously, are you trying to use Tyll's wall of fame as some kind of universal statement on headphones? If you prefer the Clear, no problem, but...
 

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