[leeperry]

I guess the showstoppers on the 0404USB are:
-it only uses NE5532 op-amps
-the ASIO drivers are very poorly written and need to reselected in foobar after each reboot
-the fixed samplerate in the drivers, meaning that bit-perfect is not quite "automatic"
-apparently when you use it w/o a computer, it's stuck on 48KHz on the digital input each time you turn it on...you have to plug it to a computer to set it to 44.1? that's a bummer

 

[infinitesymphony]

Quote:

Originally Posted by leeperry /img/forum/go_quote.gif I guess the showstoppers on the 0404USB are: -it only uses NE5532 op-amps

So do the Benchmark DAC1 / DAC1 USB... Depending on the implementation, they're not necessarily deal-breakers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by leeperry -the ASIO drivers are very poorly written and need to reselected in foobar after each reboot

It was my understanding that this was a combination of the Foobar developers not caring to fix this quirk and the fact that when the audio interface is turned off, it appears not to exist in Windows. E-MU did this so that Windows will automatically default to the next working sound card.

Quote:

Originally Posted by leeperry -the fixed samplerate in the drivers, meaning that bit-perfect is not quite "automatic"

Not sure what you mean... Sample rate is automatically selected via ASIO, or can be selected manually when no sound is playing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by leeperry -apparently when you use it w/o a computer, it's stuck on 48KHz on the digital input each time you turn it on...you have to plug it to a computer to set it to 44.1? that's a bummer

No... From E-MU's site: "The 176.4 kHz and 192 kHz samples rates are no longer stored on power-off. Now, the system defaults to 44.1 kHz." My guess is that this is to prevent accidental upsampling. If you send it a digital signal, it will automatically change the sample rate, it just won't be set to a high-res rate right at power-on. The other question is, how often will the device see unencrypted 176.4 kHz or 192 kHz digital signals via coaxial/optical? Probably not often.

 

[leeperry]

I think that's because ASIO drivers are supposed to be virtual, and E-Mu didn't bother making them this way...or fix it..and the foobar guys don't care to fix it either, still at this point you have to reselect it in the foobar ASIO config(a bunch of clicks) after each reboot?! geeez

oh ok, it's bit-matched on ASIO..cool!

well, I read some ppl complaining that the default hardware samplerate is never remembered...and apparently the default was 48KHz?! at least it's 44.1 so it ain't so bad

still the ASIO hiccup and the 5532 are a no-go for me

plus there's no KS drivers, so no bit-perfect Reclock on XP..

 

[Elfenau]

You can only learn so much from reviews and recommendations, because each person only has experience with a limited set of gear. This is made worse by the "flavor of the month" effect, where an item gets a strong recommendation leading a large number of new head-fi members (who have nothing comparable in their experience) to buy it, and of course they all love it, and then they recommend it at every opportunity. But those recommendations only really carry the weight of a satisfied customer, not the weight of an expert in the field. So they are little better than reading reviews at amazon.com or whatever. Trying to piece together those reviews and make a definitive list of what is "the best" is beyond impossible.

That said, the EMU line has been a flavor of the month for several years now, so the ratio of happy customers must be pretty high.[/QUOTE

Very well said. Notheless people seek for info regardless in many cases. Info

 

[Shadorne]

Quote:

Originally Posted by edba2000 /img/forum/go_quote.gif This matter is getting very confusing. Some people say the EMU 0404 USB is the best (even better than the Benchmark DAC1!!), another say Prelude 7.1 is the best, others are saying DIY Monica DAC is also the best!, and so on... I know that the people ears are all different, but.. It would be nice to have a Thread with sound cards (internal and external - price/quality) votes. Thanks in advance to all.

I have both.

I use the EMU 0404 USB occasionally to generate test tones/sweeps and record and power a measurement microphone - it is an excellent product good value and does what it does well.

However, I use the Benchmark DAC1 daily to listen to music via ATC 100's.

Enough said.

 

[maarek99]

I just tested the Emu 0404 USB and the Essense STX. Hmm. I believe the Emu 0404 USB has better and more true to the original sound. I tested the Essence with both the original stock opamps and LM4562 opamps in the I/V conversion stages using the hd650.

 

[leeperry]

Quote:

Originally Posted by maarek99 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I just tested the Emu 0404 USB and the Essence STX. Hmm. I believe the Emu 0404 USB has better and more true to the original sound.

I honestly think that the AK4396 sounds better than the PCM1792...especially when the latter doesn't have its oversampling forced to 128X(default is 64X on the PCM1792 and 128X on the AK4396).

also, the caps of the STX are known to be very harsh and "digital"-sounding to death.

 

[ROBSCIX]

Are you trying to convince us or yourself?

 

[Graphicism]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadorne /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have both. I use the EMU 0404 USB occasionally to generate test tones/sweeps and record and power a measurement microphone - it is an excellent product good value and does what it does well. However, I use the Benchmark DAC1 daily to listen to music via ATC 100's. Enough said.

