[yaps66]

Great write up. Currently have the RN6 and waiting on the Maestro. But I do have the Scarletts and know they hit harder then the RN6 currently. The Maestro SE should hopefully show up in the next few weeks. Ordered in December. So we will see lol.

Nice! Congratulations on the MSE and hope they arrive soon! I love my MSEs!

 

[Petalpusher06]

Nice! Congratulations on the MSE and hope they arrive soon! I love my MSEs!

This is a beautiful combination, i initially wanted exactly this swirl combo! For my upcoming GM in the end i went with the Cherise 4x and 6x for easy recognition of left and right. Will see in about 3 weeks how it turns out as i haven't seen real pics of this particular design.

 

[Silantr0]

This is a beautiful combination, i initially wanted exactly this swirl combo! For my upcoming GM in the end i went with the Cherise 4x and 6x for easy recognition of left and right. Will see in about 3 weeks how it turns out as i haven't seen real pics of this particular design.

Great choice of design, the cherise series is definitely one of my favourite faceplate designs from Fatfreq by far . Definitely looks better in-person compared to the pictures based on what I saw in their showroom.

 

[Sebastien Chiu]

Isn't it the same for the MEST series and Kinera Loki?

Same for MEST but Loki is using subbass BCD

They are similar but are implemented differently and cover different frequency ranges.

My comparison with the RN6 for anyone interested


RN6 (red filter)
Thicker in the mid/low mid
Closer sounding overall, hence vocals more forward, instruments only slightly, in general
Feels a tad more congestionned, less airy on busy passages (less drivers could show here)
Can hit very hard too, tight attacks, good sub extensions (but sometimes on the verge of boomy)
Little depth but good soundstage, wide and not agressive (like some UM are borderline with that)
Slightly shouty on some tracks, otherwise great tonality
A bit more dynamic contrasts, can be enjoyable but makes it a more intense listening experience

Maestro (without any EQ)
Feels a bit more distant
Low mids just right, not thin or too thick, in comparison
Better vocals, more texture/micro details, yet smoother
Bass attack, slightly better, tigher but with even more sub than the RN6, not boomy but it's a lot imo
Some slight harshness on high frequency percusions (very track dependant and tips)
A bit narrower soundstage but sounds bigger, and i would say it could be more precise in that narrower space



I would have hard time picking a winner if it had to be only one at this point. With my little EQ plateau for the sub on the Maestro, i would give it the nod as it's the closest to my ideal presentation but it's entirely a preference more than fundamentaly better technicalities. Those are slight differences, they are a bit better at different things and as i previously mentionned surprisingly similar in the end. Maestro might be a more relaxed experience outside bass, everything is less forward, except the bass region.
I think equal amount of people would find more musical either one or the other. My personal bias is still the Maestro, it's how i would have tracks mixed and sound like, makes me dance in my head all the time... 2 fantastic sets regardless, can't go wrong with those and i still have to explore further the filters on the RN6 (they are so scaringly small to swap!). Although i forgot the RN6 is almost double the price than a MSE!

I should get the Canpur end of next week to compare. Final death match incoming.

Might go custom after that. I should also mention the RN6 is a smaller shell but i find it less comfortable of all the sets i have strangely, it's a hard shell and a bit more rough than typical resine shell, also more angular. I wonder even if it's the shell notch for the filter that is scratching my ear in some ways, i get soared after a while with them for some reasons. Also not a fan of the cable, it's a bit stiff and not super comfy near the ear hook area. Good side is there is less pressure building than the Maestro, due to the big vent. RN6 is super easy to drive, again in comparison to the MSE. Got caught a few times swapping them on the headamp with too much level for the Maestro...(about double)


ps: wrote way more than planned

Adding the MKIII for this next round

It's no slouch compared to the other two, closer than i thought before comparing them A,B,C all together. It's definetly on the thinner side in the low mid, which reinforces me into thinking the MSE strikes the perfect balance in this area (RN6 is thicker). The soundstage on the MEST is obviously bigger, a good step wider than the RN6, which is only a bit larger than the MSE. Instruments sound great on the MEST, vocals are fine but not to the level of RN6, or MSE which are often to die for. The bass of the MEST is on the slower side, and the sub bass can get a little boomy too but there is less of it than both MSE and RN6. It's still a very enjoyable bass, more shy on chill genres, that can also hit hard on more electro or pop tracks. Only when compared to the other 2 monsters, it shows a little weakness there.
I should have added previously as well that RN6 highs are absolutely beautifully done, they are smooth, never tingling, you really have to push unreasonable levels for them to begin to get offensive even on tracks that are know for it, it's probably the best highs of the 3 ultimately. If you are into trebles, you ll love this set i think. It's so good that i forgot about them (which is the best sign). They actually remind me of the focal's beryllium highs and that's a big compliment in my book. All that with one EST, some accoustic voodoo going on there in the RN6.

