[LamerDeluxe (tm)]

@FiiO Team,

Please let me know if you had a chance to find the cause of the USB DAC 300ms delay and if it is possible to fix that with a firmware update.

Thank you!

I have the same issue, it makes the DAC unusable for creating music or indeed, as you note, watching videos. This was already an issue with my X7 MKII, which has a shorter delay with higher sample rates, which indicates that the buffer length is not adjusted for sample rate.

Meanwhile, both my Zorloo Ztella 1 and 2 have very low latency, without a custom driver, or even supporting ASIO and work fine for creating music. I don't remember my iBasso and Apple USB-C DACs having a large delay either.

 

[FiiO]

Dear @FiiO, am I able to bypass MQA decoding? I'm really experiencing jitter issues with MQA files. With coax, I can choose to spit bitstream rather than MQA decoded and it somewhat fixes the issue. But when using PO/LO, I have no option but to endure those poor quality decoding, with lots of random micro popping noises and the bass is underwhelming with lack of fullness and weight. I though this issue will be solved in 3.1.0 but unfortunately it still exists.

EDIT: found a workaround in the meantime. I used Neutron and now I don't hear any popping noises anywhere. FiiO Music player is important to me though as I often use its FiiO Link feature so I control my M11+ thru my phone instead of needing to physically fiddle with it.

Dear friend,

Do you mean that when playing MQA file via the FiiO Music app, you would hear some noise sometimes? Thanks in advanced!

@FiiO
Found an issue regarding MQA playback
Basically when using 4.4 PO, if 3.5 is set to SPDIF, it seems to not unpack MQA. When 3.5 is set to PO / LO it unpacks the MQA file. I hope when engineers take a look at this issue, the occasional jittery playback (especially for unpacked MQA playback) will be resolved as well.



I know that's not how it's supposed to be but right now I appreciate having the option to not unpack the MQAs at 4.4 PO (just toggle the spdif for 3.5) when it's currently having popping noise issues when unpacking MQA's but I hope this gets resolved soon together with the occasional jitters.

Would you mind sending this music file to us for check? Thanks in advanced!

Best regards

 

[FiiO]

@FiiO Team,

Please let me know if you had a chance to find the cause of the USB DAC 300ms delay and if it is possible to fix that with a firmware update.

Thank you!

Dear friend,

We have reported to the engineer to check about that. And his test the delay is about 200ms for M11 Plus. But since this test is depended by human hearing, it is also subjective. What does this delay affect most in your daily usage? We will try to test more and check whether we could have better improvement about that. Thanks in advanced!

Best regards

 

[FiiO]

@FiiO

Thanks for the recent updates to the M11 Plus LTD and FiiO music app. A few things would be great:

1. Global EQ (I think you are already looking into this).
2. Can we get a battery option to NOT fast charge? Samsung has Android options for this.
3. DSD gapless creates clicks going from track to track. PCM is fine. Can this be fixed?
4. Settings-Global-Auto-rotate screen is NOT an auto-rotate feature. It just rotates and does nothing when you move the device. Perhaps just call it Rotate screen as it is NOT automatic.
5. Can we please get a composer search (not sort) option in FiiO player app? Right now there are Track, Artist, Album, Genre, and Folder options. If you do not want to add Composer as an additional option because it would mess up the screen, then perhaps permit the final option (currently Folder) to be a custom menu option. It could have Folder, Composer, Performer, and Year options that we the user could select (I'd choose Composer). This should be an easy add.

Thank you for reading!

Dear friend,

Thanks for the kind feedback.
1. We will report the 1-2,5 to engineers for assessing.
2. What DSD file is having this problem? ISO with CUE or DSF/DFF file?
3. We will report to the engineer for adjusting this translation.

Best regards

 

[Cheerfu1]

Dear friend,

We have reported to the engineer to check about that. And his test the delay is about 200ms for M11 Plus. But since this test is depended by human hearing, it is also subjective. What does this delay affect most in your daily usage? We will try to test more and check whether we could have better improvement about that. Thanks in advanced!

