Guys, I am considering the M17, at a cost of abt usd 1500, used. Is this device still relevant today? Or shall I hold for a potential refresh?
[FiiO M17] Dual ES9038PRO, dual THXAAA-788+, dual power supplies, 9200mAh battery, 2 volume control modes
The device is very relevant!
But you can already find cheaper than $ 1,500 for a used one.
I saw it cheaper on Amazon but it doesnt ship to Singapore!
Electrocrytic
100+ Head-Fier
I saw it cheaper on Amazon but it doesnt ship to Singapore!
NPAudio have one cheaper, Shipping says they ship to Singapore
TheOneInYellow
1000+ Head-Fier
The FiiO M17 is very relevant.
I find questions like this saddening, considering that good audio gear ought to last, yet sometimes communities like this consider audio gear as throwaway commodities, and chase the next newest thing and ignore well made pieces of gear for marginal differences (in general of course).
The M17, for example, has two flagship DAC's. Those DAC's did not suddenly get superseded, nor are they obsolete; they are still in production and TOTL, with only a sibling version also TOTL as well.
Both ESS Sabre ES9038PRO and ES9039PRO are dual flagship chips. The M17 has two ES9038PRO chips, with eight-channels on each chip dedicated for each stereo channel, which allows for supreme noise floor reduction and decoding.
Similarly, the THX788+ Class A amplifier chips* are TOTL as well, and FiiO has exclusivity to these amp chips, currently residing in the M17, Q7, and R7 devices (and more too). *No official link, but overall link of the technology can be found here.
The M17 has two of them, making it the second most powerful amp on battery (1.5W), only beaten by the limited edition and discontinued iBasso DX300 Max. However, the FiiO M17 in DC mode (bypassing battery) makes it the MOST powerful digital audio player ever created (3W in balanced mode).
The M17 has had both rave reviews and stellar specs, objectively and subjectively.
It is still in production, and FiiO has already announced that they will not create an update to the M17 for another year at best; please see here.
Nothing has changed regarding the M17 (and also the Q7 and newly released R7).
You can certainly wait for an update, but it would be a long while. More likely a competitor could theoretically create a competing product, but it would be difficult for them at the M17's current RRP, never mind that M17 can be found for good deals too as time marches on.
In my opinion, the M17 is only worth it if you wish to have a device that you would also like to transport as well, and use standalone as a single all-in-one unit.
If that is not the case and you want an all-in-one for desktop only use, consider the FiiO R7 instead, or go further up and take a look at Astell&Kern ACRO CA1000T. Or, if you, again, want to use a computer or digital device as your transport to an external DAC/amp for desktop setup, consider the K9 Pro ESS as well.
If you rather save a bit but still have most of the M17's TOTL specs, but don't mind tethering to a laptop or phone or tablet, Q7 is great too. Q7 differences are no Android (no streaming), no interactive screen (just a basic information display), and only one ES9038PRO DAC. Most other features are present between the two devices. Q7 is vastly cheaper to the M17, but still itself expensive in general.
Please do research on whether the M17 suits your needs, however, to summarise again, it is VERY VERY relevant!
Edit: added links and made some clarification edits
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TheOneInYellow
1000+ Head-Fier
A very different set of questions, and I am sure that the answers are no to both, but, wanted to ask anyway just in-case anyone (or even @FiiO themselves?) may be able to shed some light and answer:
Cheers for any insight to this!
- Can the coaxial connection of the FiiO M17 be used as an input for an external word clock?
- Or rather, could there even be a provision for this via a firmware update (if this additional function is not locked to hardware implementation)?
Cheers for any insight to this!
Thank you so much! I saw your set up in previous posts and I am motivated by it. I believe a gear can last a long time too but just that the pace of release by the manufacturer sometimes holds me off.
But anw, m17 does check a lot of boxes. The Thx788+ class A is very desirable, Portable and able to use it standalone and with enough output power. So I do not need to stayed glue to my desk whole night, and a cleaner overall desk
Thank you so much for the info, especially who still owns the device
Thank you! I m gonna check it outNPAudio have one cheaper, Shipping says they ship to Singapore
TheOneInYellow
1000+ Head-Fier
No worries!Thank you so much! I saw your set up in previous posts and I am motivated by it. I believe a gear can last a long time too but just that the pace of release by the manufacturer sometimes holds me off.
