[Strangelove424]

^ DOP means DSD over PCM which is essentially DSD vs PCM debate

Ah, this debate again. I've never heard a difference personally. I will only spend the extra cost for an SACD if I have to, usually because it's the only multi channel version. And even then, I'd much rather have DVD or BD format just for the compatibility. I have zero qualms about reencoding to PCM.

 

[old tech]

Whichever used the best mastering of that album.

 

[pinnahertz]

Ah, this debate again. I've never heard a difference personally. I will only spend the extra cost for an SACD if I have to, usually because it's the only multi channel version. And even then, I'd much rather have DVD or BD format just for the compatibility. I have zero qualms about reencoding to PCM.

I hear a difference if the SACD is in multichannel format. Big difference.

 

[71 dB]

DSD and PCM represent the same information in different forms. If you integrate DSD you get PCM and if you differentiate PCM you get DSD. In the digital world it doesn't matter in which form you have the information, it's all there. However, going from analog to digital or digital to analog is different for DSD and PCM. That's where the difference is I believe.

 

[TYATYA]

I hear a difference if the SACD is in multichannel format. Big difference.

How many chanels of PCM piece in your comparision? It is fair if that's a multi channel WAV

 

[castleofargh]

How many chanels of PCM piece in your comparision? It is fair if that's a multi channel WAV

my crystal ball tells me it was sarcasm. saying that multi channel vs stereo makes a difference, not SACD. but I get how that could be read differently.

 

[pinnahertz]

How many chanels of PCM piece in your comparision? It is fair if that's a multi channel WAV

2.0

 

[pinnahertz]

my crystal ball tells me it was sarcasm. saying that multi channel vs stereo makes a difference, not SACD. but I get how that could be read differently.

 

[pinnahertz]

DSD and PCM represent the same information in different forms. If you integrate DSD you get PCM and if you differentiate PCM you get DSD. In the digital world it doesn't matter in which form you have the information, it's all there. However, going from analog to digital or digital to analog is different for DSD and PCM. That's where the difference is I believe.

I believe the actual differences are highlighted here.

 

[endgame]

I believe the actual differences are highlighted here.

Nice article but it still doesn't answer what is YOUR preference, if any. I believe there's more to sound than just measurements. I'm interested in people's opinions.

 

[castleofargh]

Nice article but it still doesn't answer what is YOUR preference, if any. I believe there's more to sound than just measurements. I'm interested in people's opinions.

no there isn't!!!!! ^_^
but there is indeed more to impressions and preferences than just measurements.

 

[endgame]

no there isn't!!!!! ^_^
but there is indeed more to impressions and preferences than just measurements.

I disagree. I can clearly hear a difference when I select PCM vs DOP in my music. But I can't really say that one is better. They just sound different to me. So I want to know what others think.

 

[pinnahertz]

I disagree. I can clearly hear a difference when I select PCM vs DOP in my music. But I can't really say that one is better. They just sound different to me. So I want to know what others think.

So....ignoring the rather major differences in mastering then?

Until you can make a direct ABX comparison between DOP and PCM made from the same master, opinion must encompass mastering which of course has massive potential for clearly audible differences (swamping any codec differences). Otherwise, all you're comparing and stating preference for is a particular product.

 

[bigshot]

I disagree. I can clearly hear a difference when I select PCM vs DOP in my music. But I can't really say that one is better. They just sound different to me. So I want to know what others think.

I thought that too when I first got my SACD player. But I found out that the redbook layer on SACDs is often a completely different mastering as the one on the DSD layer. Also, when I finally found discs with two identical masterings, the two layers were at different volume levels making the DSD sound better when it was actually just a little bit louder. I found this out once I took the time to set up an ABX comparison. Try that. You'll probably find the same thing.

Nice article but it still doesn't answer what is YOUR preference, if any. I believe there's more to sound than just measurements. I'm interested in people's opinions.

I agree. Measurements that extend beyond my ability to hear don't mean a whole heck of a lot to me. I care about what I can actually hear. Thankfully, that makes life very easy for me because just about any format is perfect... CD, SACD, MP3, AAC... As long as a codec is capable of achieving auditory transparency, it's the same as any other codec to me and my ears.

 

[castleofargh]

I disagree. I can clearly hear a difference when I select PCM vs DOP in my music. But I can't really say that one is better. They just sound different to me. So I want to know what others think.

have you measured the output? the way you present this, it seems like you know there is no measurable difference. but so far we've all been talking about the format being able to contain the same information. doesn't mean it always does. mastering as suggested is one obvious potential cause for difference, but there is no doubt that it's measurable.