[Mcleenx]

First of all, I would like to apologize for not explaining the development history and design philosophy of UM's dual flagships to everyone. Here is a recently compiled list of the updates to Mason and Mentor over the years, which I hope will better illustrate how UM's dual flagship products have evolved over the years. Because AP was a product developed by UM in cooperation with Cayin and sold exclusively by Cayin, it was not included in the UM product yearbook.



The Mason series has always been UM's Statement product, and the design and development process is to spare no expense, to concentrate the best resources we can call on. For each generation of Mason, we equip him with the latest technology, introduce the best cables we can mix and match, use the most advanced shell processing technology, and cooperate with newly designed top accessories. Therefore, the original intention of Mason's development is not to find market demand and develop products accordingly, but to challenge the ceiling of IEMs performance, technology, and creativity. Mason is not a simple IEM, but a reference-grade listening solution in our current understanding.

The Mentor series was originally positioned as a secondary flagship with reduced techs from Mason, and we have continued for 4 generations. But with the fifth generation MM, we changed our thinking. The development of MM was first guided by the market. We extracted the listening preferences of audiophiles from global media and forums and conducted quantitative summaries. Based on the listening preferences of the general public, combined with the framework structure of the flagship series with BA driver as the main body, MM was developed. This is also why the first four generations of Mason and Mentor were released simultaneously, while the fifth generation Mentor was released nearly two years later than Mason.

Compared with Mason, we did not give Mentor the top cable, we controlled the price and also gave audiophiles more space to match the cables by themselves. It has been proven that even though the MM and FS look similar, the sound is completely different. One thing is certain: the draft of the next generation of Mentor has not been drawn yet, and it will not be a simple Mason-reduced work. I am also looking forward to the new Mentor, but let me first recover from the stunning experience brought to me by Mason NE/ST.

The sound performance of the new Mason is still worth a try. I was shocked beyond words when I listened to the prototype when I visited the UM headquarters in December. I understand that not every audiophile is willing to pay a high price to own it, but I think it would be a pity if an audiophile missed the opportunity to listen to the new Mason. It is very special. Canjam NYC is coming soon, and I will be waiting for everyone there with the new Mason.

P.S. Now UM's technical department director Sam is by my side. I accompanied him to the Shot Show with UM's hearing protection sister company. He is one of the creators of BC-Turbo. If you have any questions, I can answer them on the spot.

I must say, I feel incredibly fortunate to be one of the 99 lucky buyers of Amber Pearl. Honestly, I absolutely adore them!

Speaking of money, I'm not rolling in it, but I put in a lot of effort to live comfortably. It took me quite a few months to recover from the cost of the AP.

About two weeks ago, I reached out to your customer support via email to inquire about the process and timeframe for getting a CIEM version. Unfortunately, I haven't received a response yet.

I wanted to share this with you here because I've noticed that some companies nowadays solely focus on selling their products and tend to forget about the importance of customer support. It's all about the complete package if you truly want to succeed, you know?

As you can see from this forum, nobody has anything negative to say about the sound of your products, but many are startled by the prices. And now, I'm adding the topic of customer support integration to the mix. Hopefully, this little comment will help you see things from the customer's perspective.

 

[zoidbb]

First of all, I would like to apologize for not explaining the development history and design philosophy of UM's dual flagships to everyone. Here is a recently compiled list of the updates to Mason and Mentor over the years, which I hope will better illustrate how UM's dual flagship products have evolved over the years. Because AP was a product developed by UM in cooperation with Cayin and sold exclusively by Cayin, it was not included in the UM product yearbook.



The Mason series has always been UM's Statement product, and the design and development process is to spare no expense, to concentrate the best resources we can call on. For each generation of Mason, we equip him with the latest technology, introduce the best cables we can mix and match, use the most advanced shell processing technology, and cooperate with newly designed top accessories. Therefore, the original intention of Mason's development is not to find market demand and develop products accordingly, but to challenge the ceiling of IEMs performance, technology, and creativity. Mason is not a simple IEM, but a reference-grade listening solution in our current understanding.

The Mentor series was originally positioned as a secondary flagship with reduced techs from Mason, and we have continued for 4 generations. But with the fifth generation MM, we changed our thinking. The development of MM was first guided by the market. We extracted the listening preferences of audiophiles from global media and forums and conducted quantitative summaries. Based on the listening preferences of the general public, combined with the framework structure of the flagship series with BA driver as the main body, MM was developed. This is also why the first four generations of Mason and Mentor were released simultaneously, while the fifth generation Mentor was released nearly two years later than Mason.