But anw, m17 does check a lot of boxes. The Thx788+ class A is very desirable, Portable and able to use it standalone and with enough output power. So I do not need to stayed glue to my desk whole night, and a cleaner overall desk
Thank you so much for the info, especially who still owns the device
I'll be honest, after purchasing the FiiO M17, the announcement and later UK releases of FiiO R7, K9 Pro ESS (announced months back but only now released in the UK
), and Astell&Kern ACRO CA1000T, all gave me many pauses on whether I made the right decision.The R7 is a fantastic standalone all-in-one headphone setup, despite the lower DAC chip specs, which may not be too different performance wise to the dual flagship DAC's in the M17.
In my opinion, I consider the R7 to, perhaps, might be the ultimate all-in-one headphone solution on a smaller budget. I certainly believe that it is superior to the Naim Uniti Atom Headphone Edition spec wise.
It's also much cheaper too when compared to the M17.
The K9 Pro ESS is actually the best for most of my needs, as it contains the core DAC and amp sections with streaming capabilities and Bluetooth wireless operation, but no screen.
You can use an app to control music to the K9 Pro ESS (server or streaming), but likely a laptop or OTG is required for convenience.
Again, this is also cheaper than M17.
Astell&Kern ACRO CA1000T is, essentially, the TOTL version of the R7, and closest to the M17 spec wise but in desktop form, having full standalone all-in-one system.
This is a gorgeous piece of audio tech, and definitely nice to have the closed, in-house bespoke and tweaked Android interface that Astell&Kern are famous for.
More interestingly, it has 2x KORG Nutube 6P1 tubes. Last year I sorely wanted the Astell&Kern A&ultima SP2000T specifically for those tubes, as I was very interested. Having those same tubes in the ACRO CA1000T is awesome. In fact, I'm considering purchasing the Cayin C9 as it has these unique tubes, and use my M17 as DAC/preamp into the C9.
To me, both the ACRO CA1000T and M17 are unique, having individual niche features that interest me.
Yet, none of the above competes with the M17 in one crucial area: I cannot transport any of the above to and from home, say long commutes or in the office.
Sure, on the desktop I do have essentially three cables to manage: the fan cable for the DK3 Stand*, the DC cable for the external battery, and the headphone cable, but I do have the option to keep it simple if I wish. (*I'll be purchasing the newer version of this stand, the FiiO DK3S, as it can be disassembled flat).
The overall point is that I can literally carry a TOTL audio system and not be compromised on decoder, streaming, or power, and have a very similar or the same home desktop experience at work (if I wish too).
Add my 1Tb Micro SD card, or add my Crucial X8 SSD 1Tb slim portable storage device, I can carry my local library too.
The only area where the M17 fails is portable usage; it is ungainly, unwieldy, and impractical for on-person carry and usage. As I use my hybrid wireless/wired T+A Solitaire T, I'll likely purchase the FiiO BTR7 (in white) as an alternative for on-person music listening, or just use the Solitaire T and my phone if necessary.
Even so, the whole point of my purchasing decision was to have a setup that I can transport and have the best audio experience at home or elsewhere where I'll be sitting for long periods of time, and currently only the M17 exists that meets and exceeds my requirements on this.
The other gear mentioned above are excellent for desktop use only, so if anyone has no intention of transporting the M17, I strongly recommend looking into those other gear (or ones I've not mentioned).
M17 is niche, but impressively so!
Edit: added extra context regarding the KORG Nutube's in the Astell&Kern ACRO CA1000T section.
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Thank you for the insights, the idea of having the best possible sound anywhere we are is definitely one that I aimed for too.No worries!
I'll be honest, after purchasing the FiiO M17, the announcement and later UK releases of FiiO R7, K9 Pro ESS (announced months back but only now released in the UK
The R7 is a fantastic standalone all-in-one headphone setup, despite the lower DAC chip specs, which may not be too different performance wise to the dual flagship DAC's in the M17.