I had to check a couple of times to make sure but yes the RN6 is even easier to drive than the MEST, it's not 2times less power you need (on a db dial) compared to the MSE but more like x2.5 or even 3x! Insane how efficient those are in relation to the big sound they produce (and how hungry the MSE is).

Complete explanation here. Thanks a lot. Also the suggestion. Very clear.

Yes, thanks for the comparisons! Very helpful for those who want to compare the RN6 to MSE.

Nice! Congratulations on the MSE and hope they arrive soon! I love my MSEs!

Thanks @yaps66! Appreciate your support as always.

This is a beautiful combination, i initially wanted exactly this swirl combo! For my upcoming GM in the end i went with the Cherise 4x and 6x for easy recognition of left and right. Will see in about 3 weeks how it turns out as i haven't seen real pics of this particular design.

Great choice of design, the cherise series is definitely one of my favourite faceplate designs from Fatfreq by far . Definitely looks better in-person compared to the pictures based on what I saw in their showroom.

Cherise options are awesome! I nearly went with those for my GM. Yeah, the pictures do not really show the awesome textures that these handmade faceplates have.

 

[Petalpusher06]

A little report on the GM with different modules compared to the MSE:

I have 4 of them, the blue in resin and metal, and black also in resin and metal (Resin blue on the shells here)

Black is more bassy, blue less, as a baseline. MSE is still more bassy than GM on black.

Metal modules give a tighter bass with more extension and a bit larger stage/imaging. Slightly increasing the perception of resolution as a result (think 5-10%)
Resin modules give a more analog rounded bass with less high extensions and more focused staged. Slightly more laidback vocals.

Again, while the color is very noticable, the difference between the two materials is a bit more subtle.

"Resin blue" is closest to my preference and very close to the MSE's sound with less bass. Pretty much the EQ i did on it is blue resin on the GM, so that's neat if you don't want to touch anything. I don't feel i need to EQ anything anymore with it. Metal modules are also interesting, actually sounds more like the Canpur and its insane resolution but could be a bit too "digital" and little fatiguing for prolonged listening.
Main difference with the MSE per say, is that vocals are ever so slightly more forward on all modules and stage is a bit wider. Pressure building is gone and that might be the biggest upgrade for comfort.

Vocal switch is a neat feature i would say if on occasion you watch movies or listen to podcast etc.. but i wouldn't use it on music personally. I like the more laidback vocals and mids presentation which strikes the right balance to me.

Is it the best set i currently have? Yes. I think also due to the fact you can tailor it to your liking that much specifically in the bass region. I think FF did the right thing with the GM, the MSE has an enormous amount of bass which i found a little too much, to the point it is overpowering for some genres even for a basshead. The GM remedies that with a module of your choice that can hit your sweet spot, with some subtilities along the lines on how exactly you want your bass, not just the level of it. On the other hand, if you really like a lot of bass, you get 90-95% of the GM at a more "reasonable" price with a MSE.

I must add finally the modules are very handy to swap, it's a 10s process, as you just pull them with your nails and they are not too tiny, so that could be a thing that depending on the mood, one day you can put the more bassy modules. Easy in comparison to the atom swap operation on the RN6 for example.

 

[SCYJ]

Metal modules give a tighter bass with more extension and a bit larger stage/imaging. Slightly increasing the perception of resolution as a result (think 5-10%)
Resin modules give a more analog rounded bass with less high extensions and more focused staged. Slightly more laidback vocals.

Do you think the slight increase in resolution perception from the metal modules are only on the highs? Or the mids as well?

 

[KinGensai]

Do you think the slight increase in resolution perception from the metal modules are only on the highs? Or the mids as well?

Well, the sound reflection coefficient of metal tends to be higher than resin. Given the same dimensions, the metal modules would reflect approximately 97% of the sound that hits it (taking the general number from the SRC of steel, which is 0.03) vs whatever the resin is absorbing vs reflecting (resin varies more based on how it's made, have to wonder if FF even bothered measuring the SRC of either of the modules).

 

[Petalpusher06]

Well, the sound reflection coefficient of metal tends to be higher than resin. Given the same dimensions, the metal modules would reflect approximately 97% of the sound that hits it (taking the general number from the SRC of steel, which is 0.03) vs whatever the resin is absorbing vs reflecting (resin varies more based on how it's made, have to wonder if FF even bothered measuring the SRC of either of the modules).

There s a also a difference in the aperture of the module for the blue on the inside (both resin and metal), it's smaller, something like half.

