ENIGMAcoustics Dharma
Mar 31, 2015 at 5:01 PM Post #271 of 1,237

Soundsgoodtome

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Regarding the Ether, I think it's an upgrade if you're looking for as reference of a sound as you can get.  The HE-560, to me, is on the bright side of neutral (which I like about it).  The LCD-2 or PM-1/2 are both on the warm side of neutral.  The Ether is smack dab on the line.  It's comfy, looks good, sounds great, etc.  But do I *want* a super neutral headphone?  I don't know... I'd love to try it on my home setup to see.
 
Regarding the Dharma, it's a bit of a tougher question.  The trebles are an obvious upgrade.  The bass... is less obvious.  Frankly, I've had 3 planars in a row now and I much prefer planar bass to dynamic bass.  To me, the bass of the Dharma is its biggest weak spot; on certain songs the bass just doesn't keep up with the treble.  
 
That said, the Dharma I heard was still very much a pre-production model.  It had some major issues with the build and fit, but they wanted to have something to demo so they brought it anyways.  I'm sure they'll get that stuff fixed and I'm optimistic that they'll try to nail down the tuning a bit better.  Before I decide whether I'm going to upgrade the HE-560, I'd really need to hear the final revision, probably with an extended demo so I can let brain burn-in correct for the non-planar bass.  They did express interest in a potential loaner program when I mentioned it, so it's not such a far-fetched idea.
 
Hope this helps...

It does! It seems that the price of the HE560 still makes it a very a formidable headphone when comparing. I like the bang-for-buck sorts of buys and the 560 seems to be that headphone. Although I've yet to see what the Dharma phones are going to be in price.

The Dharma's bass being a dynamic driver does seem off-putting when coupling with with something like an Estat, it would seem the sound to be too far apart/disconnected? I think if they tightened the bass down to control and impact they'd have something in their hands. Ti or Alu on the dynamic driver with maybe a smaller diameter might be the trick. *hint Dharma folks

@Stillhart I see you have the HD650 as well, would you say the Dharma bass would be the same in terms of control/sound as an HD650 on a powerful amp is or an HD650 under driven with sloppy bass or perhaps in between?
 
Mar 31, 2015 at 5:23 PM Post #272 of 1,237

grizzlybeast

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lol that seems to be what I seek after the most lol a solid bass response. I guess I make that obvious in every post. 
 
The he560 has amazing bass. So solid, firm, and fast that I can put up with its balance and still enjoy it with a little eq. The only thing is that what I have learned is when you try to eq bass that isn't super tight and dense it becomes a mess really fast.
 
The lcd 3f, sony z7, and others don't do as well with bass boost but the he560, zmf blackwood, lcd-x, he-6, th600, and others do great. The ideal scenario for a headphone with bass like you describe this one is that it is already boosted and has plenty of impact already even if it is a bit wooly, that way you can eq it down which is easier than eqing it up. If the bass is super solid already it can afford to be shy and im okay with it just not to much less than the he560 if at all.
 
Thanks for the response. @Stillhart 
 
Mar 31, 2015 at 6:17 PM Post #273 of 1,237

Stillhart

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  It does! It seems that the price of the HE560 still makes it a very a formidable headphone when comparing. I like the bang-for-buck sorts of buys and the 560 seems to be that headphone. Although I've yet to see what the Dharma phones are going to be in price.

The Dharma's bass being a dynamic driver does seem off-putting when coupling with with something like an Estat, it would seem the sound to be too far apart/disconnected? I think if they tightened the bass down to control and impact they'd have something in their hands. Ti or Alu on the dynamic driver with maybe a smaller diameter might be the trick. *hint Dharma folks

@Stillhart I see you have the HD650 as well, would you say the Dharma bass would be the same in terms of control/sound as an HD650 on a powerful amp is or an HD650 under driven with sloppy bass or perhaps in between?

 
The price of the Dharma will be $1200, from what I understand.
 