In my opinion, I consider the R7 to, perhaps, might be the ultimate all-in-one headphone solution on a smaller budget. I certainly believe that it is superior to the Naim Uniti Atom Headphone Edition spec wise.
It's also much cheaper too when compared to the M17.
The K9 Pro ESS is actually the best for most of my needs, as it contains the core DAC and amp sections with streaming capabilities and Bluetooth wireless operation, but no screen.
You can use an app to control music to the K9 Pro ESS (server or streaming), but likely a laptop or OTG is required for convenience.
Again, this is also cheaper than M17.
Astell&Kern ACRO CA1000T is, essentially, the TOTL version of the R7, and closest to the M17 spec wise but in desktop form, having full standalone all-in-one system.
This is a gorgeous piece of audio tech, and definitely nice to have the closed, in-house bespoke and tweaked Android interface that Astell&Kern are famous for.
More interestingly, it has 2x KORG Nutube 6P1 tubes. Last year I sorely wanted the Astell&Kern A&ultima SP2000T specific for those tubes, as I was very interested. Having those same tubes in the ACRO CA1000T is awesome. In fact, I'm considering purchasing the Cayin C9 as it has these unique tubes, and use my M17 as DAC/preamp into the C9.
To me, both the ACRO CA1000T and M17 are unique, having individual niche features that interest me.
Yet, none of the above competes with the M17 in one crucial area: I cannot transport any of the above to and from home, say long commutes or in the office.
Sure, on the desktop I do have essentially three cables to manage: the fan cable for the DK3 Stand*, the DC cable for the external battery, and the headphone cable, but I do have the option to keep it simple if I wish. (*I'll be purchasing the newer version of this stand, the FiiO DK3S, as it can be disassembled flat).
The overall point is that I can literally carry a TOTL audio system and not be compromised on decoder, streaming, or power, and have a very similar or the same home desktop experience at work (if I wish too).
Add my 1Tb Micro SD card, or add my Crucial X8 SSD 1Tb slim portable storage device, I can carry my local library too.
The only area where the M17 fails is portable usage; it is ungainly, unwieldy, and impractical for on-person carry and usage. As I use my hybrid wireless/wired T+A Solitaire T, I'll likely purchase the FiiO BTR7 (in white) as an alternative for on-person music listening, or just use the Solitaire T and my phone if necessary.
Even so, the whole point of my purchasing decision was to have a setup that I can transport and have the best audio experience at home or elsewhere where I'll be sitting for long periods of time, and currently only the M17 exists that meets and exceeds my requirements on this.
The other gear mentioned above are excellent for desktop use only, so if anyone has no intention of transporting the M17, I strongly recommend looking into those other gear (or ones I've not mentioned).
M17 is niche, but impressively so!
Edit: added extra context regarding the KORG Nutube's in the Astell&Kern ACRO CA1000T section.
The k9pro ess is definitely one consideration too, but it will take up some space on my desk. I am moving soon so I am now considering both options, and also other potential DAPs that may match k9pro ess. But like you explained, m17 is preferred for the portability. I shall continue to watch the price and the DAPs release!
TheOneInYellow
1000+ Head-Fier
Ha ha, fair enoughOh well...
Of course, if one is committed, then sure, go for it!
However, I still consider the M17 as not a portable device, but transportable.
The M15s is already pushing it (as would be the Astell&Kern Kaan Max), and the M17 is just MAHOOSIVE in comparison.
But yeah, you rock your M17 anyway you like, and be badass as you do to!
On that note, what cable and cans are you running in your (crazy portable) setup?
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Dear friend,
Does your 'external word clock' have coaxial input port like other DAC? If yes, theoretically the connection could work.
Best regards
TheOneInYellow
1000+ Head-Fier
Thank you for replying, and that's awesome!
The word clock that I am considering is TEAC CG-10M master clock, which has four gold-plated BNC (coaxial) connectors at 50 ohms each, and can be used to provide a clock for four devices.
The device can work on a DAC that supports a 10MHz input.
If the FiiO M17 meets the above requirements, then the CG-10M will be another purchase I would like to add, though I would like more info on setup within the M17 to utilise such clocks.
Thanks again for answering my unusual query and helping me @FiiO!
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