Do you think the slight increase in resolution perception from the metal modules are only on the highs? Or the mids as well?

Both i would say but that might be solely due to a perception and just more highs. Interestingly i don't think it's more offensive in the high mid/highs compared to the Maestro, which on occasion can be for some, depending on everyone's own sensitivity, so the GM is probably tuned a bit different yet feels a tad brighter and mids more forward. I think this is the only IEM i ve ever heard i wonder what could be improved or tuned differently for my taste, once you put the module you like the most, i don't have a lot of answers... The Canpur is also very amazing, but i would make it ever so slightly warmer in the mids to nitpick to the extreme. The GM i keep wondering... yes maybe the trick that Canpur does in the lowest depth of sub bass but the GM hammers so hard as well, it's just a more conventionnal type of humpf.

 

[SCYJ]

Both i would say but that might be solely due to a perception and just more highs. Interestingly i don't think it's more offensive in the high mid/highs compared to the Maestro, which on occasion can be for some, depending on everyone's own sensitivity, so the GM is probably tuned a bit different yet feels a tad brighter and mids more forward. I think this is the only IEM i ve ever heard i wonder what could be improved or tuned differently for my taste, once you put the module you like the most, i don't have a lot of answers... The Canpur is also very amazing, but i would make it ever so slightly warmer in the mids to nitpick to the extreme. The GM i keep wondering... yes maybe the trick that Canpur does in the lowest depth of sub bass but the GM hammers so hard as well, it's just a more conventionnal type of humpf.

I should be getting my CIEM GM within the next 2-3 weeks or so (already waited 3 months from purchase date and it's apparently in final stages). I demo-ed the Uni GM in CanJam and I couldn't think of anything I'd change about it other than a little spicy treble. I even had an amazingly deep and comfy fit, but it was a little sibilant. Hopefully it's tuned a little less sibilant for my CIEM.

I listen to alot of vocals so I was worried about the "recessed" mids that's said around here (even if it wasn't noticeably recessed from my demo memory).

 

[Petalpusher06]

I should be getting my CIEM GM within the next 2-3 weeks or so (already waited 3 months from purchase date and it's apparently in final stages). I demo-ed the Uni GM in CanJam and I couldn't think of anything I'd change about it other than a little spicy treble. I even had an amazingly deep and comfy fit, but it was a little sibilant. Hopefully it's tuned a little less sibilant for my CIEM.

I listen to alot of vocals so I was worried about the "recessed" mids that's said around here (even if it wasn't noticeably recessed from my demo memory).

The custom might be better on that. (do you remember which module it had on?) For me it's not sibilant or harsh on attacks but i believe we perceive things a bit different on that, definetly compared to my other iems it's not. All the UM are more, and also more tuby and resonant for example, i find it very obvious when i switch back and forth. I think only the Canpur could possibly be better on that (like 2-3%), again mega nitpicking, but vocals don't have the same weight on the other hand.

The GM will put the vocals a bit more forward compared to the Maestro, i initially found them a little too recessed on the MSE at first but also thought it often gave a very beautiful vibe to some vocal oriented tracks.

 

[SCYJ]

The custom might be better on that. (do you remember which module it had on?) For me it's not sibilant or harsh on attacks but i believe we perceive things a bit different on that, definetly compared to my other iems it's not. All the UM are more, and also more tuby and resonant for example, i find it very obvious when i switch back and forth. I think only the Canpur could possibly be better on that (like 2-3%), again mega nitpicking, but vocals don't have the same weight on the other hand.

The GM will put the vocals a bit more forward compared to the Maestro, i initially found them a little too recessed on the MSE at first but also thought it often gave a very beautiful vibe to some vocal oriented tracks.

It had the black module on. I tried both vocal on/off modes. I really liked both, but the vocal off just gave a more grandiose presentation of music. But similar to the Uni MSE, I did hear some sibilance, despite both fitting my ear canals like a custom. Oddly enough, FF showed me my CIEM shell shape, and it seems shallower than the Uni one, so perhaps the super deep fit I got with the universal models was abnormally deep and caused some unintended treble peaks that might not be there with a shallower fit? I'm not entirely sure about the science behind this. I did think the GM might not have been good for longer, relaxed listening sessions due to it's brightness, but thats with the Universal model.

 

[Petalpusher06]

It had the black module on. I tried both vocal on/off modes. I really liked both, but the vocal off just gave a more grandiose presentation of music. But similar to the Uni MSE, I did hear some sibilance, despite both fitting my ear canals like a custom. Oddly enough, FF showed me my CIEM shell shape, and it seems shallower than the Uni one, so perhaps the super deep fit I got with the universal models was abnormally deep and caused some unintended treble peaks that might not be there with a shallower fit? I'm not entirely sure about the science behind this. I did think the GM might not have been good for longer, relaxed listening sessions due to it's brightness, but thats with the Universal model.