Best regards

Hello @FiiO Team, @JamesFiiO,

Previously in this thread you mentioned that the delay was below 100ms, so the 200ms admission is a move in the right direction.
However, the real delays is not 200 but 300ms and it was proven with a slow motion (240fps) recording that captured both video and audio (see below). The second half of the video shows that the laptop internal speakers play sound with 0ms delay. This clearly shows that in M11 Plus in USB DAC mode takes 300ms to reproduce the sound after it is played. So with a slow motion capture it is precisely proven and not dependent on human hearing.

I use USB DAC mode in 50% of the cases.

1. When I watch a video with people speaking in front of the camera it feels like the audio is coming from a different source because the speech does not match the lips movement.
2. Any video, game or anything else that shows actions on the screen and plays sound looks akward, because 0.3 sec sound delay is quite significant.
3. As @LamerDeluxe (tm) mentioned above, he wants to use DAC mode for music creation and also finds such delay unacceptable.

If you watch the video below again carefully, you will see that in USB DAC mode the sound is reproduced with 300ms delay (first half), laptop speakers - 0ms delay (second half).
I may be wrong, but as a software engineer I believe that this is a firmware or dac driver problem rather than a hardware limitation, and can be fixed.

Thanks again for looking into this problem.

 

[beomonk]

Hello @FiiO Team, @JamesFiiO,

Previously in this thread you mentioned that the delay was below 100ms, so the 200ms admission is a move in the right direction.
However, the real delays is not 200 but 300ms and it was proven with a slow motion (240fps) recording that captured both video and audio (see below). The second half of the video shows that the laptop internal speakers play sound with 0ms delay. This clearly shows that in M11 Plus in USB DAC mode takes 300ms to reproduce the sound after it is played. So with a slow motion capture it is precisely proven and not dependent on human hearing.

I use USB DAC mode in 50% of the cases.

1. When I watch a video with people speaking in front of the camera it feels like the audio is coming from a different source because the speech does not match the lips movement.
2. Any video, game or anything else that shows actions on the screen and plays sound looks akward, because 0.3 sec sound delay is quite significant.
3. As @LamerDeluxe (tm) mentioned above, he wants to use DAC mode for music creation and also finds such delay unacceptable.

If you watch the video below again carefully, you will see that in USB DAC mode the sound is reproduced with 300ms delay (first half), laptop speakers - 0ms delay (second half).
I may be wrong, but as a software engineer I believe that this is a firmware or dac driver problem rather than a hardware limitation, and can be fixed.

Thanks again for looking into this problem.

Shanling DAPs also have a 100-150ms delay in USB DAC mode (this is confirmed by Shanling rep on head-fi). This delay is already enough for lip sync to be significantly off for me (M3X). If it is truly <100ms like FiiO previously said, it would be a drastic improvement. I asked Shanling about this delay on the upcoming sub-flagship M7 and it is also present.

@FiiO does M11 Plus decode MQA in USB DAC mode?

 

[ron spencer]

Dear friend,

Thanks for the kind feedback.
1. We will report the 1-2,5 to engineers for assessing.
2. What DSD file is having this problem? ISO with CUE or DSF/DFF file?
3. We will report to the engineer for adjusting this translation.

Best regards

@FiiO

With regards to the DSD (your 2 quoted above), they are DSF files. For music that needs to be gapless (i.e., live music) you can hear the click. For regular DSD (DSF) music that starts and has an ending, this is not an issue.

Thanks!

 

[SRKRAM]

Hello @FiiO Team, @JamesFiiO,

Previously in this thread you mentioned that the delay was below 100ms, so the 200ms admission is a move in the right direction.
However, the real delays is not 200 but 300ms and it was proven with a slow motion (240fps) recording that captured both video and audio (see below). The second half of the video shows that the laptop internal speakers play sound with 0ms delay. This clearly shows that in M11 Plus in USB DAC mode takes 300ms to reproduce the sound after it is played. So with a slow motion capture it is precisely proven and not dependent on human hearing.

