[boodi]

@Nago while you do not need to be sorry ( imo ) , the matter concerning the practices of speculation and a related late quite-unrationale 'explosive' escalation of prices in totl iems due to these practice , is a more subtle matter > and it involves rising pricings on same-tier iems , and encompass behavior of different market brands . While it is obvious the tech and material inside a iem is not the one into a Lambo , and that 8500$ is ridicolous and outrageous and irrational for an iem at current r&d , tech and materials levels ( so that your example really doesn't fit much in the picture : imo ) , the problem is that these " free marketing practices " can drag easily whole-market pricings up for same tier items , unless people take some distance from them publicly, like we are doing - so that some brands know that we are not all and only sheeps that follow, or cows to milk eventually and undefinitely and irrationally : until there's space for it

I am happy I can choose my brands , I am happy I am not choosing UM for my next purchases for some reasons; I am happy to share my feelings and reasons too ( that's not to find consensus ofc ) and I do not see anything wrong in doing it ..so

 

[buckster666]

I'd never be able to afford these new models, but am looking at the UM Mest MK3 as my 1st kilobuck set, if the tech used in flagship models filters down the line to the other models, that is certainly a positive.

 

[tommykrebs]

Couple years back I bought some Mest and till this day these are my endgame IEM's. I have some Hifiman Arya stealth too but I prefer the Mest. I have Apple Music and a Macbook Air and its a fantastic combo with the UM Mest. Way better than my Topping D90. The audio enhancement of Apple Music makes my Topping D90 obsolet.
It's the buyer's fault that the prices for IEM's are thru the roof. The moment the seller realize that somebody is not hesitant to spend 3000$ for an IEM, he knows he will probably spend 4500 too. Sorry to say, but you don't deserve better because you think there is always something newer+more expensive=better out there which will give you the next "kick".
I hear the Chinese laughing and opening the Champagne bottles.

If my Mest get stolen, I will buy another set. Probably used and cheap because they are "old". Old but very good.

 

[vikinguy]

I wonder how many sets they’ll actually sell. Be interesting to know the real numbers.

 

[ahossam]

Just by looking this thread on the front page I knew its gonna be ridiculously priced. UM always priced their flagship with insane price tag.

 

[F700]

UM is free to price their products as they see fit. We can debate if it makes sense from a new or long lasting customers perspective, but if someone is unhappy with their price and release rhythm policy, then this person is free to sell or keep their UM IEMs, and ultimately not being a customer anymore. I am not an UM customer, but it's a free market at play here.

 

[Hanesu]

Isn’t the real problem that people think every release from UM is a flagship? Mason is their flagship line. There hasn’t been a new Mason since 2021.

There are a ton of people calling MM a flagship IEM, possibly due to the price — but it was never a flagship. Neither is MEST.

UM has multiple tiers ranging from now $8500 down to like $600. They release new models constantly because of how many tiers they maintain. I don’t see this as a bad thing, as we have seen consistent flow of new technology from the top to the bottom.

Those of us who can afford this $8500 absurd IEM now are basically subsidizing the R&D cost of the new tech for its future inclusion in future IEMs.

This is how a lot of luxury tech works.

So how about, instead of losing our minds about the newest & most outrageous 8k IEM, we ask ourselfs: "Why exactly are we even paying attention to a market that isnt meant for most of us?". Even if that means that we have to give up on being able to afford the most expensive IEM our there. In the end this is fairly easy task when it comes to cars, isnt it? Nobody complains about the price tag of a Lambo and nobody loses their mind because they cant afford to buy one.

To me, as someone who is in the hobby for more than 20 years, the big question is, what does the term "flagship" stand for in these days? It used to be a term for the attempt of our beloved IEM companies, to create the best sound possible. Of course those attempts had always been connected to higher prices, but only a few years ago, the "flagships" were at least still in reach for many of us passionate enthusiasts.Now, they are clearly out of reach for 99% of us here in this forum. And for sure that is not a good development for the 99% of us, right (who mainly care about good sound)? Of course one could argue that recently it is still possible to get really good sound for a fraction of the price - but again, what is a "flagship" then, in our days? It has turned into a pure status product that "also" sounds the best. And this is what I meant by that our hobby has turned into a market place for Louis Vuitton bags.