Compared with Mason, we did not give Mentor the top cable, we controlled the price and also gave audiophiles more space to match the cables by themselves. It has been proven that even though the MM and FS look similar, the sound is completely different. One thing is certain: the draft of the next generation of Mentor has not been drawn yet, and it will not be a simple Mason-reduced work. I am also looking forward to the new Mentor, but let me first recover from the stunning experience brought to me by Mason NE/ST.

The sound performance of the new Mason is still worth a try. I was shocked beyond words when I listened to the prototype when I visited the UM headquarters in December. I understand that not every audiophile is willing to pay a high price to own it, but I think it would be a pity if an audiophile missed the opportunity to listen to the new Mason. It is very special. Canjam NYC is coming soon, and I will be waiting for everyone there with the new Mason.

P.S. Now UM's technical department director Sam is by my side. I accompanied him to the Shot Show with UM's hearing protection sister company. He is one of the creators of BC-Turbo. If you have any questions, I can answer them on the spot.

What’s the difference between the two models? Just color?

 

[vikinguy]

Last thing can someone eloborate with me something? People are talking about how good this iems about but everytime they talk one thing is missing out. What is the sound signature of these iems? Why they stand out from others? I have no time nor money to check out these facts. Most people dislike Crinacle but there is one thing he does good about it defining the sound signature.

Afterall people seek their most desired sound signature with most detail they can get. Some people seek uber resolution,some people seek more bodied presentation with most detail they can get.

I am wondering just this when you put these iems to less desired digital audio players or digital to analog converters how do these sound? What is the difference on small scale and big scale?

People are trying expensive iems and expensive daps that TOTL together and they say it is the best. I will try only Bugatti and I will say it is the best experience in the world. Could someone compare these TOTL with same sound signature that is less detailed. So we can say that with these experiements it deserve the money or not? Not the manufacturer itself because he or she says so.


People are describing the sound like how good? That good.

I don’t dislike Crinacle. He’s a pretty funny dude. I just rarely agree with his opinions. I mean, isn’t Monarch mkii still number 1 on his list? That’s just laughable.

I have zero doubt this new UM set sounds great but I doubt it’s better than Mentor.

The UM gentlemen has a tough job on this thread. I don’t envy him. At all. lol

 

[CharlyBrown]

I don’t dislike Crinacle. He’s a pretty funny dude. I just rarely agree with his opinions. I mean, isn’t Monarch mkii still number 1 on his list? That’s just laughable.

I have zero doubt this new UM set sounds great but I doubt it’s better than Mentor.

The UM gentlemen has a tough job on this thread. I don’t envy him. At all. lol

No, it’s not the Monarch anymore.

Crins taste and list is not „the law“, it is only his opinion and he writes and says this everytime and everywhere.
I for one agree with many but not all rankings in his list.

Other than that there are few people in the IEM world I trust equally or even more than Crinacle. The guy is extremely smart imo.

 

[vikinguy]

No, it’s not the Monarch anymore.

Crins taste and list is not „the law“, it is only his opinion and he writes and says this everytime and everywhere.
I for one agree with many but not all rankings in his list.

Other than that there are few people in the IEM world I trust equally or even more than Crinacle. The guy is extremely smart imo.

What’s he got up there S tier? Everytime I try to look all the adware locks my computer up. And yes, I understand the list. But in many ways he was able to literally make or break the sales of iems. Both new and used.


I def think he’s smart and like I said, he’s very funny.

He’s the probably the guy I agree least with though.

 

[hbcke]

What’s he got up there S tier? Everytime I try to look all the adware locks my computer up. And yes, I understand the list. But in many ways he was able to literally make or break the sales of iems. Both new and used.


I def think he’s smart and like I said, he’s very funny.

He’s the probably the guy I agree least with though.

You are right about he has that power and used it many times. Main reason when I took him as reviewer that he gives idea about sound prefences or sound signatures used in the in ear monitor or headphone. Generally when someone reviews something they used some words to define sound signature. When describing something like warm neutral,they say full bodied mid response. In general reviewers lose that part and talks about relatively another in ear monitor where you can not get the full idea of what is the sound of the in ear monitor if you do not know the what is the signature of the relatively mentioned in ear monitor you can't make up on your mind.

I know to take someone as a reference point can cause mistakes but other reviewers do not give any idea about the sound signature.

Why is the sound signature is important? Because in general headphones tuned some ways. V shaped,U shaped,Warm,Bright,Neutral,Balanced. These are the sound signatures used in tuning headphone. So some prefer U shaped over everything, some prefer neutral over everything. Some prefer detailed treble response and not give a damn about bass response these take reference as bright.

 

[Jacobal]

…

 

[OhmsClaw]

I think for a lot of people (including myself) it's less about sound signature and more about the markup and monthly product cycle.

The whales, especially in the Chinese market, will lap this stuff up and UM will continue to push the 'how much can we charge' strategy for artificial vavalue.