I think the black modules are a bit more intense, not only on bass. That's why i prefer both blue, resin is more relaxed, blue metal is more resolving, brighter and tighter. I like both now, you might like blue resin more.
With a better fit you get a thicker sound in my experience so in a way other things than the highs will dominate more, it's like on universal when you push the nozzle deeper. Also tips can make a significant difference on universal, to some extent cables too. I didn't like (faint difference) the upgrade 8core cable, so currently using the gold 4 cores instead. (also tried a few others)

 

[SCYJ]

I think the black modules are a bit more intense, not only on bass. That's why i prefer both blue, resin is more relaxed, blue metal is more resolving, brighter and tighter. I like both now, you might like blue resin more.
With a better fit you get a thicker sound in my experience so in a way other things than the highs will dominate more, it's like on universal when you push the nozzle deeper. Also tips can make a significant difference on universal, to some extent cables too. I didn't like (faint difference) the upgrade 8core cable, so currently using the gold 4 cores instead. (also tried a few others)

Hmmm, the demo unit I tried didnt have the blue modules. From graphs it seems the blue module's treble is similar to black's, only change is in bass. if anything, the Black should be less intensed in terms of brightness. My only issue is the treble brightness.

What cable are you using? The stock silver colour or the upgraded gold colour? I already have an Eletech Raphael that apparently tames the brightness and brings the mids up, so I'm looking forward to see how the Raphael works with the GM.

 

[Petalpusher06]

Hmmm, the demo unit I tried didnt have the blue modules. From graphs it seems the blue module's treble is similar to black's, only change is in bass. if anything, the Black should be less intensed in terms of brightness. My only issue is the treble brightness.

What cable are you using? The stock silver colour or the upgraded gold colour? I already have an Eletech Raphael that apparently tames the brightness and brings the mids up, so I'm looking forward to see how the Raphael works with the GM.

The gold 4 cores. Not the gold 8cores that i find a little too thick sounding. I have the eletech socrates with the canpur and anything else i tried was not as "good" (it's very minute), but i didn't plug this one on the GM.

 

[Echo42987]

A little report on the GM with different modules compared to the MSE:

I have 4 of them, the blue in resin and metal, and black also in resin and metal (Resin blue on the shells here)

Black is more bassy, blue less, as a baseline. MSE is still more bassy than GM on black.

Metal modules give a tighter bass with more extension and a bit larger stage/imaging. Slightly increasing the perception of resolution as a result (think 5-10%)
Resin modules give a more analog rounded bass with less high extensions and more focused staged. Slightly more laidback vocals.

Again, while the color is very noticable, the difference between the two materials is a bit more subtle.

"Resin blue" is closest to my preference and very close to the MSE's sound with less bass. Pretty much the EQ i did on it is blue resin on the GM, so that's neat if you don't want to touch anything. I don't feel i need to EQ anything anymore with it. Metal modules are also interesting, actually sounds more like the Canpur and its insane resolution but could be a bit too "digital" and little fatiguing for prolonged listening.
Main difference with the MSE per say, is that vocals are ever so slightly more forward on all modules and stage is a bit wider. Pressure building is gone and that might be the biggest upgrade for comfort.

Vocal switch is a neat feature i would say if on occasion you watch movies or listen to podcast etc.. but i wouldn't use it on music personally. I like the more laidback vocals and mids presentation which strikes the right balance to me.

Is it the best set i currently have? Yes. I think also due to the fact you can tailor it to your liking that much specifically in the bass region. I think FF did the right thing with the GM, the MSE has an enormous amount of bass which i found a little too much, to the point it is overpowering for some genres even for a basshead. The GM remedies that with a module of your choice that can hit your sweet spot, with some subtilities along the lines on how exactly you want your bass, not just the level of it. On the other hand, if you really like a lot of bass, you get 90-95% of the GM at a more "reasonable" price with a MSE.

I must add finally the modules are very handy to swap, it's a 10s process, as you just pull them with your nails and they are not too tiny, so that could be a thing that depending on the mood, one day you can put the more bassy modules. Easy in comparison to the atom swap operation on the RN6 for example.

With how much I Enjoy the Scarletts, I'm really counting down the days until I get the Maestro SE. Which if I enjoy those as much as I think I'm going to, a custom pair of Grand Maestro will be on the list next. How hard are these to drive? Pretty similar to the others? I'm noticing my basic Sony DAP isn't enough. So I've been using the mojo2 to help drive the Scarletts.