 

[boodi]

..

Sure..and as much as they are entitled to adverise their product and their 'fit' price (cit....)here , we are entitled to comment here about it ( that their last price , appearing fit to them and to you , might appear ridicolous or hyperinflated and speculative ....yes we can write it and debate or confront and reason about it )

 

[Mcleenx]

Well, this is one of the remarkable aspects of head-fi. We have the opportunity to engage in discussions about prices, construction quality, and, naturally, sound quality within this forum. Furthermore, we can make comparisons between UM and other brands.

I appreciate all the exceptional members who generously contribute their time, share valuable experiences and opinions, and assist others!

 

[emdeevee]

The one thing that bugs me is when people comment along the lines of ”just don’t buy it”. Or “people who complain about this IEM were never in the market to buy it in the first place”. It misses the point. I will happily admit I’m not in the market for these IEM’s. But they are still relevant to me and my interest in the hobby. If UM release an $8,500 IEM does that mean that other brands will lift the pricing of their next TOTL IEM from $4,000 to $6,000? If UM succeeds then yes they probably will! It’s the contagion effect on the whole market. Those $2k IEM’s will become $2.5k-3k. Trickle down doesn’t always work…. Those hoping that the new Mest will benefit from this new tech are being a little naive. The new Mest will surely go up in price too. I’ve seen very similar things happen with road bikes. TOTL road bikes now go for $15k+ and an entry level bike is now $3k+ (not $1k). Everything goes up. Fortunately the bike industry is getting its comeuppance and is now in a fair bit of trouble after the price-gouging during COVID...

All power to those that can afford/justify the expenditure. But rightly or wrongly their willingness to pay these big prices does damage the rest of the market and creates a lot of division in the hobby.

I don’t post often and usually look the other way about matters like this. But it does concern me where the hobby is going. Most people choose heaphones/IEM’s precisely because they offer much better value than 2 channel. But that value is diminishing rapidly.

Let’s hope that other brands like FIR and Campfire see things differently.

That last sentence really says it all (though there are plenty more brands to throw into that mix). And they do...the new, amazing Bonneville at 1300 and even the Fir flagship, Xe6, is "only" 3800.

Couple years back I bought some Mest and till this day these are my endgame IEM's. I have some Hifiman Arya stealth too but I prefer the Mest. I have Apple Music and a Macbook Air and its a fantastic combo with the UM Mest. Way better than my Topping D90. The audio enhancement of Apple Music makes my Topping D90 obsolet.
It's the buyer's fault that the prices for IEM's are thru the roof. The moment the seller realize that somebody is not hesitant to spend 3000$ for an IEM, he knows he will probably spend 4500 too. Sorry to say, but you don't deserve better because you think there is always something newer+more expensive=better out there which will give you the next "kick".
I hear the Chinese laughing and opening the Champagne bottles.

If my Mest get stolen, I will buy another set. Probably used and cheap because they are "old". Old but very good.

And did your mest decline in sound quality after this announcement? My Indigo still sounds the same.

UM is free to price their products as they see fit. We can debate if it makes sense from a new or long lasting customers perspective, but if someone is unhappy with their price and release rhythm policy, then this person is free to sell or keep their UM IEMs, and ultimately not being a customer anymore. I am not an UM customer, but it's a free market at play here.

To some extent, it's much ado about nothing. If memory serves, this new Mason is 500 more than the last one. At the TOTL, in this price range, that increase seems hardly shocking.

What would be shocking is if they dropped the flagship price, but is that really a viable thing? Probably not. A 2 year interval with a 500 increase from 8000 does not raise an eyebrow that wasn't already lifted long ago.

 

[jupiterianvibe]

I have lost the ability to afford flagships a long long time ago and for me, UM has always seemed to be greedy by stepping up their prices with each new iteration.