This is the correct take.
As someone mentioned above regarding other hobbies let's dive in;

Sailor makes very good fountain pens for a premium. They are Acrylic body at the end of the day and this is akin to them claiming they've revolutionized acrylics by mixing colors (this is already a thing), attached some bogus story from Japanese lore (use Amaterasu), named it the rising sun, then charged $5,000 for a plastic pen with the same 14K nib you get for $180 in a Pro Slim.

Someone will buy it. But this is ethically bankrupt.

What’s the difference between the two models? Just color?

Yes just the color, but by the marketing material it would appear as if they are different tunings with different back stories. It's why there's only one specs listing, just a color difference.

 

[vikinguy]

Could almost buy three Vision VEX flagships. Almost FIVE Fir Electron 12’s. Hahahahah.

 

[zoidbb]

Yes just the color, but by the marketing material it would appear as if they are different tunings with different back stories. It's why there's only one specs listing, just a color difference.

Ya that’s why I was confused, I thought maybe one was a darker tuning than the other or some crap. Thx for the clarification

 

[MN8372]

The one thing that bugs me is when people comment along the lines of ”just don’t buy it”. Or “people who complain about this IEM were never in the market to buy it in the first place”. It misses the point. I will happily admit I’m not in the market for these IEM’s. But they are still relevant to me and my interest in the hobby. If UM release an $8,500 IEM does that mean that other brands will lift the pricing of their next TOTL IEM from $4,000 to $6,000? If UM succeeds then yes they probably will! It’s the contagion effect on the whole market. Those $2k IEM’s will become $2.5k-3k. Trickle down doesn’t always work…. Those hoping that the new Mest will benefit from this new tech are being a little naive. The new Mest will surely go up in price too. I’ve seen very similar things happen with road bikes. TOTL road bikes now go for $15k+ and an entry level bike is now $3k+ (not $1k). Everything goes up. Fortunately the bike industry is getting its comeuppance and is now in a fair bit of trouble after the price-gouging during COVID...

All power to those that can afford/justify the expenditure. But rightly or wrongly their willingness to pay these big prices does damage the rest of the market and creates a lot of division in the hobby.

I don’t post often and usually look the other way about matters like this. But it does concern me where the hobby is going. Most people choose heaphones/IEM’s precisely because they offer much better value than 2 channel. But that value is diminishing rapidly.

Let’s hope that other brands like FIR and Campfire see things differently.

 

[phiemon]

The one thing that bugs me is when people comment along the lines of ”just don’t buy it”. Or “people who complain about this IEM were never in the market to buy it in the first place”. It misses the point. I will happily admit I’m not in the market for these IEM’s. But they are still relevant to me and my interest in the hobby. If UM release an $8,500 IEM does that mean that other brands will lift the pricing of their next TOTL IEM from $4,000 to $6,000? If UM succeeds then yes they probably will! It’s the contagion effect on the whole market. Those $2k IEM’s will become $2.5k-3k. Trickle down doesn’t always work…. Those hoping that the new Mest will benefit from this new tech are being a little naive. The new Mest will surely go up in price too. I’ve seen very similar things happen with road bikes. TOTL road bikes now go for $15k+ and an entry level bike is now $3k+ (not $1k). Everything goes up. Fortunately the bike industry is getting its comeuppance and is now in a fair bit of trouble after the price-gouging during COVID...

All power to those that can afford/justify the expenditure. But rightly or wrongly their willingness to pay these big prices does damage the rest of the market and creates a lot of division in the hobby.

I don’t post often and usually look the other way about matters like this. But it does concern me where the hobby is going. Most people choose heaphones/IEM’s precisely because they offer much better value than 2 channel. But that value is diminishing rapidly.

Let’s hope that other brands like FIR and Campfire see things differently.

This is exactly the point I was making. The market creates trends. But ultimately, we (!) consumers ensure that these trends are confirmed and maintained. If we now remain silent and accept such prices, it is clear that other companies would try to implement the same pricing policy. That would be obviously, and I would do the same myself. After all, the purpose of every such company is to earn as much money as possible. That is also the reason for my uproar and why I mentioned that it is in everyone's interest if we speak out in this case.

Whoever buys Mason FS, hurts us all.