Regarding the bass, it's not that there's a blending issue.  The issue, as I described it at one point, is that it sounds like a $2000 estat section with a $300 dynamic section.  It's just not at the same level of quality as the estat section and that can make it jarring on some songs.  But to be fair, my idea of quality bass is tight and controlled.  This is more boomy, though still decently detailed.  I feel like it'd be perfect if they could just tighten it up a bit, like what they did to the Fidelio X2 after the X1.
 
Regarding the HD650 comparison, I'm sorry it's been a while since I heard the HD650 (I sold my tube amp and I don't like the sound out of a SS.  However, I just bought a new tube amp so I'll get to listen to it again soon!).  From memory, I'd say it's probably similar to the HD650 bass where it tightens up nicely with a good amp but it's still thick.  But again, that's a $300-500 headphone that's not known for its bass detail.  Imagine that bass with the treble from the SR-009.  On a slower song, it'd be fine.  On a fast song, the bass just wouldn't be able to keep up while the tweeter doesn't blink an eye...
 
  lol that seems to be what I seek after the most lol a solid bass response. I guess I make that obvious in every post. 
 
The he560 has amazing bass. So solid, firm, and fast that I can put up with its balance and still enjoy it with a little eq. The only thing is that what I have learned is when you try to eq bass that isn't super tight and dense it becomes a mess really fast.
 
The lcd 3f, sony z7, and others don't do as well with bass boost but the he560, zmf blackwood, lcd-x, he-6, th600, and others do great. The ideal scenario for a headphone with bass like you describe this one is that it is already boosted and has plenty of impact already even if it is a bit wooly, that way you can eq it down which is easier than eqing it up. If the bass is super solid already it can afford to be shy and im okay with it just not to much less than the he560 if at all.
 
Thanks for the response. @Stillhart 

Interesting.  I am not a bass head so I don't know that I can judge your tastes correctly, but my initial thought on them is that I bet bassheads would like it -- mostly because it gives that big bass while still having the rest of the sound be amazing.  It's the best of both worlds for a bass-head.  For a non-basshead, it may be a little much.
 
Apr 1, 2015 at 12:53 AM Post #274 of 1,237

chowmein83

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The price of the Dharma will be $1200, from what I understand.
 
Regarding the bass, it's not that there's a blending issue.  The issue, as I described it at one point, is that it sounds like a $2000 estat section with a $300 dynamic section.  It's just not at the same level of quality as the estat section and that can make it jarring on some songs.  But to be fair, my idea of quality bass is tight and controlled.  This is more boomy, though still decently detailed.  I feel like it'd be perfect if they could just tighten it up a bit, like what they did to the Fidelio X2 after the X1.

 
This. Exactly this. In my opinion, it's mostly the bass that's preventing this headphone from becoming truly great.
 
Apr 1, 2015 at 9:38 AM Post #275 of 1,237

Oregonian

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  lol that seems to be what I seek after the most lol a solid bass response. I guess I make that obvious in every post. 
 
The he560 has amazing bass. So solid, firm, and fast that I can put up with its balance and still enjoy it with a little eq. The only thing is that what I have learned is when you try to eq bass that isn't super tight and dense it becomes a mess really fast.
 
The lcd 3f, sony z7, and others don't do as well with bass boost but the he560, zmf blackwood, lcd-x, he-6, th600, and others do great. The ideal scenario for a headphone with bass like you describe this one is that it is already boosted and has plenty of impact already even if it is a bit wooly, that way you can eq it down which is easier than eqing it up. If the bass is super solid already it can afford to be shy and im okay with it just not to much less than the he560 if at all.
 
Thanks for the response. @Stillhart 


Griz and I are not only fellow Oregonians but like much the same signature.  Bassheads in recovery or something like that............
 
Tho a HE-6 isn't considered a basshead phone, it has the best bass ever to me.  Had it side by side with a HE-560 and it curb stomped it on my Pioneer Spec system.  The Dharma sounds like it could be a great combo for a basshead as you said @Stillheart but is it better than a HE-6???? 
 