In good old times of fair marketing and pricings, brands had a fixed flagship price and each new flagship would come with that price, while the older models' prices would drop a bit. Then the hobby boomed with lots of newcomers and in south east Asia, boutique manufacturers appeared with crazy prices. Soon after other brands around the world saw the opportunity and started price gouging.

There are a lot of people in this hobby because it is not possible for them to get into stereo due to price level. Now we are also losing head-fi while hi-fi had never been in our range.

 

[phiemon]

That last sentence really says it all (though there are plenty more brands to throw into that mix). And they do...the new, amazing Bonneville at 1300 and even the Fir flagship, Xe6, is "only" 3800.

Or Rn6 for even less. Then at least we still have Anni 2023, Canpur CB622B etc.

To some extent, it's much ado about nothing. If memory serves, this new Mason is 500 more than the last one. At the TOTL, in this price range, that increase seems hardly shocking.
What would be shocking is if they dropped the flagship price, but is that really a viable thing? Probably not. A 2 year interval with a 500 increase from 8000 does not raise an eyebrow that wasn't already lifted long ago.

The new Mason costs 2500 USD more: 5999 USD vs 8499 USD. Is that 42% more? EDIT: Yep, it seems so, I'll let you comment on that …

 

[boodi]

To me, as someone who is in the hobby for more than 20 years, the big question is, what does the term "flagship" stand for in these days? It used to be a term for the attempt of our beloved IEM companies, to create the best sound possible. Of course those attempts had always been connected to higher prices, but only a few years ago, the "flagships" were at least still in reach for many of us passionate enthusiasts.Now, they are clearly out of reach for 99% of us here in this forum. And for sure that is not a good development for the 99% of us, right (who mainly care about good sound)? Of course one could argue that recently it is still possible to get really good sound for a fraction of the price - but again, what is a "flagship" then, in our days? It has turned into a pure status product that "also" sounds the best. And this is what I meant by that our hobby has turned into a market place for Louis Vuitton bags.

( I agree ⬆ ) I don't have much against colour choice materials and aesthetics . I would have thought of pure wood and that minimal would have been way more classy for a flagship product , and a worst name choice myspelling french by this brand that I couldn't imagine , but they needed and urged the 2 variants so.. you are right in exposing that the whole marketing process of these objects names included is aimed at boutique clients or the ones which are buying new toys at a compulsory rate , or are obsessed by them or to own them .

While I can talk about it , it is not a problem or my problem ; the problem becomes mine when an item that I could buy before takes a flight to the moon in price , in a matter of opportunity / over a short time, as for following the trend of a brand becoming compulsory too : if releasing 'new totl flagships' every 6 months ; one could definitely wonder about these kilobucks-worth stellar sound improvements piling on literally like miracles in matter of months , while completely uninterested in an hyper luxury market outrageously dispendious and aimed at boutique segment , see that the phenomenon of hyperinflation escalates or widen and goes more mainstream , or many brands bite the bullet , or fast enough my everyday good water now costs 2 3 or 5 times more ,
see now that compulsory behavior or market trend has become bad for me too

 

[Tiax]

If UM release an $8,500 IEM does that mean that other brands will lift the pricing of their next TOTL IEM from $4,000 to $6,000? If UM succeeds then yes they probably will! It’s the contagion effect on the whole market. Those $2k IEM’s will become $2.5k-3k. Trickle down doesn’t always work

Maybe i'm still missing a point, but i don't see how more overpriced flagships affect me.
Every price range is getting more competitive, we have so many more choices now comparing to 5-10-15 years ago. Some people with deep pockets will spend even more on their new toys? Don't care, good for them, but i'll stay with what i can actually afford.
Some company will move into the luxury segment completely? Whatever, another one will come and take their place.

 

[aaf evo]

The new Mason costs 2500 USD more: 5999 USD vs 8499 USD. Is that 42% more? EDIT: Yep, it seems so, I'll let you comment on that …

Nope, the last Mason iteration was the Le Jardin in 2022 and it was $7,999.