Is there a noticeable difference, do you also use an amp?

 

[Shadorne]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graphicism /img/forum/go_quote.gif Is there a noticeable difference, do you also use an amp?

ATC's are Active no need for power amp. I use a AVM 20 preamp DSP that has AKM 4396's A to D's for movies and it works great, tons of functionality but I suspect it is a little jittery as the DAC1 sounds just that wee bit better and cleaner.

The EMU is mainly for calibrations for overall in room response (acoustic treatments and all ) as well as of each individual speaker. Honestly I have not made a serious effort to compare EMU to the DAC1 but frankly the specs on the DAC1 are so solid for the price that it just makes no sense for me to experiment that way. (Doug Sax really liked the Benchmark DAC1 - what more can I say - he has famous golden ears which are relied upon by most of the global music industry - a large portion of the high quality stuff out there was mastered by him)

 

[Graphicism]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadorne /img/forum/go_quote.gif ATC's are Active no need for power amp. I use a AVM 20 preamp DSP that has AKM 4396's A to D's for movies and it works great, tons of functionality but I suspect it is a little jittery as the DAC1 sounds just that wee bit better and cleaner. The EMU is mainly for calibrations for overall in room response (acoustic treatments and all ) as well as of each individual speaker. Honestly I have not made a serious effort to compare EMU to the DAC1 but frankly the specs on the DAC1 are so solid for the price that it just makes no sense for me to experiment that way. (Doug Sax really liked the Benchmark DAC1 - what more can I say - he has famous golden ears which are relied upon by most of the global music industry - a large portion of the high quality stuff out there was mastered by him)

Putting Doug Sax and his famous golden ears aside for a second would you/could you setup a blind A/B between the EMU and DAC1 and see if you can differentiate the two and find a clear winner. No matter the outcome I would be extremely interested to hear your results, you say there is little sense in experimenting but we are talking about a $150 source vs a $1,000 one.

 

[LingLing1337]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graphicism /img/forum/go_quote.gif Putting Doug Sax and his famous golden ears aside for a second would you/could you setup a blind A/B between the EMU and DAC1 and see if you can differentiate the two and find a clear winner. No matter the outcome I would be extremely interested to hear your results, you say there is little sense in experimenting but we are talking about a $150 source vs a $1,000 one.

+1, let's hear it. Or are you afraid to find out the results for yourself, Shadorne?

 

[magma79]

i have a question which may see duhh to some
hoping for confirmation

if i will be using an external amp would their be any difference in the DAC of an emu 404 usb and an emu 404 PCI?

i ask since there is almost an 85$ price difference between the 2 versions
i plan to use PC as source and an external int amplifier to power studio monitors

would the PCI version make more sense /?

 

[Shadorne]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graphicism /img/forum/go_quote.gif Putting Doug Sax and his famous golden ears aside for a second would you/could you setup a blind A/B between the EMU and DAC1 and see if you can differentiate the two and find a clear winner. No matter the outcome I would be extremely interested to hear your results, you say there is little sense in experimenting but we are talking about a $150 source vs a $1,000 one.

I'll think about it - if I can find a way to do it accurately I will. I guess the EMU will need to be driven by a USB iTunes lossless track (burned from a CD) and fed to the speakers while the same audio track is played simultaneously from the CD on a CD player feeding optical to the DAC1 (I don't have the USB version). I'll need to figure out a way to get things synced, level matched and the switching remotely, as A/B comparisons that require getting up and changing something are too much for my sonic memory.

What I mean is this: I know that the performance should be fairly close. (My experience, even in the jittery word of digital audio, is that many good quality sources are quite close in sound quality - especially stuff built in the last 5 to ten years - I'll admit it ain't night and day stuff, for the most part)

Alternatively does the EMU have optical out

- I guess I could feed that to the DAC1 if it does....that might be a simpler and less complex way to run the test and allow the track to stay pretty much in sync and use my relays in my dsp along with a remote to switch from the comfy chair.

 

[Graphicism]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shadorne /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'll think about it - if I can find a way to do it accurately I will. I guess the EMU will need to be driven by a USB iTunes lossless track (burned from a CD) and fed to the speakers while the same audio track is played simultaneously from the CD on a CD player feeding optical to the DAC1 (I don't have the USB version). I'll need to figure out a way to get things synced, level matched and the switching remotely, as A/B comparisons that require getting up and changing something are too much for my sonic memory.

It shouldn't be hard at all to have a lossless album playing in sync on both the computer and CD player, even a few seconds apart would be perfectly fine for the test. Simply plug in the headphone to the DAC1, listen for say 30 seconds, unplug and plug into the EMU and listen for another 30 seconds. If you can take it one step further, have someone blindfold you and have them do the changes for you.

Make sure to repeat the test about 10 times, this way if you pick different DACs as favorites the result is there is no difference.

Also main thing to look out for is that they are both matched in volume.