 

[OhmsClaw]

The one thing that bugs me is when people comment along the lines of ”just don’t buy it”. Or “people who complain about this IEM were never in the market to buy it in the first place”. It misses the point. I will happily admit I’m not in the market for these IEM’s. But they are still relevant to me and my interest in the hobby. If UM release an $8,500 IEM does that mean that other brands will lift the pricing of their next TOTL IEM from $4,000 to $6,000? If UM succeeds then yes they probably will! It’s the contagion effect on the whole market. Those $2k IEM’s will become $2.5k-3k. Trickle down doesn’t always work…. Those hoping that the new Mest will benefit from this new tech are being a little naive. The new Mest will surely go up in price too. I’ve seen very similar things happen with road bikes. TOTL road bikes now go for $15k+ and an entry level bike is now $3k+ (not $1k). Everything goes up. Fortunately the bike industry is getting its comeuppance and is now in a fair bit of trouble after the price-gouging during COVID...

All power to those that can afford/justify the expenditure. But rightly or wrongly their willingness to pay these big prices does damage the rest of the market and creates a lot of division in the hobby.

I don’t post often and usually look the other way about matters like this. But it does concern me where the hobby is going. Most people choose heaphones/IEM’s precisely because they offer much better value than 2 channel. But that value is diminishing rapidly.

Let’s hope that other brands like FIR and Campfire see things differently.

Yessir.

If they put the silver palladium BCD in the MEST MK4 and added the micro-voltage tech, what's the actual difference between, 1899 IEM and an 8.5K IEM? Superfluous balanced armatures? (more isn't better when you can manage a cross-over) What if they add the micro-voltage tech but withhold the rare-earth BCD? still a hike to 3K? WHERE DOES IT END!!! *wilhelm scream*

The answer is, tuning on purpose creates a divide within their own line with the means, the know-how, and the purpose to differentiate their products. It's all arbitrary.

 

[Nago]

Pretty late to the party and many things have been said but I want to add a few things nonetheless: I noticed how many people here state that the "market" is behaving outrageous etc. and keep complainging about it. Sorry but thats scapegoating and nothing else Imo.
After all the market wont produce a thing if there is no demand for it (excluding the soft power of manipulative advertisement). UM only releases one "flagship" after the other because there are people buying it.

This leads us to the real/main problem here: Peoples obsession with having to own nothing but the best, the so called "TOTL".

Even if we were to ignore the fact that price and performance often dont correlate at all (tons of studies) its still pretty ridiculous. I just cant see a reason why so many of the community are obsessed with having to own the thing with the biggest price tag?! Is our ego really that fragile? Even more so since many IEMs with a 1k+ price tag are less resolving than some 50$ Chifi-IEMs. Reminds me of Salt Baes restaurant where mediocre food comes with a hefty price tag. Anyone mind explaining this to me?

So how about, instead of losing our minds about the newest & most outrageous 8k IEM, we ask ourselfs: "Why exactly are we even paying attention to a market that isnt meant for most of us?". Even if that means that we have to give up on being able to afford the most expensive IEM our there. In the end this is fairly easy task when it comes to cars, isnt it? Nobody complains about the price tag of a Lambo and nobody loses their mind because they cant afford to buy one.

 

[zoidbb]

Pretty late to the party and many things have been said but I want to add a few things nonetheless: I noticed how many people here state that the "market" is behaving outrageous etc. and keep complainging about it. Sorry but thats scapegoating and nothing else Imo.
After all the market wont produce a thing if there is no demand for it (excluding the soft power of manipulative advertisement). UM only releases one "flagship" after the other because there are people buying it.

This leads us to the real/main problem here: Peoples obsession with having to own nothing but the best, the so called "TOTL".

Even if we were to ignore the fact that price and performance often dont correlate at all (tons of studies) its still pretty ridiculous. I just cant see a reason why so many of the community are obsessed with having to own the thing with the biggest price tag?! Is our ego really that fragile? Even more so since many IEMs with a 1k+ price tag are less resolving than some 50$ Chifi-IEMs. Reminds me of Salt Baes restaurant where mediocre food comes with a hefty price tag. Anyone mind explaining this to me?

So how about, instead of losing our minds about the newest & most outrageous 8k IEM, we ask ourselfs: "Why exactly are we even paying attention to a market that isnt meant for most of us?". Even if that means that we have to give up on being able to afford the most expensive IEM out there. In the end this is fairly easy task when it comes to cars, isnt it? Nobody complains about the price tag of a Lambo and nobody loses their mind because they cant afford to buy one.

Isn’t the real problem that people think every release from UM is a flagship? Mason is their flagship line. There hasn’t been a new Mason since 2021.

There are a ton of people calling MM a flagship IEM, possibly due to the price — but it was never a flagship. Neither is MEST.

UM has multiple tiers ranging from now $8500 down to like $600. They release new models constantly because of how many tiers they maintain. I don’t see this as a bad thing, as we have seen consistent flow of new technology from the top to the bottom.

Those of us who can afford this $8500 absurd IEM now are basically subsidizing the R&D cost of the new tech for its future inclusion in future IEMs.

This is how a lot of luxury tech works.