I use USB DAC mode in 50% of the cases.

1. When I watch a video with people speaking in front of the camera it feels like the audio is coming from a different source because the speech does not match the lips movement.
2. Any video, game or anything else that shows actions on the screen and plays sound looks akward, because 0.3 sec sound delay is quite significant.
3. As @LamerDeluxe (tm) mentioned above, he wants to use DAC mode for music creation and also finds such delay unacceptable.

If you watch the video below again carefully, you will see that in USB DAC mode the sound is reproduced with 300ms delay (first half), laptop speakers - 0ms delay (second half).
I may be wrong, but as a software engineer I believe that this is a firmware or dac driver problem rather than a hardware limitation, and can be fixed.

Thanks again for looking into this problem.

The delay of the device itself should be quite deterministic, but I wondered how much of the delay you are experiencing is due the PC. Have you tried the same test using a different source, like a phone to see if the delay is any different?
I would test this myself, but I sold both of my M11 Plus's.

 

[Cheerfu1]

The delay of the device itself should be quite deterministic, but I wondered how much of the delay you are experiencing is due the PC. Have you tried the same test using a different source, like a phone to see if the delay is any different?
I would test this myself, but I sold both of my M11 Plus's.

In my message I explained that this is a comparison video - second half with the speakers shows 0 ms.
The same test was repeated by FiiO support and they sent me their video recoding that shows exactly the same result 300ms.

 

[autoexec]

In my message I explained that this is a comparison video - second half with the speakers shows 0 ms.
The same test was repeated by FiiO support and they sent me their video recoding that shows exactly the same result 300ms.

I think he meant another device, such as using your phone as transport instead of PC. Or even a different DAC to use with your PC to compare.

 

[Sven2015]

My hiby r6 new gone..... I'm very satisfied with my M17...as next I bought the M11 plus for mobile using....
Can anyone post the cover inside the M11 plus package, pls?
I'm searching for a TPU cover but I found it only in china stores or aliexpress...not in european stores....

 

[m31asy]

The BTR5 Dac for 130 Euro has no delay, so why a M11 Plus ESS 700 Euro Dap with Dac has a such bad delay. I wanted to view a Concert on ipad with balanced earphones, but the delay. was that worse i stopped it.
Same on Desktop Windows 10 PC, Notebook and IPad Pro 12.9" 2020. Tested with Cable and bluetooth.
Maybe you can fix that in the future.
Thank you

 

[Cheerfu1]

The BTR5 Dac for 130 Euro has no delay, so why a M11 Plus ESS 700 Euro Dap with Dac has a such bad delay. I wanted to view a Concert on ipad with balanced earphones, but the delay. was that worse i stopped it.
Same on Desktop Windows 10 PC, Notebook and IPad Pro 12.9" 2020. Tested with Cable and bluetooth.
Maybe you can fix that in the future.
Thank you

Yeah, the same problem I have. Simply can't watch videos in DAC mode. Because of the delay it feels like the audio comes from a different source.

 

[theElk]

@FiiO is HWA/LHDC implemented in the Android10 base of the M11 plus series? UTWS5 with LHDC would be interesting for some mid-tier IEMs with LHDC with a source that works with 3rd-Party Apps (Quoboz, Tidal, AppleMusic and other 3rd-party player-apps)
LHDC/HWA is mentioned nowhere in the official listings, only AAC, SBC, Apt-x, LDAC.

 

[AMerePerson]

Hi, when I try running some non music Apps on this device, I’m having an issue where the sample rate is set to 192kHz and the sound doesn’t work.

To further continue the bug reporting,

I reset my device and was able to get the (game) app audio working. This problem came back on reset. While the audio was working, it seemed like the sample rate was still 192kHz, so that's probably not the issue. Regardless, the audio issues persist after further reboots. I hope this information can be of use to develop this product further.