The Ether interests me if it can do HE-6 bass when fed right..............I want someone who has a vintage amp throw the loudness switch, eq up the bass, turn the tone controls up a notch or three and tell me what they sound like compared to an HE-6. 
 
All the headphone amp users in the forums and so few speaker amp users.................guys are missing out. 
 
Apr 1, 2015 at 10:07 AM Post #276 of 1,237

grizzlybeast

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^Bassphiles

From impressions it reads like it will have a bass similar to a JVC DX... But clearer everything else which is fine to me! I hope its that strong or at least that punchy. I doubt it will touch the 6 but that's just discerning what I read here.
 
Apr 3, 2015 at 11:32 PM Post #278 of 1,237

Stillhart

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  Are these open, semi open or closed cans?  How's isolation?

 
These are open.  Isolation is about what you'd expect from an open can.
 
Apr 7, 2015 at 2:58 AM Post #279 of 1,237

kid vic

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The price of the Dharma will be $1200, from what I understand.
 
Regarding the bass, it's not that there's a blending issue.  The issue, as I described it at one point, is that it sounds like a $2000 estat section with a $300 dynamic section.  It's just not at the same level of quality as the estat section and that can make it jarring on some songs.  But to be fair, my idea of quality bass is tight and controlled.  This is more boomy, though still decently detailed.  I feel like it'd be perfect if they could just tighten it up a bit, like what they did to the Fidelio X2 after the X1.
 

 
 
I wonder how close it will be to the AKG K340's? it could be a worthwhile upgrade.
 
Apr 7, 2015 at 3:18 AM Post #280 of 1,237

No_One411

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I wonder how close it will be to the AKG K340's? it could be a worthwhile upgrade.

So, the phase coherency is much better than the K340s, with some minor things they still need to tweak, mostly due to the crossover design. 
 
The reps received quite a bit of feedback from CanJam, and I'm hopeful that they'll be able to sift through all the feedback and adjust accordingly. 
 
It is priced at a much higher point than the K340 of old, but better comfort, a modern design (detachable cables, construction, etc) make it for a great option. 
 
Apr 7, 2015 at 3:33 AM Post #281 of 1,237

remilio

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K340? Really? It needs to be compared to something like HD800s not to vintage mediocre sfuff. I don't care about the design, the result is what really matters IMO.
 
Apr 7, 2015 at 3:36 AM Post #282 of 1,237

No_One411

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  K340? Really? It needs to be compared to something like HD800s not to vintage mediocre sfuff. I don't care about the design, the result is what really matters IMO.

Well, the K340 comparison comes from the fact that they use similar technologies, dynamic driver + electrostat hybrid...
 
Logically, people are itching to see if the tech has improved since then...
 
Apr 7, 2015 at 3:59 AM Post #283 of 1,237

remilio

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  Well, the K340 comparison comes from the fact that they use similar technologies, dynamic driver + electrostat hybrid...
 
Logically, people are itching to see if the tech has improved since then...


Yes, I understand that, but the main question is still "should I upgrade to it from X headphones"? :)
 
Apr 7, 2015 at 12:51 PM Post #284 of 1,237

No_One411

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Yes, I understand that, but the main question is still "should I upgrade to it from X headphones"? :)

?
 
And it certainly is a valid question with regards to the K340. It's just that you'd certainly expect it to be a worthwhile upgrade from the K340, what with the additional cost and modern update. 
 
I agree that it's main competitors will be coming from LCD-2, HD800, Ether, etc, but that doesn't detract from the original question comparing it to the K340...
 
Apr 7, 2015 at 1:29 PM Post #285 of 1,237

Tiddlesworth

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I'm personally excited for this, may be my first venture to TOTL headphones, really exciting time for high end stuff. Hopefully some reviews soon.
 

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